Signs of Autumn

[happ]

After unrelenting heat, California will experience a significant cool down for a few days. And next week an even cooler airmass should invade the Southwest from the Gulf of Alaska. None of this means anything in October except maybe some nights in the 50's If it were winter, these polar fronts could cause damaging frost.

[Alicehunter2000]

I feel your pain.........highs this week in the upper 70's and low 80's but nightime, dipping to the low 60's <-----uggghh! I'm not ready for this yet.

[SubTropicRay]

69F beautiful degrees this morning. It will be short lived but a refreshing change nonetheless.

[Palm Guy]

Autumn is nearing on this end of the pond also. We hit 71 F which is the lowest temperature since the beginning of June. I shouldn't be feeling chilly for another two to three weeks but last week I actually wore a wind breaker on my motorcycle. Ocean temps starting to dive to 82F also.

[PalmGuyWC]

Tempatures are begining to slide in N. Calif. After roasting most of Sept. the weather changed this week. The low yesterday was 46F and a high of about 75. I can expect some chilly nights and some warm sunny days in Oct. I'm getting a new roof, so I guarante it will rain soon.

Dick

[happ]

I feel your pain.........highs this week in the upper 70's and low 80's but nightime, dipping to the low 60's <-----uggghh! I'm not ready for this yet.

Are you serious? You actually like nights in the 70's?

[bubba]

Happ, Let me give you some perspective.I see according to Weather Underground, our low temperature this morning was 72F with a dewpoint of 72F and 96% humidity at 5:00AM. As I write, it is 84F(mostly cloudy but no clouds do I see) with humidity at 51%. To me, it feels dry.

To add perspective, on Aug. 2, 2009 our high was 92F and our low was 81F. The humidity level at the low temperature was 79%. This is an arbitrary pick because once our dry/cool season is over(Oct-May), this is what we experience on a daily basis. In South Florida to me the difficulty is not with our high summer temperatures(generally low 90's and lowest humidity of the day) but the lack of any cool down at night. No way 81F with 79% humidity is invigorating. That stated, you do get use to it. Thus, a low temperature of 72F actually feels cool.

Looking to the North part of the State, I see Plant City at 87F with 37% humidity.They had a low temperature of 58F at 5:00AM with a Dewpoint of 58F and 99% humidity. I bet it feels great to everyone in Plant City.

In Los Angeles, it reports 80F with 26% humidity. Your low according to WU was 65F at 5:00AM with a dewpoint of 31F and humidity at 28%. I am not sure we ever experience humidity levels in the 20% range but I am certain and I know when I am in California that the low humidity makes it all feel great. When you come to South Florida in mid-Summer, it would be the high lows with high humidity that would get your attention.

[mnorell]

I'm right there with David, I'm not ready for lows in the 60s yet...especially since that's just a harbinger of things to come! Though I really feel it's all personal preferences and/or our physical makeup that determines what's tolerable, and our abilities to adjust. I think Dick has mentioned this as well when he made his adjustment from South Florida to the SF Bay Area. I was born and raised in San Diego, lived in L.A. for over twenty years, and always hated the constant chill and dryness, the monotony of the weather, the nonexistent spring and the seemingly interminable blanket of freezing clouds that would move inland just when it was starting to feel nice in the afternoon. The frigid, dark, opaque waters of the Pacific made swimming no fun. When I first went to Hawai'i it was a revelation to me that a climate could be so comfortably warm. Same when I spent time in Mexico and later when I lived in Honolulu. Now I've moved to the Deep South and spend a lot of time in South Florida as well. I love the warm, humid climate (and must admit I hate the damp winters in Mississippi...but Miami's a short plane-trip away!). But it seems like half the people here look forward to winter, and half of them look forward to summer.

Much of my family think I'm crazy but my sister also loves warm weather, though she married someone who will not leave Cardiff-by-the-Sea and her body has adjusted to that constant 50s and 60s regime with relatively low humidity, as long as she's loaded up with sweaters and jackets. True, it can be hot as Hades here in summer, and I agree with Bubba that Florida's nighttime lows in the 80s are a bit much, but I've adjusted to the point that I now can't stand temperatures below 70F, and the other day when a cold-front came through our humidity was down to 58% and I thought it was horribly dry! In CA when the Santa Anas would blow I created more sparks than a lightning storm, and my skin just crawls under those conditions. It's just me, and I don't begrudge those who love the cool desert clime of coastal CA...but I grew up hearing seemingly everyone in SoCal gripe about the fact that they would never go to Florida because of the HEAT and the HUMIDITY (and the BUGS)! So to each his own, my own climate-utopia would be about 72/87 and roughly 65-75% humidity with partly cloudy, intensely blue skies and t'storms in the afternoon, now that feels great to me! (And I actually love the bugs, too!)

BTW, Bubba, why do they call one of the coldest places in Central Florida "Plant City"? Isn't that right up their with "Frostproof"? What do they grow there, cherries?

[happ]

I may be spoiled but I just don't like running A/C 24-7. Only on the hottest nights do we have to keep the house closed up. I need the night air and sleep right next to an open window. It rarely stays above 70F [only 9 nights during Sept] but it is uncomfortable to me even when the dew point\ humidity are below 25. Actually, I am looking forward to the 50's that we should get next week. To me, that is greatest sleeping weather. Michael, how can you not like "50's & 60's" for sleeping? Do you turn off the A/C at all during summer?

[bubba]

Michael, Your experience is very interesting and instructive. I have not spent enough time in "dry" climates to say much more than I greatly enjoy not sweating in the heat. Our AC literally runs 365 a year. Happ, it would be great to sleep with open windows.

I guess it is one of those "grass is always greener" things. Our Oct-May dry/cooler season would not be the sweet thing it is without a little suffering with our 80F low temperatures.

Plant City is not the coldest place in Central Florida. I would guess Ocala. The only cherries in Plant City are strawcherries. As to Frostproof, it is a good deal further South. Miles and miles of rolling hills and Orange trees among one lake after the next in Ben Hill country. It did not live up to it's name in 1989!

[mnorell]

Happ--

Again I think it just has to do with our own internal thermostats and also what we can adjust to. There are a lot of people here who love 50s for sleeping, even some who leave their windows open on those rare nights when it dips into the 20s in winter! I personally can't deal with those kind of temps. I agree that 60s are nice for sleeping since houses tend to generate their own heat during the night and if you don't have your windows open it will certainly get oppressive. Our house was built in 1861 and its windows were unfortunately sealed tight when we bought it, after five years we've just now got window and door-shutters ($$$ ouch!) in place and the windows will finally be unsealed and openable imminently, so I very much look forward to keeping windows open at night and certainly will do so as much as possible. We already keep the doors open with the door-shutters in place most days, with ceiling fans going strong and I love it. When it's warm here we keep the A/C set to 72 for sleeping. I think aside from the issue of our own metabolic comfort-zones, sleeping comfort has perhaps more to do with air movement than it does with actual temperature. But I like to spend time outside, and I'm one of those people who likes wearing shorts and loose-weave shirts day and night. I love outdoor cafes and walking in the evenings and that's where I have trouble with the coolness. I was amazed when I started seeing more of the southern U.S. that many people have no idea what the heat-lamps are that are such a fixture in SoCal outdoor dining establishments.

Bubba--

I think you're right that we need a bit of contrast to appreciate either the warmth or the coolness. Here the winters are definitely too cold and wet for my taste, but in January when I escape to Miami or the Keys it feels like heaven!

Re: Plant City, I was joking that it was the coldest place, but it just makes me laugh that there seems to be some kind of wishful thinking going on by the City Fathers when they name these spots in the less-than-optimally mild areas of Florida. But it certainly becomes obvious when looking at those winter morning temps that there is a major cold-air drain running between the I-75 and the 4. It's frankly incredible to me that the temps can go so cold so far south! Farther to the north, but still near the coast and across from Orlando, I also regularly notice that the Brooksville airport would seem to be a good spot for an ice-manufacturing plant.

BTW, I recently discovered the book "The Barefoot Architect" and I think it's wonderful, I would love to design a house that needs no A/C in a warm climate, built with natural materials, and this is a great handbook for such a project, it is very well written and filled with clear, succinct drawings and diagrams about airflow, etc. and I think much of the architectural community could stand to be forced to use its principles in the whole sunbelt of the U.S...though it also covers building-design and construction techniques for colder climates as well. The only thing is, I don't know how well most of these buildings would hold up in a hurricane!!

[happ]

I know it is a matter of preference. But it is also a cost issue. Setting the night temp to 72F sounds heavenly. Visited family this summer in Chico\ northern Sacramento valley; they kept the thermostat at 78F day & night. Thank God for ceiling fans. Living on a "9PM to 9AM" schedule in order to avoid the heat.

So. Florida during winter is just about as good as it gets in my opinion.

It's funny to me. I posted on a meteorology forum about the coming cool weather & was blasted that I was absurd to suggest that 50's are cold Frost was reported in parts of the PacificNW this morning. That cold air is moving quickly south into California & a good chance of maximums in the 60's maybe as early as tomorrow or Monday. To me, that's cold for October.

[Cristóbal]

temperatures in 60s F in october is very cold for california and more for southern california.

i read the doctors say 20C - 68 F is the best temperature for the humans but every person is different.

i dont like hot weather and less if theres high humiditeys, i have enough of this before i move to tijuana from la paz. 20 C - 68 F and dry is very good for me.

my friends in mexicali where in the summer it is very very hot to 52 C - 126 F in the summer, they say they hate it. the body does not adapt.

[bubba]

Michael, Both Plant City and Brooksville are considered Western burbs of Tampa by most of the folks I went to UF with from those areas. Plant City is a major Strawberry producer and is latitude 28 North. Kind of like an Eastern Watsonville.

I know friends with serious citrus in Brooksville. I suspect more of an airport thermometer issue. Brooksville is 28.6 latitude but it is hard to grow citrus profitably in seriously cold areas. They have done it since around 1900.

Frostproof is 27.7 latitude and a world unto itself. Rolling hills and serious citrus. It is a beautiful area. I guess the founders saw their boastful name tarnished in 1989. That stated, even a serious freeze was not enough to snuff out oranges in Frostproof.

It would be great to figure out how to do away with AC. It was great to hear stories from my Grandparents about life in Florida without AC. Stout souls! I was in an old/multistory office building in West Palm recently and remembered stories about how all the windows were kept open and documents would blow out the windows and would be chased by secretaries down in the streets!

[BobbyinNY]

This is such an interesting topic and really a matter of preference for everyone.... To me, I agree with Michael and can't stand temps below 70f... Our days/nights right now for the past few weeks have been running roughly 70/52 and I hate it.. Today is a "balmy" 77f and I'm loving it.... If I can't wear shorts and a t-shirt I think it's cold... People say to me all the time: "When you move to Florida, you won't appreciate the summers anymore" And I just answer them with "that's like saying you have to be sick for half the year to appreciate feeling well".... I honestly believe that the body does not like change from cold to hot constantly and people who live in a constantly similar climate are much less prone to illness... Every year up here thousands of people come down with the flu/cold around November which I'm sure isn't happening in South Florida.

[BS Man about Palms]

A couple days ago the Oceanside airport got down to 48F overnight...thankfully I'm a few degrees warmer...

[happ]

Recorded 56F this morning [coldest minimum since May 1st] and tonight may get even colder if it stays clear & winds lower. Great sleeping last night!

[epicure3]

This is such an interesting topic and really a matter of preference for everyone.... To me, I agree with Michael and can't stand temps below 70f... Our days/nights right now for the past few weeks have been running roughly 70/52 and I hate it.. Today is a "balmy" 77f and I'm loving it.... If I can't wear shorts and a t-shirt I think it's cold... People say to me all the time: "When you move to Florida, you won't appreciate the summers anymore" And I just answer them with "that's like saying you have to be sick for half the year to appreciate feeling well".... I honestly believe that the body does not like change from cold to hot constantly and people who live in a constantly similar climate are much less prone to illness... Every year up here thousands of people come down with the flu/cold around November which I'm sure isn't happening in South Florida.

I would disagree with that, but maybe the good folks in South Florida could chime in. So, do you ever get sick there in Palm Beach?

[bubba]

My youngest son's school got hit with the flu. A new verb was created called "swined". South Florida is not immune from the flu.

That stated, my roomate my first year in law school lives in Cleveland,Oh. He and his wife were down for a convention recently and they discussed how they always get flu shots but get sick all winter anyway.

The other culprit seems to be airplanes. I think they need to recycle air. Most people sick around here can pinpoint and connect it with air travel.

I never get sick but I have a secret. I wash my hands!

[PalmatierMeg]

We get sick every winter because snowbirds bring their cold weather germs south & pass them to us. Some of them are already here and swine flu is knocking out locals right & left.

[BobbyinNY]

We get sick every winter because snowbirds bring their cold weather germs south & pass them to us. Some of them are already here and swine flu is knocking out locals right & left.

Those damn snowbirds....

[PalmGuyWC]

When I used to fly weekly, it seems I had more than my share of colds and the flu. When I retired and stayed off airplanes, I had very few colds or the flu. I try to get a flu shot every year, and I heard on TV that if you get a shot, your chances of getting the flu are reduced by 70%. I've already had my regular flu shot, and I want to get a swine flu shot when they become available. My lungs are shot and if I get the flu it could be very serious or fatal. I've canceled my trip to Dallas for Thanksgiving because I don't want to get on an airplane.

Dick

[epicure3]

When I used to fly weekly, it seems I had more than my share of colds and the flu. When I retired and stayed off airplanes, I had very few colds or the flu. I try to get a flu shot every year, and I heard on TV that if you get a shot, your chances of getting the flu are reduced by 70%. I've already had my regular flu shot, and I want to get a swine flu shot when they become available. My lungs are shot and if I get the flu it could be very serious or fatal. I've canceled my trip to Dallas for Thanksgiving because I don't want to get on an airplane.

Dick

Definitely take care of yourself Dick.

My neighbor across the street is sick a lot as well with the flu and other asscociated ugliness. He is an ER doctor. Enough said.

[PalmGuyWC]

Burrr!

It's chilly in Walnut Creek this morning with a low of 44F, the coolest yet this season. Seems like the chill has come early to Calif. as I recall this time last year it was still warm with balmy evenings. I hope this is not a portent of things to come, however it's supposed to warm up again later in the week. I can't turn on my furnace because my roof is being replaced and the exhaust chimney to the furnace hasn't been replaced yet. My house is a chilly 59F and I'm bundled up in a jacket to keep warm. Supposed to warm to about 73F today, 80's later in the week.

Dick

[Cristóbal]

i see this today in the weather underground for san diego.

many cold records of 60 and 80 years broken:

Record Report

Statement as of 7:47 PM PDT on October 5, 2009

... Lowest maximum temperature records broken or tied on October 4...

Location new record old record period of record

Yorba Linda 68 72 in 1974 since 1948

Laguna Beach 65 66 in 1955 since 1928

Beaumont 62 67 in 1994 since 1948

Elsinore 70 72 in 1994 since 1948

Escondido 63 71 in 1994 since 1979

Wild Animal Park 69 75 in 1994 since 1979

Ramona Airport 65 67 in 1994 since 1974

Alpine 62 66 in 2000 since 1952

Big Bear Lake 47 54 in 1969 since 1960

Palomar Mountain 58 60 in 1983 since 1948

Campo coop 64 66 in 2000 since 1948

Palm Springs 80 82 in 1966 since 1927

Indio 81 tied 81 in 1941 since 1927

Edited October 5, 2009 by Cristóbal

[Kim]

I replaced the batteries in my sensor last night -- 49.6 F low this morning. Undeniably, fall is upon us.

[Al in Kona]

Interesting reading about all of your early FALL temperatures (lows and highs) over on the Mainland. Makes our temperatures appear rather boring and perhaps to some of you it is. Our high and low temperatures have changed very little for months. Ok, sometimes it does reach 90`F for a few days but mostly it is in the 80's. Today's Kona newspaper "West Hawaii Today", Oct. 5, reports that the next 5-days temperatures continue as always with highs of 87 (two days will be 86 due to more cloud cover). Lows will be 75 or 76 degrees. Yeah it may be a bit boring but personally I like these temps and so do our tropical plants. Then too our humidity levels are up there but I prefer that to dry. Only in mid day out in the sun does one feel a bit uncomfortable. We don't have to think about what we might have to wear from one day to another. An umbrella in the car is always a handy item to have however. A couple more months and our temperatures will normally slowly begin to drop a few degrees so will will have some changes and that's cool because we never have to worry about cold or frost damage. We might even want to throw on a sweater or light jacket on some winter mornings before the sun comes out. So we will experience some Winter cool!

This week-end is the Ironman World Championship (Kona Triathlon) . I do feel for those 1,800 athletes having to run and cycle for miles up and down hills on the black pavement during the hottest time of the day.

I'm wondering what kind of weather one can expect in Rio de Janeiro for the 2010 IPS Biennial (April 17-24)? Anyone have any idea what it is usually like there at that time of year?

[epicure3]

I replaced the batteries in my sensor last night -- 49.6 F low this morning. Undeniably, fall is upon us.

49F on Pt. Loma? Are you sure? My low was 53F and I am pretty sure that I am colder than where you are. Maybe my thermometer is faulty.

[bubba]

Well, while you are experiencing great temperatures out West, our "heat index" is going to be 106F today. Signs of Autumn come and go around here...

[happ]

Take a look at the polar air for the Midwest. This is for Sunday\ 10-11-09. Snow may fall as far south as Kansas. incredible cold for so early!

I recorded 56F this morning & 50's should stick around for a while.

[amazondk]

I'm wondering what kind of weather one can expect in Rio de Janeiro for the 2010 IPS Biennial (April 17-24)? Anyone have any idea what it is usually like there at that time of year?

[KMartin]

It is incredible, but not unheard of. It is following OCT UJEAS to a tee, even having the large trough out west by around the 20th.

[Palmy]

We have gotten down close to freezing in Oregon. 35 this morning. 34 last morning. Tomorrow morning its suppose to be 40. Tad chilly this early for oregon.

[happ]

What's fascinating is the possibility of a powerful storm around Columbus day in the Bay Area. Rain estimates exceed 5" in 48 hrs remnants of typhoon Melor.

[trioderob]

this is so funny to me reading about how bad the weather is in southern california !

lets talk about what you dont get here:

1) summer days that are so hot and humid that it feels like a steam bath at 3:00 AM

2) lightning strikes that are so common it is recommended that you dont keep any tall trees

3) wind storms in spring time that are just under hurricane force

4) hail, tornadoes, hurricanes , supercells and straight line winds that blow over homes.

5) ice storms that can turn bridges into death traps

6) heating and cooling bills in the hundreds of $$$ per month

7) rain that can be up to 20" in a weekend causing massive flooding damage

sure its "boring" - but it worth the trade-off

[PalmGuyWC]

I'll believe it when I see it, but bring it on. This should be a good test for my new roof which should be completed tomorrow.......just in the nick of time.

Dick

[PalmGuyWC]

Rob,

Nothing to do with the weather, but you forgot to mention earthquakes and bumper to bumper traffic on 8 lane highways that goes as far as the eye can see. One major earthquake in LA or San Francisco and all the things you mention will be minor.

Dick

[bubba]

Rob, West Palm Airport-7:00 PM 85F/92F Heat Index/Oct. 9,2009. You have not lived until you have watched your hair stand straight-up a nano-second before a close lightning strike!

[happ]

Rob, West Palm Airport-7:00 PM 85F/92F Heat Index/Oct. 9,2009. You have not lived until you have watched your hair stand straight-up a nano-second before a close lightning strike!

that is so funny bubba. Lightning does occur in California though you can count the times on one hand each yr. Remember when I worked in a court school. Each Monday the kids would tell what they did over the wkend. One boy & his brother mentioned that they had gone up to Vasquez Rock when a t-storm passed. They cracked everyone up describing how their hair stood straight up. These Cali kids have no idea how dangerous lightning is - duh!

Dick, get ready for a major storm. Here a segment of NWS_SF latest discussion:

WARM ADVECTION/WARM FRONTAL RAINS WILL START ON MONDAY...SPREADING SOUTH MONDAY NIGHT. THE WINDS COULD BEGIN TO PICK UP MONDAY AHEAD OF THE RAIN. THIS COULD CAUSE BLOWING DUST AND DIRT FROM THE FIELDS ACROSS ROADWAYS. RAIN AND WIND WILL INCREASE ON TUESDAY AND CONTINUE THROUGH TUESDAY NIGHT. STRONG ISENTROPIC LIFT ALONG THE 295K LEVEL WITH 50+ KT UPGLIDE. TPW VALUES WILL BE GREATER THAN 1.5 INCHES. 925 MB WINDS WILL INCREASE TO 50+ KT...PERPENDICULAR TO THE HILLS. THE POTENTIAL IS THERE FOR EXCESSIVE RAINFALL...AS MUCH AS 1 TO 3 INCHES ALONG THE COAST AND VALLEYS WITH LOCALIZED AMOUNTS TO 5 INCHES. THE HILLS COULD SEE 3 TO 6 INCHES...WITH LOCALIZED AMOUNTS TO 8 INCHES. FUTURE MODEL RUNS WILL HELP PINPOINT THE AREAS OF HEAVIEST RAIN. THE GFS ENSEMBLES ARE SHOWING VERY LITTLE ENSEMBLE SPREAD AMONG ITS MEMBERS...WHICH INCREASES THE CONFIDENCE IN THE FORECAST...

That is dangerous amounts of rain!

[PalmGuyWC]

Happ,

This storm moving in sounds ominous, but when it's so far out, how can they be sure it will hit the Bay Area? Or is it more of a west coast event?

Dick