Self cleaning palms

[dalmatiansoap]

What palms are self cleaning? Can U help me to make a sort of list?

I know that Kings are but I dont know does it stands for all Arcontophoenix?

Whats with all others?

[Kumar]

I daresay more palms are self cleaning than not

Its mostly some of the palmate species in the coryphoid family - livistona, washingtonia, sabal, borassus, hyphanae, cocothrinax, thrinax, and phoenix that are not self cleaning - even among these there is plenty of variation.

I wonder how many pinnate palms are non self cleaning?

[sonoranfans]

sabal causiarum are self cleaning...

[PalmatierMeg]

No palmate palms self-clean

Self-Cleaning (off the top of my head)

Acanthophoenix

Adonidia

Archonotophoenix

Areca

Balaka

Basselinia

Carpoxylon

Chamaedorea

Chambeyronia

Clinostigma

Cyphophoenix

Drymophloeous

Dypsis

Euterpe

Lemurophoenix

Normanbya

Ptychosperma

Roystonea

Satakentia

Veitchia

Wodyetia

Non-self-cleaning

Allagoptera

Arenga

Butia

Burretiokentia

Cocos

Elaeis

Jubaea

Jubaeopsis

Parajubaea

Ravenea

Syagrus

There are more of both but these are what I remember best. I figure if a palm has a true crownshaft it self-cleans

[MattyB]

Here's a S. causiarum. It self cleans. Even Washingtonia self cleans after about 30 years.

[Jim in Los Altos]

No palmate palms self-clean

Self-Cleaning (off the top of my head)

Acanthophoenix

Adonidia

Archonotophoenix

Areca

Balaka

Basselinia

Carpoxylon

Chamaedorea

Chambeyronia

Clinostigma

Cyphophoenix

Drymophloeous

Dypsis

Euterpe

Lemurophoenix

Normanbya

Ptychosperma

Roystonea

Satakentia

Veitchia

Wodyetia

Non-self-cleaning

Allagoptera

Arenga

Butia

Burretiokentia

Cocos

Elaeis

Jubaea

Jubaeopsis

Parajubaea

Ravenea

Syagrus

There are more of both but these are what I remember best. I figure if a palm has a true crownshaft it self-cleans

Meg, My older Washintonia filabusta has been self cleaning for well over a decade now as are my neighbor's W robusta. Certain Syagrus will self clean as well. My S. sancona is self cleaning and so are my queens if I don't mind looking at a few dead fronds before they actually fall off. Brahea edulis is another self cleaning palmate palm as are some other Brahea.

[PalmatierMeg]

No palmate palms self-clean

Self-Cleaning (off the top of my head)

Acanthophoenix

Adonidia

Archonotophoenix

Areca

Balaka

Basselinia

Carpoxylon

Chamaedorea

Chambeyronia

Clinostigma

Cyphophoenix

Drymophloeous

Dypsis

Euterpe

Lemurophoenix

Normanbya

Ptychosperma

Roystonea

Satakentia

Veitchia

Wodyetia

Non-self-cleaning

Allagoptera

Arenga

Butia

Burretiokentia

Cocos

Elaeis

Jubaea

Jubaeopsis

Parajubaea

Ravenea

Syagrus

There are more of both but these are what I remember best. I figure if a palm has a true crownshaft it self-cleans

Meg, My older Washintonia filabusta has been self cleaning for well over a decade now as are my neighbor's W robusta. Certain Syagrus will self clean as well. My S. sancona is self cleaning and so are my queens if I don't mind looking at a few dead fronds before they actually fall off. Brahea edulis is another self cleaning palmate palm as are some other Brahea.

I learn something new every day. I always thought crownshafted palms alone self-cleaned. But I guess any palm will self-clean given enough motivation - Hurricane Charley proved that.

[Kumar]

Meg, you are a bit hard on the palmate community when you say that none of them self clean. Many do, and not neccessaily after 30 year time periods ...borassus, bismarckia and many livistona species do not have leaf bases at all.

I'd like to see a photo of a pinnate palm with conspicuous leaf bases. Does anyone have one?

[yachtingone]

Ravenea gluaca are self cleaning!

Randy

[PalmatierMeg]

I wasn't trying to be hard on palmate palms - many of my favorites, i.e., Coccothrinax, are palmate. I'm so excited my ignorance is sparking a lively debate.

[mjff]

Jubaea self cleans.

[dalmatiansoap]

Thanks folks!

What about Caryota familly?

[Kumar]

Thanks folks!

What about Caryota familly?

Caryota urens and gigas are largely self cleaning, though they tend to have fewer fronds in general and the internodes are very long - so it may appear to be non-self cleaning at times, particularly as their old lfronds take a long time to dry.

[palmislandRandy]

Meg, All my Burretiokentia are self cleaning.

Randy

[Steve Mac]

Did anyone mention Howia? Ours drop complete neat leaves even before they look like dying.

But the seed stalks stay there, not ugly like a dead leaf, but interesting in it's own special way.

[Kris]

Nice topic & valuable information...

Thanks,

kris.

[bgl]

I believe that the real definition of a self cleaning palm is one that efficiently sheds the oldest frond when it's time to do so. Only palms with crownshafts will do so. In other words, pinnate palms only. And most actually. No palmate palm has a true crownshaft, even though Mauritiella comes close. Yes, sure, all palms could in a sense be described as "self cleaning" because older fronds WILL fall off at some point in time even though it could take quite a while. I don't think that was what the initial question was all about. But feel free to correct me! And yes, Burretiokentias are most definitely considered selfcleaning (since they have crownhafts). Raveneas and Caryotas are not (no crownshaft).

[palmcurry]

Bo,

Thanks for giving us the recap. Wast sure what a 'self cleaning'palm was.

Cheers.

[Kumar]

I believe that the real definition of a self cleaning palm is one that efficiently sheds the oldest frond when it's time to do so. Only palms with crownshafts will do so. In other words, pinnate palms only. And most actually. No palmate palm has a true crownshaft, even though Mauritiella comes close. Yes, sure, all palms could in a sense be described as "self cleaning" because older fronds WILL fall off at some point in time even though it could take quite a while. I don't think that was what the initial question was all about. But feel free to correct me! And yes, Burretiokentias are most definitely considered selfcleaning (since they have crownhafts). Raveneas and Caryotas are not (no crownshaft).

Bo, I wonder why you stress so much on the crownshaft. While all crownshafted palms are usually self cleaning, I have seen royals where old fronds have broken away at the petiole, leaving 3-4 discarded leaf sheaths still clinging onto the stem, often for months. Conversely, there are many, many non-crownshafted palms which are as clean as royals - coconuts to take an example - Out of the thousands that I have seen perhaps only a dozen or so have an old leafbase (or more). I think 'self-cleaning' should mean the absence of old leafbases except a margin of perhaps one or two (taking into account climate and growing conditions)

[bgl]

Kumar,

I stressed crownshafted palms, because as a general rule, those are the ones that will typically shed older fronds in a more efficient manner. I saw this on a daily basis among many of the palms that I had planted in my old garden. Roystoneas and Clinostigmas are particularly efficient in shedding older fronds since those fronds are very heavy. That's the norm. Of course there could be exceptions when there's some type of damage, one way or another, and the process gets disrupted. But that would most definitely be an exception. Over the last five years, I probably removed, on average, 30 fronds a day that had fallen off crownshafted palms. That's about 200 a week or 10,000 in a year and 50,000 in five years. I'd say that gives me good insight into the issue. About the cocos nucifera. Yes, those fronds will also fall off, simply because of their weight. But, it WILL take a while, and a coconut palm is not even remotely as efficient in shedding old fronds as a crownshafted palm. Where I live now there are about a dozen fairly tall coconut palms right by the entrance so I get to observe this on a daily basis, and yes, of course, older fronds DO fall off. Sometimes in the middle of the night, creating quite a noise. It just takes a bit longer for them. And a coconut palm is almost never as clean as a Royal.

Bo-Göran