Australian Trees

[freakypalmguy]

Hi all,

My wife and are looking for an australian native tree that flowers and will survive in Temecula with lows in the high 20's F with a few light frosts, and highs in the low 100's F. Any sugggestions out there would be appreciated.

Matt

[LJG]

Go see Bruce in Fallbrook. He has a bunch of cool Aussie trees.

Hi all,

My wife and are looking for an australian native tree that flowers and will survive in Temecula with lows in the high 20's F with a few light frosts, and highs in the low 100's F. Any sugggestions out there would be appreciated.

Matt

[aussiearoids]

Unsure if this will survive for you but well worth a try . I know seeds have been sent over to Enid at Natural Selection .

Maniltoa lenticellata ,, a relative of Saraca . It is not large with a pleasing weeping habit and lovely pale flush to new growth .

Or Syzygium wilsonii a very attractive small tree with very colourful new growth and great flowers .

Sometimes called Powder Puff Lilly Pilly

[aussiearoids]

Bruce should have some of the amazing Bottle Trees , they are cold hardy .

This pic taken at Bundaberg Bot Gdn

[Justin]

Stenocarpus sinuatus is good, assuming your soil isn't clay.

Castanospermum australe will definitely take the heat, and all of mine did fine in the 2007 freeze, so that should be okay cold-wise as well.

Those were the two that immediately popped into my head. Of course, there is Grevillea robusta and several of the Eucalyptus trees, but I got the impression you wanted something more unusual.

[Jonathan]

Matt,

theres a few Brachychitons that would probably do well for you - B. rupestre (as above), as well as B. acerfolius (flame tree) or B. populneus (kurrajong).

B. bicolor also grows ok down here in Hobart, and has beautiful flowers. Firewheel tree - Stenocarpus sinuatus, would probably work too.

One of my favorite Australian trees is the smooth barked apple (Angophora costata), which is drought and frost hardy (to at least -7C/20F), fast growing, with deep red new growth and smooth salmon coloured bark and white flowers. It also, quite often grows twisted and gnarly, which looks really cool - would suit your place well, I think!

Heres a very old one (in centre) growing with Macrozamia communis that I saw in NSW recently, the other trees in the photo are (I think) Banksia serrata:

Close up of trunk, with Macrozamia's and Grasstrees:

Cheers,

Jonathan

[LJG]

I have a Syzygium australe you can dig. It is still small and I am not sure it fits into my garden theme.

[Gtlevine]

I will second Justin's choice of Castanospermum, it is gorgeous and hardy and does not go dormant in the cold.

[mnorell]

I agree Castanospermum would be a very nice choice, but also consider Harpullia pendula. A beautiful tree with some hardiness into the 20s F. It's not a showy bloomer but the seeds and pods are very decorative. Foliage is gorgeous, glossy and tropical-looking. This sapindaceous tree in general is quite choice. If you can't find it anywhere try Kartuz Greenhouses. They sell it in small sizes, though it's a moderately fast grower.

[ariscott]

Nauclea orientalis. Will this grow where you are?? I am not so sure about cold hardiness...

Regards, Ari

[freakypalmguy]

Thank you for the suggestions everyone, I appreciate it. I am leaning toward the Castanospermum australe, but a few others caught my eye as well. Who would have such a tree for sale?

Len, how big would you say it is? Can I just yank it out with my pickup I might take you up on that offer, I'll let you know.

[Peter]

Matt, Jeff Rood has a Castanospermum for sale I believe.

[Justin]

It's actually not "that" difficult to find at several nurseries around where I live. PM me if Jeff Rood doesn't happen to have any.

[MattyB]

Matt,

Here's an interesting one from OZ. Banksia integrifolia.

[MattyB]

Hardy to 20F supposedly and flowers like a protea.

[LJG]

Matt, get your Castanospermum australe bigger. They are not fast growers starting out and they really do not like to be trained. Case in point my tree verses Gary's. I put mine in the ground a year before Gary. I pruned it up to get it to single trunk. It really has a hard time coming out of the job I did. Evan at Vista Tree Farm told me he has a hard time too with these. Miramar Wholesale just lets them grow natural now. This is what Gary does too. His have grown pretty fast for him by not touching them. Since you both have the room, you guys can live with the multiple trunks. I could not. OK, so to compress all this, go to Vista Tree Farm by my house and get one in a 15 or 24 in box. They are priced well too. Maybe a few hundred for an old tree.

I put the Syzygium australe in the ground 2 years ago. It is still small. Maybe 6 feet tall, but skinny. Easy dig man. I think it would be a great plant for you.

Thank you for the suggestions everyone, I appreciate it. I am leaning toward the Castanospermum australe, but a few others caught my eye as well. Who would have such a tree for sale?

Len, how big would you say it is? Can I just yank it out with my pickup I might take you up on that offer, I'll let you know.

[LJG]

Matt has a good rec too. Banksia integrifolia is nice. They have some at the SD Zoo that look killer.

[MattyB]

Len, I too have noticed that limbing up/training young trees slows them down significantly. I just let them go crazy, overflow into walkways and such, until they've fattened up a bit and decided what they want to use as a main leader, then start to prune. Often the initial main leader will bend over and a secondary branch will take over the position. Once the tree is a few years old you'd never notice the junction, it just looks like one main stem.

[Eric in Orlando]

Another good choice is Melaleuca alternifolia, Tea Oil Tree. It bears white bottlebrush-like flowers and has attractive white, flaking papery bark. Also only grows to about 20ft tall.

[LJG]

All depends on the tree. Some need to be trained very early. Of all the trees I have, this is the only one that did not respond to aggressive pruning. Well, my Tabebuia's do not like it much either.

Len, I too have noticed that limbing up/training young trees slows them down significantly. I just let them go crazy, overflow into walkways and such, until they've fattened up a bit and decided what they want to use as a main leader, then start to prune. Often the initial main leader will bend over and a secondary branch will take over the position. Once the tree is a few years old you'd never notice the junction, it just looks like one main stem.

[ThunderSRQ]

Matt, get your Castanospermum australe bigger. They are not fast growers starting out and they really do not like to be trained. Case in point my tree verses Gary's. I put mine in the ground a year before Gary. I pruned it up to get it to single trunk. It really has a hard time coming out of the job I did. Evan at Vista Tree Farm told me he has a hard time too with these. Miramar Wholesale just lets them grow natural now. This is what Gary does too. His have grown pretty fast for him by not touching them. .

I've got a little C. australe (one gallon -- approx. 12" tall) that I have grown from seed and I wanted to ask if you think it would be OK to plant it out now or if I should wait until after winter. As an FYI, the typical winter here can include a few nights below freezing but very rarely below 30 degrees (last year, during what was an unusually cold winter, we had 4 nights below freezing and the lowest temp was 30). Anyhow, obviously this tree wouldn't be happy trying to grow under live oak canopy so it would be out where a frost would impact it (although it's tough to think about frost when it's still hitting 90 degrees here every day!).

Thanks...

Tim

[bubba]

Michael, Give me one of those Bottle Trees! Those things are wild!

[Fouquieria]

Hi Matt,

Esthetics seem to win over most times. I always picture Temecula as being hot in the summer and a bit colder in the winter. Some trees have reputations that are not always deserved. I'm not sure how you are going to use this "Austrlalian" tree but I'll give a few observations on mine.

Stenocarpus sinuatus is not as slow growing as some imply. I planted mine out about six years ago as a 2-1/2 footer and now it is about 8-9 feet BUT hasn't bloomed yet. I have seen some smaller that have bloomed.

Eucalyptus macrocarpa and Eucalyptus rhodantha are sculptural marvels with spectacular blooms...but they are slow growing. Fortunately they bloom small. My E. macrocarpa should be blooming in a month or so for the first time, so I'll post pics when it does. I grew both of these from seed.

I have two metrosideros which are from New Zealand. They grow fairly fast, are evergreen and neat and clean. Highly recommended.

Buckinghamia celssisima has a growth habit very similar to the Stenocarpus. Mine is about three feet tall now and hasn't bloomed yet.

Finally, my favorites--also not Australian but South African--any Schotia you can get your hands on. I have Schotia brachypetala, Schotia latifolia, and Schotia afra. All three are drought tolerant in the extreme. All three are evergreen. All three have extravagant flowering. I grew all three of mine from seed and they grow fairly fast. My Schotia brachypetala had one little bloom umbel for the first time this last Spring. The other two haven't bloomed yet.

-Ron-

[LJG]

Tim, I got no clue. So hard to compare SoCal to FL cold. I know I would have no issue planting out one here right now.

Matt, get your Castanospermum australe bigger. They are not fast growers starting out and they really do not like to be trained. Case in point my tree verses Gary's. I put mine in the ground a year before Gary. I pruned it up to get it to single trunk. It really has a hard time coming out of the job I did. Evan at Vista Tree Farm told me he has a hard time too with these. Miramar Wholesale just lets them grow natural now. This is what Gary does too. His have grown pretty fast for him by not touching them. .

I've got a little C. australe (one gallon -- approx. 12" tall) that I have grown from seed and I wanted to ask if you think it would be OK to plant it out now or if I should wait until after winter. As an FYI, the typical winter here can include a few nights below freezing but very rarely below 30 degrees (last year, during what was an unusually cold winter, we had 4 nights below freezing and the lowest temp was 30). Anyhow, obviously this tree wouldn't be happy trying to grow under live oak canopy so it would be out where a frost would impact it (although it's tough to think about frost when it's still hitting 90 degrees here every day!).

Thanks...

Tim

[Daryl]

Harpullia pendula (Tulipwood) is really drought tolerant here and looks great no matter what conditions it grows in. Another good native is Flindersia schottiana, which looks nice and tropical, grows fairly quickly and is reasonably drought tolerant as well. Other Flindersia species are good too. Lophostemon confertus is also a good tough tree. They are not really ornamental flowering trees but look good anyway.

Daryl

[fastfeat]

Hey Matt--

As someone who used to spend a fair amount of time between Fallbrook, Rainbow, Anza and Elsinore (don't ask what I was doing... ), I can say that some of the worst cold damage I used to see in colder years was right in downtown Temecula. Not sure where you are, but if in the valley, I'd avoid the more tender things like Stenocarpus sinuatus and Metrosideros. (The latter won't like the inland heat either.) Stenocarpus takes awhile to establish, and even upper 20s in the first 5-7 years could really set it back. Not as hardy as related Macadamia.

Of the suggestions given, Castanospermum would be high on my list. Agreed with the advice given about training/pruning. It's a weird phenomenon that seems to occur in CA (but not in FL, where they're vigorous rockets straight out of the seed).

Angophora costata is a beautiful tree, but good luck finding now. (I could have sold you a boatload a few years ago, but...)

Melaleuca styphelioides (and the closely related M. decora) are top-notch heat-and cold-tolerant trees for inland areas with great bark and fine-textured foliage; sadly, they are currently tough to find in the trade. The smaller, but similar-feeling M. alternifolia (as Eric suggested), M. ericifolia,and M. linariifolia are available nowadays pretty readily, however.

Pittosporum phyllraeiodes and Geijera parviflora are small, weeping, easy. but maybe too commonplace for you?

[Eric in Orlando]

Is Acacia stenophylla used a lot out there? I have seen it become really common around Las Vegas, Phoenix, and Tucson. Nice weeping tree

[freakypalmguy]

A ton of good suggestions, thank you everyone. Here are the front runners so far,

Castanospermum australe

Angophora costata

Banksia integrifolia and has a lot of other interesting trees in the species,

Any info on Banksia prionotes?

[Justin]

Of all the Protea family members that I grow, Banksia are DEFINITELY the hardest to grow. They really don't like our soil - if there is even a hint of clay, not a chance in hell. If you have DG, the soil will be okay, but then you have to worry about air movement. If there isn't enough wind, which is definitely possible - even in Temecula - if you're in a subdivision, it will get sick and die. Within a couple days, nothing you can do. Also, too much water and they die, and any fertilizer whatsoever and they die. This can be great if they're on their own, but if they are on a line with other stuff that needs regular water, you're in trouble.

I have killed 75% of my Banksias, and the ones that have done best are at the top of slopes, which gives better drainage and also better air movement. For a tree in the middle of a flat yard, I don't really think that will work.

So consider yourself informed.

[freakypalmguy]

Of all the Protea family members that I grow, Banksia are DEFINITELY the hardest to grow. They really don't like our soil - if there is even a hint of clay, not a chance in hell. If you have DG, the soil will be okay, but then you have to worry about air movement. If there isn't enough wind, which is definitely possible - even in Temecula - if you're in a subdivision, it will get sick and die. Within a couple days, nothing you can do. Also, too much water and they die, and any fertilizer whatsoever and they die. This can be great if they're on their own, but if they are on a line with other stuff that needs regular water, you're in trouble.

I have killed 75% of my Banksias, and the ones that have done best are at the top of slopes, which gives better drainage and also better air movement. For a tree in the middle of a flat yard, I don't really think that will work.

So consider yourself informed.

My house is by itself on a top of a windy DG hill, might work at my place. Thank you Justin.

[Jonathan]

Of all the Protea family members that I grow, Banksia are DEFINITELY the hardest to grow. They really don't like our soil - if there is even a hint of clay, not a chance in hell. If you have DG, the soil will be okay, but then you have to worry about air movement. If there isn't enough wind, which is definitely possible - even in Temecula - if you're in a subdivision, it will get sick and die. Within a couple days, nothing you can do. Also, too much water and they die, and any fertilizer whatsoever and they die. This can be great if they're on their own, but if they are on a line with other stuff that needs regular water, you're in trouble.

I have killed 75% of my Banksias, and the ones that have done best are at the top of slopes, which gives better drainage and also better air movement. For a tree in the middle of a flat yard, I don't really think that will work.

So consider yourself informed.

My house is by itself on a top of a windy DG hill, might work at my place. Thank you Justin.

B. integrifolia is a tough plant - it would be fine for you probably, but its not as interesting to look at as a lot of the others.

Most of the East Coast species are easy to grow, the WA species can be a nightmare, even on my dry, windy, sandy block!

I've found Protea's harder to keep alive, which is ironic, as I live next to a Protea farm!

Banksia serrata is my favorite, and its pretty reliable, but not fast.

Cheers,

Jonathan

[MattyB]

Wow, I had no idea Banksia were so finicky. Great info Justin.

[philinsydney]

What about the Tree Waratahs (Alloxylon sp.)?

[bahia]

I'd agree that Lophostemon is a beautiful tree for coastal California conditions, but is not cold hardy enough to survive locations that get below 25F in winter on occasion, they all fried up here in the San Francisco Bay Area in the 1990 freeze. I love this one for the bark, which can look as colorful as the Mindanao Gum or our native Madrone. Brachychiton populneus would thrive in your conditions, this one does extremely well with desert heat and winds, and needs little water as well, but the flowers aren't showy from a distance, not much color to them. I've also not had much luck with various Banksia species that I have planted here in the SF Bay Area, they are touchy about drainage, soil type and soil ph. Another subtropical rainforest species from Australia that is also amazingly cold tolerant is Hymenosporum flavum, but this is rather weak wooded and not a great choice for a windy spot, but a beautiful tree in bloom and scent, and easily handles down to 20F without permanent damage besides leaf drop. I suspect that Tristaniopsis laurina might work for you, but this doesn't really have showy flowers either, though it is a very clean looking tree with nice bark, and is often mistaken for an acacia when it is dropping the small yellow flowers. I have seen some beautiful specimens of the Harpullia in seed down at the Los Angeles County Arboretum, but I didn't think this would be all that cold hardy in winter, as one never sees this tree in northern California.

One colorful Australian flowering tree that no one has mentioned so far is Grevillea robusta, which loves the heat, takes drought, is vividly colorful with orange blooms in early summer, but is also weak wooded and prone to wind damage. It is more cold hardy than a lot of other colorful evergreen trees, as it takes down to 20F on occasion here in northern California with little permanent damage.

[George Sparkman]

I am with Justin on this one.

I grow a good number of Proteaceae for cutflowers and

Banksia is the hardest to grow for me here in Fallbrook,CA.

Well,let me correct that I don't try to grow Banksia anymore.

Happy growing,

George Sparkman

Cycads-n-Palms.com

[plamfrong]

Yes, I was going to suggest looking into Alloxylon if you can find one. There are at least two species and both are spectacular. Telopea oreades may also grow into a small tree, albeit more slowly.

The comments on Banksia are interesting. I have about 25 species/selections, mostly in containers. I haven't found them to be difficult to grow, but on the occasion that I plant one in the ground it's usually in a raised bed of sand. However I do know that B. saxicola does fine on heavy clay or on loamy soil - and it's closely related to B. integrifolia. Most Banksias aren't really hardy up here anyways, but I do know one large B. marginata in a Bremerton garden that has persisted undamaged for many years. It is easy to grow as well. I don't even think most of the Western Australian species are difficult - at least I haven't killed any yet and I've got quite a few - the thing to remember is they must be kept on the dry side in summer. You can't plant them in a lawn or next to anything that likes water. You also can't fertilize them, except with slow-release organic products that lack phosphorus. Of the WA species my top pick for a tree would be either B. seminuda or B. grandis - both spectacular.

Edited October 13, 2009 by plamfrong

[Jonathan]

Yes, I was going to suggest looking into Alloxylon if you can find one. There are at least two species and both are spectacular. Telopea oreades may also grow into a small tree, albeit more slowly.

The comments on Banksia are interesting. I have about 25 species/selections, mostly in containers. I haven't found them to be difficult to grow, but on the occasion that I plant one in the ground it's usually in a raised bed of sand. However I do know that B. saxicola does fine on heavy clay or on loamy soil - and it's closely related to B. integrifolia. Most Banksias aren't really hardy up here anyways, but I do know one large B. marginata in a Bremerton garden that has persisted undamaged for many years. It is easy to grow as well. I don't even think most of the Western Australian species are difficult - at least I haven't killed any yet and I've got quite a few - the thing to remember is they must be kept on the dry side in summer. You can't plant them in a lawn or next to anything that likes water. You also can't fertilize them, except with slow-release organic products that lack phosphorus. Of the WA species my top pick for a tree would be either B. seminuda or B. grandis - both spectacular.

Try putting a few of those WA species in the ground - you might soon change your mind.

Even if they grow like a rocket for 3 years, they can still fall over dead for no reason!

Cheers,

Jonathan

[plamfrong]

Jonathan, seems to me that nowhere in Tas has summers dry enough to suit their preferences. Have you tried B. occidentalis? This seems like the easiest WA Banksia to grow I think.

Unfortunately I'm not putting any WA species in the ground here as it's simply too cold for them in winter.

[Jonathan]

Jonathan, seems to me that nowhere in Tas has summers dry enough to suit their preferences. Have you tried B. occidentalis? This seems like the easiest WA Banksia to grow I think.

Unfortunately I'm not putting any WA species in the ground here as it's simply too cold for them in winter.

Perth (WA) has about 750mm rainfall per year, Hobart (Tas) has 600mm, where I live east of Hobart we have about 450 - 500mm. Our rainfall, like south west WA is winter dominant. Also we have deep, free draining acid sandy soil.

So its not the rainfall thats the issue, I've read that there could be some micorrhizal associations missing - some people recommend throwing a handfull of soil from under an existing Banksia into the hole for the new plant....I havn't tried this.

I've killed B. occidentalis 3 times, I've given up on it.

B. praemorsa seems the easiest here, I've also had good luck with the ground cover species petiolaris and blechnifolia. I have one really good plant of speciosa, about 2m tall now, and two that died; B. grandis and brownii are hanging in there, and may actually grow this year!

You should be able to grow a lot of them to flowering size in big pots - there's a guy down here who has a specialist native plant bonsai nursery, and he's had success with Tas natives B. serrata and marginata.

Good luck with yours.

Cheers,

Jonathan

[plamfrong]

I still wouldn't rule out rainfall as being a major issue. I see that Perth gets about 20 - 30% as much rain as Hobart per summer month, which is a major difference. The amount of rain that falls in winter is less important. In the Pacific Northwest we've got a few native plants (and lots of plants in gardens from Oregon, California etc. where there is an even more pronounced summer dry season) that are sensitive to excessive summer water as well. On the very rare occasion that we have a heavy soaking rain in summer, they all start to get fungal leaf spots and look bad until the following year (or die outright in some cases). Most years we are pretty much dry all summer.

The UCSC Arboretum in California has an impressive collection of Banksias including many WA species. Their climate is just about right to accommodate them, wet winters with little frost, and totally dry summers. Historically it is really not even possible for a heavy rain to fall there anytime during their summer. I don't know if they have done anything special to encourage the right mycorrhizal associations, I kind of doubt it though.

I do have a lot of eastern Aus. Banksias as well and I water them much more liberally all summer. I've had problems with a couple species but for the most part they have been very easy to grow.

Someday I will be trying WA Banksias in the ground in a greenhouse along with a bunch of South African Proteas. We'll see how that goes I guess!