Interesting Butia

[freakypalmguy]

Hi all, I was just viewing Kim's pictures of the PSSC Banquet and was curious about the identity of this Butia. It's very compact and blue. Is this just a mutant B. capitata or what is it. I like it.

[kristof p]

nice one, B. capitata can have a nice deep blue colour but this one reminds me of a B. odorata. maybe a blue B. odorata? i do like this one very much, it would look great here in my garden

[PalmGuyWC]

Matt,

I would bet 99% of the Butias in the USA are B. capitata. They vary quite a bit, and the one pictured looks like B. capitata Var strictor. There are a whole bunch of them lineing a street in Santa Barbara. I have one but I didn't know what it was until it grew up. I actually prefer the "normal" droopy kind, but if one is tight for space, then Strictor fits the bill.

I see you are 78F right now and I'm only 60F. It's cloudy here and the low is moving in. The pressure is dropping here and rain tonight. The warm weather was nice while it lasted.

Dick

[freakypalmguy]

Matt,

I would bet 99% of the Butias in the USA are B. capitata. They vary quite a bit, and the one pictured looks like B. capitata Var strictor. There are a whole bunch of them lineing a street in Santa Barbara. I have one but I didn't know what it was until it grew up. I actually prefer the "normal" droopy kind, but if one is tight for space, then Strictor fits the bill.

I see you are 78F right now and I'm only 60F. It's cloudy here and the low is moving in. The pressure is dropping here and rain tonight. The warm weather was nice while it lasted.

Dick

Thanks Dick, do you remember if there is a picture of your var. strictor in your garden thread? I like it because it's different and would love to add one at my place. There is a place close to my house that carries one he calls compacta. I would assume this is the same type.

As far as the weather goes, I guess I know what to expect tomorrow then I hope we get a good amount of rain out of this one.

[MattyB]

I haven't seen a lot of "var. strictor" but it seems to me that the one pictured above is not that, just overpruned. It does have a nice blue coloration to it dosen't it? Yes it does, thanks for asking. You're welcome.

[kristof p]

Matt,

i agree, i think the leaves of a var strictior are not so curved like the one in the picture...

this is var strictior on the PACSOA website has totaly differant leaves.

http://www.pacsoa.org.au/palms/Butia/capit...rStrictior.html

Edited February 4, 2009 by kristof p

[freakypalmguy]

It is a beautifull blue. Here is a pic of what Multiflora is selling as "compacta". Does the one on the right look like real strictor? The one on the left is regular form for comparison.

[freakypalmguy]

Matt,

i agree, i think the leaves of a var strictior are not so curved like the one in the picture...

this is var strictior on the PACSOA website has totaly differant leaves.

http://www.pacsoa.org.au/palms/Butia/capit...rStrictior.html

Thank you Kristof, that Butia is definitely very upright. Very nice.

[kristof p]

It is a beautifull blue. Here is a pic of what Multiflora is selling as "compacta". Does the one on the right look like real strictor? The one on the left is regular form for comparison.

it does look compact so it could be a var compacta, it's definitely a beautifull one... the leaves of a var strictior are almost not curved (i gues this is one of the reasons why they call it var strictior).

maybe Nigel or Alberto or somebody else that has seen many Butia's in their natural habitat knows what it is. the one in the first post reminds me of a B. odorata which is smaller in all it's parts and has a blue(ish) colour...but my knowledge is very limiting about such things, i'm only guessing...

are there B. odorata's in cultivation in the usa? you can find them quite easily down here...

[PalmGuyWC]

Matt,

My Butia "strictor" is being smothered with bamboo, and it's hard to photograph. Frankly, I don't think it's very pretty, but we all have different tastes. I don't think it's in any of my garden photos.

On the other hand, Edith Bergstrom in the Bay Area who has a fantastic palm garden, has several Butia compactas, and I presume she got them from Multiflora. I saw them for the first time last year, and they are definately different. They are absolutely georgeous and about half the size of a typical Butia. I wish I had one, but Edith's have not produced any viable seeds, even though they bloom.

There is a gentleman in South Georgia, Kile Brown, who has a super, super Butia dwarf. It is like one tenth the size of a normal Butia and it's very silver. I'm sure it's a mutant, but I don't know if it's ever flowered. Aparently there is another one in that area too, but I don't know who it belongs to. There was a thread on here over a year ago with a picture of Mr. Brown's dwarf.

Dick

[freakypalmguy]

That's interesting that you say Edith's palms do not produce viable seeds. Multiflora claims that as well. I wonder if maybe it's a hybrid? Aren't hybrids typically sterile? What could it be a hybrid with? Hmmmm...

[PalmGuyWC]

Matt,

I honestly don't know how to answer your question. I presume the dwarfs are some kind of a mutant, but the seeds have to be coming from somewhere. Maybe there is only one palm that is producing the seeds. It would be interesting to investigate Multiflora and find out, but they might want to keep it a trade secret. You know how palm people are, if they have something hot and special, they want to keep it that way to keep the price up.

Do you have one of the B. compactas, and are they available? I wonder what a 15 gal would cost if they are available?

Dick

[freakypalmguy]

Matt,

I honestly don't know how to answer your question. I presume the dwarfs are some kind of a mutant, but the seeds have to be coming from somewhere. Maybe there is only one palm that is producing the seeds. It would be interesting to investigate Multiflora and find out, but they might want to keep it a trade secret. You know how palm people are, if they have something hot and special, they want to keep it that way to keep the price up.

Do you have one of the B. compactas, and are they available? I wonder what a 15 gal would cost if they are available?

Dick

Dick,

I don't yet but that is one I would like to get. I might go check them out tommorrow and I will let you know.

Matt

[FRITO]

hmmm never heard of Butia compacta.. sounds cool and looks cool.

Matt, the one pictured to me looks like a nice silver bizzie with a few to many fronds trimmed off. not even a 'strictor' in my opinion as the leaves recurve to much.

Ive noticed out here where its humid in summer the butias seem to be a bit greener. my bizzie does this as well. more silver in winter. I dnno if it can relate over there as its probably your rainy humid season now and summer is hot and dry.

this 'compacta' is that a variation of capitata or a random plam showed a compact ability and was simply propogated. or is it a diffrent species that isnt clearly labeled.

kinda like Butia 'odorata'

[FRITO]

heres a old thread with some info on Butia compacta

apprently its an 'invention'

I have seed growing of Butia capitata var. 'nana' and was told its a small dwarf form. the seed came from Amazonia - a seed dealer in Spain.

[_Keith]

This one just looks overly pruned to me.

[Nigel]

Here along the coast of Santa Caterina and Parana grow Butia odorata. A very blue and compact form of capitata just like the photo.

Further south in Rio Grande Do Sul, and Uruguay grow normal sized big capitatas.

Dr Noblick has recommended that these populations deserve more study, and Henderson has suggested Butia odorata is deserving of its own species name.

One characteristic of odorata is that it flowers profusely even as a very small and young plant.

[Gallop]

There is a compacta in my neighbor hood that looks exactly like you're pics. Very interesting plant , actually I've seen couple others around town as well. Not sure where they came from by the looks of the yards I've seen them, the owners don't seem to be palm enthusiast. They are very nice plants, I'll keep my eye out for seed.

It is a beautifull blue. Here is a pic of what Multiflora is selling as "compacta". Does the one on the right look like real strictor? The one on the left is regular form for comparison.

[PalmGuyWC]

Does anyone in the USA have a good sized or blooming Butia archeri? It's a dwarf and silver in color. I have two smaller ones but they are still green. They are very slow growing. Mine go in the ground this spring.

Dick

[Mark_NoVA]

... They vary quite a bit, and the one pictured looks like B. capitata Var strictor. There are a whole bunch of them lining a street in Santa Barbara....

Dick, are you able to tell me which street, or give a rough guide to the location? Thanks!

[edric]

I grew this one from a seedling, I dug the seedling up in 1994, it was at Canaveral National Seashores, down the street a few mi., they demolished all the old homes from the early 1800's, one of them had a very old tree out front over 100 years old maybe, as high a telephone poll, a girl friend had turned me on to this tree as a source of fruit, I went back a year latter, and it was dead, looked around and there was this tiny seedling, the rest is history, Ed

[kristof p]

i have a small B. archeri growing in the greenhouse...i hope it will flower in the near future. i'm alos growing one in a pot wich is outside for most of the year. i do not dear to try it outside during winter....

i think it Alberto from Brazil has a nice dwarf Butia hybrid. i think it is B. eriospatha x microspadix (Alberto???)

here's my B. archeri growing in the greenhouse...

[PalmGuyWC]

Mark,

I don't remember the name of the street in Santa Barbara. Someone from there would know. I haven't been there in years, so I don't know if they are still there.

Kristof,

My two B. archeri's were greenhouse grown and loose and airy like yours. I gradually moved them into full sun and now they are compact and ready to be planted in the ground. I see yours has a nice blue color. Mine are still green. Do you remember if yours was green when it was smaller?

Dick

[kristof p]

Dick,

the one i'm growing in a pot is smaller and looks greener than the larger one in the greenhouse.i have my archeri's only since spring last year... i tried to grow them from seeds but failed everytime

here's the potted one.

[Perito]

... They vary quite a bit, and the one pictured looks like B. capitata Var strictor. There are a whole bunch of them lining a street in Santa Barbara....

Dick, are you able to tell me which street, or give a rough guide to the location? Thanks!

Mark- I believe those trees are on State Street, near where it intersects Mission Street. They are in the center divider. Here's another photo of the Butia from the Hyatt, then another particularly nice one from the garden at South Coast Palms in Fallbrook.

[Mark_NoVA]

Thanks for the info!

Mark- I believe those trees are on State Street, near where it intersects Mission Street. They are in the center divider.

[PalmGuyWC]

Perito,

Wow, both of those Butias are VERY silver. Thanks for the photos. I have several different kinds, but none of them are that silver. My most silver is a Butia yatay and it looks most silver in the summer with hot, dry conditions. I'm hoping I'll finally get a silver with the B. archeri's. PACSOA has some nice pictures of B. archeri in habitat. They are knock out palms and should be suited for a sunny small garden. I think they will be just as cold hardy as the other Butias.

Dick

[Perito]

Thanks Dick- I too like the very silvery Butias. I'm not sure living here in such a cool area that they could reach their full silverishness but would still pick one up if I thought it had the strong silver genepool. Perito

[iamjv]

Sure wish we could grow butias that nicely here in SA. Every once in a while you'll come across one that is doing wonderfully but that is the exception instead of the rule... the silver variety is my favorite as well. Jv

[Kris]

Dear Perito

Those butia's seen in your lovely stills are like seeing a Brahea Armada... So much of colour_those butia's simply rocks ! Till now i have never seen a butia so beautiful...Thanks for those terrefic visuals.

Love,

Kris

[Perito]

Thanks Kris! You've spurred me on to post a couple photos of Butias I liked at the L.A. Arboretum when the PSSC held a meeting there in March of 2007. Perito

[_Keith]

I grew this one from a seedling, I dug the seedling up in 1994, it was at Canaveral National Seashores, down the street a few mi., they demolished all the old homes from the early 1800's, one of them had a very old tree out front over 100 years old maybe, as high a telephone poll, a girl friend had turned me on to this tree as a source of fruit, I went back a year latter, and it was dead, looked around and there was this tiny seedling, the rest is history, Ed

Now that is one cool story.