Sabal causiarum x palmetto

[buffy]

Speak of the devil.... an inflorescence.

[kinzyjr]

Awesome news!

[RJ]

On 3/30/2019 at 7:10 PM, buffy said:

I had it pot constrained in a 3 gallon until I planted it out 5 years ago. I don't know if I've ever seen this speed of growth in a Sabal. This planter had a bunch of green sand. Maybe that helps. Hybrid vigor?

For the novice here.... what the heck is "green sand" ? 

TIA

[RJ]

On 3/30/2019 at 7:10 PM, buffy said:

I had it pot constrained in a 3 gallon until I planted it out 5 years ago. I don't know if I've ever seen this speed of growth in a Sabal. This planter had a bunch of green sand. Maybe that helps. Hybrid vigor?

Posted twice , no idea why

Edited May 8, 2019 by RJ

[buffy]

From Wiki: The green colour of greensand is due to variable amounts of the mineral glauconite, an iron potassium silicate with very low weathering resistance; as a result, greensand tends to be weak and friable. It is a common ingredient as a source of potassium in organicgardening and farming fertilisers. 

So basically, iron and potassium, plus a few other minor minerals. 

[RJ]

3 hours ago, buffy said:

From Wiki: The green colour of greensand is due to variable amounts of the mineral glauconite, an iron potassium silicate with very low weathering resistance; as a result, greensand tends to be weak and friable. It is a common ingredient as a source of potassium in organicgardening and farming fertilisers. 

So basically, iron and potassium, plus a few other minor minerals. 

Thank you sir. So the entire planter is solely green sand for X amount of feet until you hit native soil, or is it self contained like a giant pot. If it't the latter how is drainage realized? 

As I want to do something next out our house/pool build I'm curious as to how embedded planters next to a pool are designed. 

 

 

[buffy]

Native clay soil is about three feet down.  Above that green sand and mulch.

[OC2Texaspalmlvr]

Big beautiful Sabal that brushes off 8F seems like a winner whatever it ends up being

On ‎4‎/‎18‎/‎2019 at 6:27 PM, buffy said:

Speak of the devil.... an inflorescence.

 

[buffy]

This is a beast. Aidan is just short of 5 feet.

[OC2Texaspalmlvr]

2 hours ago, buffy said:

This is a beast. Aidan is just short of 5 feet.

Holy Moly what a specimen you have going here 

Must be the perfect spot with just the right amount of care what an awesome palm 

[sonoranfans]

clay 3' beneath green sand seems like a great soil for a deep rooted sabal.  These "hybrids" look way too heavy in the petiole for palmetto, yet the crowns are notably more dense than causiarum and the trunks are about 1/2 the thickness.  A young causiarum with a few feet of clear trunk has a massive trunk thickness, mine is 40" in diameter without the boots.  Its the fastest sabal I ever saw, 20' + overall coming from a strap leaf seedling in spring 2011  If you need extra cold hardiness it seems like a good hybrid.  I don't need it and would rather have my thick trunked causiarum.  My causiarum flowers well before the local palmettos, not sure how that would be effected by a colder climate.

[buffy]

1 hour ago, sonoranfans said:

clay 3' beneath green sand seems like a great soil for a deep rooted sabal.  These "hybrids" look way too heavy in the petiole for palmetto, yet the crowns are notably more dense than causiarum and the trunks are about 1/2 the thickness.  A young causiarum with a few feet of clear trunk has a massive trunk thickness, mine is 40" in diameter without the boots.  Its the fastest sabal I ever saw, 20' + overall coming from a strap leaf seedling in spring 2011  If you need extra cold hardiness it seems like a good hybrid.  I don't need it and would rather have my thick trunked causiarum.  My causiarum flowers well before the local palmettos, not sure how that would be effected by a colder climate.

Very good summation. I'd much prefer a causiarum, but it gets smacked down enough here with the cold that you end up with a dud. 

[buffy]

Finally put the tape to this crown. 21' across in full bright sun. Love this thing.  

[OC2Texaspalmlvr]

1 hour ago, buffy said:

Finally put the tape to this crown. 21' across in full bright sun. Love this thing.  

Maybe its time to give these hybrids there own name Sabal Gainesville maybe =) Super cold hardy Causiarum with hybrid vigor 

[palmsrgreat]

On 8/10/2019 at 8:00 PM, buffy said:

Finally put the tape to this crown. 21' across in full bright sun. Love this thing.  

@buffy

Any photo updates on this hybrid? Setting seed this year?

 

[buffy]

I'll try to remember to take one. By the way, I call this thing Sabal 'Megatron'. Last year's seeds are coming up. 

[OC2Texaspalmlvr]

1 hour ago, buffy said:

Sabal 'Megatron

I like it =) Any current pics of it ? 

[kylecawazafla]

So exciting! I hope more of these beautiful palms are planted! Nice name choice 

[buffy]

Starting to trunk.

[OC2Texaspalmlvr]

4 minutes ago, buffy said:

Starting to trunk.

That is a beast !!! Thanks for the  update =) 

T J 

[awkonradi]

Magnificent 8a palm.

[buffy]

Just for scale, that's a 6' square planter.

[OC2Texaspalmlvr]

2 hours ago, buffy said:

Just for scale, that's a 6' square planter.

I love it 

[sonoranfans]

21' wide crown is wide for a palmetto in sun, there is one near that behind my house in shade and its stretched and thinner of crown, not like this palm.  What I dont see from causiarum genes is the super thick petiole and trunk, those look more palmetto as does the very large number of leaves in the crown.  Causiarum is a more sparse crown than other sabals with super thick petioles.  Could be a great 8a palm, time will tell.

[Dartolution]

@buffy are those seeds coming up from "megatron"? haha If so... id sure be interested in one :) 

[Fusca]

1 hour ago, Dartolution said:

@buffy are those seeds coming up from "megatron"? haha If so... id sure be interested in one

You might want to try 3 or 4 if you're interested in another "megatron".  F2 seedlings could end up looking just like palmetto.

[buffy]

8 hours ago, Fusca said:

You might want to try 3 or 4 if you're interested in another "megatron".  F2 seedlings could end up looking just like palmetto.

I believe these seedling are technically an F3. The original is in Gainesville. Megatron is an F2. 

[Fusca]

3 hours ago, buffy said:

I believe these seedling are technically an F3. The original is in Gainesville. Megatron is an F2. 

Nice!  Did you have several F2 seedlings and just planted the "best" one?  I'm guessing that Megatron grew the fastest showing the hybrid vigor while some others did not.

[buffy]

Yep. I have a double in the woods that's not growing like this. 

[Dartolution]

@buffy so, about those seeds... haha

How have they been progressing? 

[rarepalmaddict]

On 2/15/2009 at 8:07 PM, kylecawazafla said:

Here are three more of the "Sabal palmetoo x causiarum"! There are TONS of seeds beneath these by the way, and they shoot up seedlings everywhere. So if anyone wants some, just PM me.

May I have some?

[awkonradi]

On 8/24/2020 at 3:14 PM, buffy said:

Starting to trunk.

Hi buffy, May I ask how is this palm, after the recent Texas extreme cold event?

[buffy]

It's in brutal condition, as are most plants in my yard. All the large leaf azaleas, Pittosporums, wax myrtles,  Loropetalum, Abelia, olive, fig, satsuma, loquat and Gardenia are dead to the ground. So, basically, everything. Magnolia, Sabal Tamaulipas and needle palms are the only untouched evergreens. Even my S. minors show variable damage from untouched to 50%. Sabal Tamaulipas is the absolute shiznit. 

On Megatron, central growth is still green on this one, so we'll see. The saving grace in my yard was the 10" of dry powder that fell the night before the big freeze. It helped smaller stuff with low growing points to be protected from the -5F. There are no palms in my yard that have simply collapsed. Like someone else mentioned, you'll know if it's alive in May and if its dead in August. 

[Dartolution]

@buffy Cam I hope megatron makes it. If so, -5F is pretty amazing either way. 

Did you protect it at all? Lights? Wraps? 

[buffy]

37 minutes ago, Dartolution said:

@buffy Cam I hope megatron makes it. If so, -5F is pretty amazing either way. 

Did you protect it at all? Lights? Wraps? 

I heated the pool to 91F and yelled "Bring It!" 

Clearly, "It" was brought. 

[Dartolution]

HAHAHA indeed... 

[RJ]

-5  That's incredible.  Were you without power like much of Texas? How did the house fair? 

[buffy]

We had power. We're in a sliver of counties on the eastern border that are a part of the eastern U.S. power grid. The 10" of dry powder is the only reason anything survived. There were pine trees just north of here that were defoliated. It was a perfect storm. All the live oaks were defoliated. Tons of natives smoked to the ground. Absolute shock and awe for us.    

[buffy]

One year after -5F.

[kylecawazafla]

I'm so glad it survived! It's so nice to see updates of palms you were involved with.