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Hi everyone To provide a deeper context to my previous posts about the Stachen Microclimate, I have compiled a comprehensive global comparison. This data covers the period from 2014 to 2025 and pits my 425m (1,394 ft) enclave against some of the most famous palm-growing regions and maritime hubs in the Northern Hemisphere. Scientific Integrity: To ensure the highest accuracy, I have applied a conservative -0.3K safety adjustment to my annual means. This accounts for potential "heat spikes" in my solar-ventilated Bresser station during late afternoon periods when the solar fan might deactivate while the sun is still low. List (2014–2025): Location Elevation Annual Mean Absolute Minimum Santa Barbara (USA) 4 m 15.5 °C -1.0 °C Washington D.C. (USA) 5 m 15.4 °C -14.0 °C Bologna (IT) 37 m 15.0 °C -8.0 °C Venice Lido (IT) 4 m 14.7 °C -7.0 °C Verona (IT) 68 m 14.5 °C -10.0 °C Milan Malpensa (IT) 234 m 13.8 °C -11.0 °C Lyon (FR) 201 m 13.8 °C -10.0 °C Lugano (CH) 273 m 13.7 °C -6.0 °C Magadino (CH) 203 m 12.6 °C -9.0 °C STACHEN (CH) 425 m 12.5 °C* -11.0 °C Seattle (USA) 6 m 12.2 °C -10.0 °C London Heathrow (UK) 25 m 12.1 °C -7.0 °C Brest (FR) 99 m 12.1 °C -7.0 °C Kehelland (Cornwall) 87 m 11.6 °C -5.1 °C Constance (GER) 428 m 11.0 °C -11.1 °C *Adjusted by -0.3K safety margin. Key Observations: Elevation Efficiency: Despite being located 400m+ higher than London, Seattle, or Brest, Stachen outperforms them in annual mean temperature. This highlights the power of our local "Heat-Engine" and the Cfa (Humid Subtropical) characteristics. The "Milan Pattern": Our absolute minimum of -11.0 °C is identical to Milan-Malpensa. We share the same winter resilience and summer heat-sum as the northern Po Valley, but at nearly double the elevation. Regional Anomaly: The 1.5°C gap between Stachen and the regional reference in Constance (same elevation) confirms that our "Solar-Trap" setup and hedge-protection are creating a unique climatic island. Whether you are growing Trachycarpus, Jubaea, or even testing Strelitzia (which successfully overwintered here!), these numbers show that microclimate is often more decisive than latitude. Best regards Mazat

Has anyone tried crossing the 2 varieties of Bizzies?

After chugging along since 2018, one of my Torallyi kicked the bucket over the winter/spring this year in Northern California. A very unremarkable 9B winter - not very cold, some nice periods of rain, and everything else in the yard came through nicely, including two other Torallyi. Marked the dried out/bleached out center spear two months ago and it hadn't moved a bit. Have always stressed about my Torallyi randomly dying a la DOOMSDAVE's massive Torallyi. Surprise, it died. Had it removed today and wanted to ask the collective - Put down a JxS into the hole immediately? Or give it some time? No real signs of disease that I could see - tree guy didn't have any ideas either. He did say that whatever I planted there probably wouldn't grow all that well - being boxed in by the driveway/fence/old roots. -E

I'd plant the JxS immediately if you have one available. Perfect time of year to get one permanently established. Very hardy, trouble free cross, with an upright growth habit. I have 2 growing like weeds in Arizona. 🌴 aztropic Mesa, Arizona

@Mazat This is the St James's park data London. There are slightly warmer areas/microclimates, for example here but this is London's mildest official station. 12.7c average.

Three of the best for any palm garden, a must have trio. Oraniopsis appendiculata archontophoenix purpurea lacospadix Australis clumping form

All these responses are so helpful, Im grateful for the help. I knew they would get tall, I had no idea they were going to have such large trunks. Those really are massive.....I am looking around my yard to see where else they might thrive. Once I have done that, then I can consider what kind of Palm to put there in the front of the house. I would like a nice palm or 2 there for a pretty focal point in between the shudders, but ...now I know to find a much smaller breed. Im learning so much already.

Well well well.

Depends... If you've ever spent time within in a Bosque, you'd know natives, like Mesquite, Palo Verde, Ironwood definitely don't do what trees like Pittosporum, Eucs / Melaleuca etc. from Aus, many Ficus, African Sumac, and Schinus sps can do. Nor deposit competing vegetation - reducing compounds beneath them. None of those trees should be planted here anyway.. In fact, Mesquite, ...those that occur on this side of the EQ at least, < S. AM. sps tend to be shallow rooted > actually provide moisture to stuff growing under / near them during drier periods by pulling it up to the surface from 60 -200ft below the surface. Green " islands " created under Mesquite bosques were one way early settlers would locate water. Roots of the monster 'squite at the old house have never bothered the walls it has been growing next to for ..-at least- 3 decades.. ..Since the block walls were installed in this neighborhood.. Specimen itself is much older. Trunk is less than 10 ft away from either... Only water it gets is when it rains enough to soak the ground under it, ..or whatever it pulls up from the water table below us. Only way it takes out the walls is if it falls.. Not by breaking them via roots. Only time " landscaping / gardening is a mine field, even sometimes, is when someone doesn't do their homework, and /or falls head over heels for con jobs / fluff - filled " advertising " .

A nice variegated rhapis planted beside the good old water tank!

Yep... It may be a beautiful tree in a park, away from any hardscape, walls, plumbing, plants or grass, but otherwise I'd stay away from them... Here is that same little tree now.. Ahh-gree 1,000% For the love of ...anything... NEVER plant a Bl**pin' Pepper tree.. " CA. " ...or it's really awful Brazilian cousin. Horrible, horrible trees ...like most Eucalyptus, Mastic, and African Sumac. Carrotwood is another " avoid at all costs " trash tree.

All dead. I gave up on foxtails because they have major issues with cold and long term cool weather. You are not alone; many people are going to lose palms after this past winter - I already have and expect to lose more. Hurricane Ian is still killing my palms nearly 4 years after it roared through.

What a privilege to visit Phil’s garden and wholesale nursery (Eumundi Palms) on the Sunshine Coast. It’s something I’ve been wanting to do since moving up to Queensland more than 3 years ago now!!!. The stand out for me was this incredible Cyrtostachys renda hybrid (C. renda x C. elegans). Hopefully one day it’ll produce viable seed, and there will be no shortage of customers for the resulting palms I’m sure, as they thrive in the sub-tropics.

I’ve sourced perfectly sized limestone grit from a quarry. For poor ventilation and insufficient natural light, I’ll use grow lights and oscillating fans to compensate. I’ll also add more limestone amendments to the soil to fix the moisture management issues.

A troop of Licuala grandis at Four Arts:

Thank you so much!@sonoranfans I’ve noticed many potted Cuban palms start turning yellow and hate standing water when their soil lacks limestone additives. Around 70% of Cuba’s geology is high‑calcium limestone bedrock. I’ll keep troubleshooting these indoor potting issues until I get it right—even if there are setbacks. I’ve already succeeded with two wax palm varieties: Copernicia baileyana and Copernicia hospita. Now the next, higher challenge for me is cultivating Copernicia fallaensis.

Growing palms indoors can work for some species, but I seriously doubt any cuban copernicias are going to be happy. They love sun and heat, I had some trouble keeping them healthy in pots even outside in part shade. Second they hate pots and you can overwater them if you are not very careful. The two you bought have gone into a serious decline and likely wont make it. If you are experimenting, I would use cheaper palms than C Fallaensis to develop your understanding of their needs. A Copernica Macroglossa might be a better choice to experiment as they are far cheaper. If you plan to grow indoors, you may need a powerful grow light, 600W or so. Google AI AI Overview Copernicia species, such as Copernicia alba (Caranday palm), are generally poor choices for long-term indoor cultivation because they thrive on intense, direct sun and high heat. While they can be kept in containers, they require very bright indoor light (south-facing window) and are rarely suitable for average indoor environments. [1, 2, 3, 4, 5] Key Considerations for Growing Copernicia Indoors Light: Needs maximum possible sunlight; full, direct sun is preferred, making a bright, sunny, southern-exposure window essential. Soil/Water: Thrives in well-drained, sandy soil; allow it to dry slightly between waterings, as they dislike sitting in wet soil, though they are drought-tolerant once established. Temperature/Humidity: High heat is preferred; they tolerate dry air, so low humidity is generally not an issue. Here is a thread on my smaller C fallaensis planted a couple years ago.

Yes , as @aztropic says , the Wodyetia let you know when they are not happy and usually never fully recover . Some palms can rebound very well but these are not forgiving , in my experience. The narrowing trunk near the crown is usually followed by smaller than usual fronds ….death sign. A healthy one is robust all the way up to the crown , only slightly tapering. Harry

Thanks aztropic! I’m going to try keeping them in their original pots and nurse them along. I’ve successfully acclimated a Bismarck palm before and even managed to dwarf its leaves, so that gives me a lot of confidence.

I was in Ireland for a work trip and took some time to visit the Botanical Gardens in Dublin. Plenty of Trachycarpus happily growing and even a Butia. The palm house from the 1860s is something else - it’s enormous and feels like you’re in a palm cathedral 😄 I was also in Cork and saw a couple Trachycarpus but didn’t manage to take any photos What other palms have you seen growing in Ireland?

A couple of good collecter palmscocothrinax eckmanii dypsis proceralicuala fordiana

Would love to hear everyone’s damage data so far. Really enjoyed Eric’s similar post for 2009-2010 freeze, so I hope to start another similar discussion for this past 2025 freeze. My location: Windermere. - Mature foxtails - no protection. Complete defoliation. All recovering, pushing green. No bleeding trunks. - Green Malayan dwarf - covered trunk and central spear with frost cloth, no heat. Complete defoliation. Recovering, two green fronds now. - Two double P elegans - no protection. Against house. 1 double trying to recover. 1 killed. - Triple christmas - covered with light cloth and tarp. No heat. Mild burn. Recovering well. - Bottle - wrapped with frost cloth, no heat. Complete defoliation. Recovering well with 2 new fronds now. - 3 royals R regia - no protection. Complete defoliation. Recovering well, 1-2 new fronds each currently.

https://seatemperature.info/darwin-water-temperature.html Current ocean temperature in Darwin Water temperature in Darwin today is 29.1°C. Based on our historical data over a period of ten years, the warmest water in this day in Darwin was recorded in 2022 and was 31°C, and the coldest was recorded in 2012 at 28.8°C. Sea water temperature in Darwin is expected to rise to 29.5°C in the next 10 days. May average water temperature in Darwin is 29.2°C, the minimum temperature is 26.3°C, and the maximum is 31°C.

Not the first one observed this year, ..but the brightest so far.. ChzA ( Circumhorizontal Arc ) Tough to see but flaring up under and to the far left of the 22deg Halo. Another flare up attempt. " Green Flash " flareup.. Mature phase w/ Full spectrum coloration. Fainter event about a week ago, ..but present if you look closely enough.. Quick hitter as a batch of Cirrus w/ the right crystal orientation passes through..

Recovery has been good so far, this fiji dwarf is on its way back with its second frond opening up with a 3rd spear behind it and some pics of what it previously looked like before this freeze.

Royal palm recovery on Orange Ave south of city. This is Belle Isle area but away from lake influence.

A couple of nice varieties of palms worthy of any collection! dypsis manajarensis iguanura bicornis took me a while to work out how to grow iguanura palms, but you can see I have learned how to grow them, with healthy leaves. Areca vestria dypsis saintamarieButia purperesis. I know you like them, might have to send this one down to sunny Melbourne. @tim_brissy_13

Throwing in this London Dactylifera as being the furthest north / furthest from the equator Dactylifera in the world at 51.4N latitude. It has been in situ there in Wimbledon for at least 6-7 years now and was planted as a tiny seedling. I doubt it has ever been protected there and it is actively growing quite considerably. Looks like it was planted as a small little palm in 2018 or 2019... It grew considerably within a year or so by 2020... Most recent shot about 10 months ago... Not surprised to see a dacty surviving and growing in London given all the CIDP's and also given that one or two have been posted in Paris at 48.5N latitude. However this is basically 3 degrees of latitude further north than any in Paris. I wouldn't be surprised if there are even further north ones in parts of London or the east coast of England where it is quite dry.

Visited the motherland this week. The smaller fruiting coconut is from a ditch that was collected by a lady in homestead Fl 5 years ago . receives no love from the owner . second the largest coconut that has managed to evade the 2021 Texas palm massacre lol over on port Isabel if anyone wants the exact address message me . across the same street I found a yard with 3-4 young cocos that looked really great the lady who lives there mentioned her husband collected all the cocos that washed ashore and they sprouted! other pics are of various parts of the valley for whatever reason palm talk won’t let me insert individual Info per pick so if yall have questions I’ll answer what I can haha . #Zone10A-BTexas IMG_9409.mov

B purpurescens Richard? I actually got 2 of my own to sprout after a couple of years sowing. Grateful to have them - thinking one for me and one for the botanic gardens once I grow them up.

Well, the sellers response about my weird Ensete is it's still growing and pushing leaves, and I'm like, yeah, so was the last one until it just died. So i was shocked to see these at the local "cash saver" grocery store/Ace Hardware. Hopefully I end up keeping both alive, because the plan has always been chop and prop.

Update almost a year later! They recovered beautifully. Hoping for another recovery after the freeze expected this weekend. Good luck to all bracing for the storm!! 🌴❤️

A few days late, but it's been 12 years since I pulled him out of the Montgomery County Animal Shelter in Conroe, TX (Houston urban sprawl for you non-Texans). This is from an early morning biscuit run, he gets the egg from Mom's biscuits and if the sweet old lady is working the drive thru he gets a piece of bacon, too. We had to listen to UGK in true Texan fashion.

Excited to finally see a flower on one of my P. torallyi. This one is 18 years old from germination.

Lovely! I happened to pass this six-in-a-row sidewalk planting in SF's Mission District last night.

Nice combo indeed! I planted lime/yellow dracanea near my purpurea to bring out the yellow color. The purple is obvious... but there's a lot of yellow too (including on the lower side of the fronds), which is fun to highlight.

Last but certainly not least, Metroxylon warburgii. Phil has a number of these growing on the side of his dam.

Areca vestiaria “Orange” do so well in SE Queensland.

Drop dead gorgeous Bentinckia condapanna.

Monster of a Corypha utan (Philippine variant).

Beautiful Marojejya darianii. Really impressive how much sun these can take.

Phil clearly knew what he was doing when planting Archontophoenix pupurea with “Blonde” Archontophoenix alexandrae. Pretty sweet contrast.

Wonderful example of Tahina spectabilis.

One of those palms folks can’t help but stare at in amazement, Neoveitchia storckii.

If my Chrysalidocarpus prestonianus hybrids turn out half a nice as Philip’s, I’ll be chuffed. This looks to have some C. pembanus in the mix I think.

Caterpillar with parasitoid wasp eggs.

Caught this ring-necked snake Diadophis punctatus (a colubrid) in my dining room area. It's smaller in diameter than a pen and about 6 in. in length. While not technically a "garden visitor" at the time, I have found them in my garden, both front and back for years. More on this reptile: https://animalia.bio/ring-necked-snake They must compete with the alligator lizards for insects. Ring-Neck Snake 1-12-23.mp4

Homo sapiens var. Austrailiensis is another contender in this race to eschew sophistication.