Livistona rigida

[edric]

8 months in ground, received this as a gift when Eric the botanist at H.P. Leu Gardens came to visit 11/2011, gets minimum 8-10 hours full Florida sun, losing some of it's red, I'm not sure if that's because of its age or the brutal sun that it was receiving, Ed

[MattyB]

Nice! Very Andy Warhol.

[Halekuma]

Edric, its normal for them to lose their red at that stage, mine is about the size of yours and has the same aspect. Its on a shady area so sun has little to do with its color.

[Trópico]

Hi edric I have one about the same size and is completely red. It receives full afternoon sun and reflected light from a white PVC fence. The others still in pots are several degrees of red depending on how much sun they get. But at that age they should still be mostly red. Don't worry, they are as gorgeous when full grown, taking on a nice sky blue hue.

[edric]

Thanks for the info fellas, the juvenile depicted here in San Carlos, is red, red, Matty sorry I missed your Birthday, Ed

http://www.palmpedia.net/wiki/Livistona_rigida

[Eric in Orlando]

Looks great !!! Good to see it growing well.

[sonoranfans]

rigidas are tough, they can take any sun florida has to offer. I had one in arizona in the hottest sun in north america, only bismarckias, hyphaene, phoenix, washies, and brahea armatas were more "sun tough..." Its among the toughest livistona species in sun. I exposed mine at a young age to full western AZ sun. My understanding is that the brighter the sun, the more color, like mariae...

[Mandrew968]

Livistona rigida and mariae are now the same palm, more or less...

[edric]

Livistona rigida and mariae are now the same palm, more or less...

Wrong Andrew, it's the other way around, it was a var. of L. mariae, but now is recognized, Ed

http://palmweb.org/?q=cdm_dataportal/taxon/846f77c8-5623-470d-99f0-b8438f96cddd

[tropicbreeze]

Livistona rigida is variable with redness. In habitat they grow in full sun, stronger than Florida or Arizona, but you still get red or green individuals as small plants. A number of other Livistonas are just as sun hardy, humilis, inermis, victoriae, alfredii, etc.

[Tom in Tucson]

Thanks for the info fellas, the juvenile depicted here in San Carlos, is red, red, Matty sorry I missed your Birthday, Ed

http://www.palmpedia...ivistona_rigida

Just to clarify the location: that should be the San Carlos region of San Diego.

High 59F, Low 50F - rain

[Daryl]

Livistona rigida is variable with redness. In habitat they grow in full sun, stronger than Florida or Arizona, but you still get red or green individuals as small plants. A number of other Livistonas are just as sun hardy, humilis, inermis, victoriae, alfredii, etc.

Yeah, the sun they cop is pretty strong. I lived down the track a bit at Daly Waters and it used to be pretty intense there, as well as Darwin of course. Suffering for it now though...

What a great plant though...I really like L.nasmophylla too (the 3rd variety of L.mariae in Rodd's revision). Glad Dowe got it all sorted out and made each one its own species.

Daryl

[edric]

Thanks for the info fellas, the juvenile depicted here in San Carlos, is red, red, Matty sorry I missed your Birthday, Ed

http://www.palmpedia...ivistona_rigida

Just to clarify the location: that should be the San Carlos region of San Diego.

High 59F, Low 50F - rain

Hi Tom,amendments made, thanks for your contribution, Ed

[tropicbreeze]

Livistona rigida is variable with redness. In habitat they grow in full sun, stronger than Florida or Arizona, but you still get red or green individuals as small plants. A number of other Livistonas are just as sun hardy, humilis, inermis, victoriae, alfredii, etc.

Yeah, the sun they cop is pretty strong. I lived down the track a bit at Daly Waters and it used to be pretty intense there, as well as Darwin of course. Suffering for it now though...

What a great plant though...I really like L.nasmophylla too (the 3rd variety of L.mariae in Rodd's revision). Glad Dowe got it all sorted out and made each one its own species.

Daryl

Daryl, it's certainly strong there, and all of those, apart from L. mariae, are from equatorial savanna, ie intense sun and little to no canopy above them.

Talking about Daly Waters, after years of driving past it, I finally drove into the airport. Totally unreal, it's amazing what the scrub can hide.

[Daryl]

HeHe..Daly Waters Airport...my dad used to work there,,,the milk run landed there daily...Vickers Viscounts and the like for many years, then Lockheed Electras and Focker Friendships...they used to fly from Darwin to Adelaide and all stops in between.

We lived over the road from the Daly Waters Pub...the town population was 14!

Went back and had a look in '86....not much had changed in almost 20 years

Daryl

[sonoranfans]

Yeah those equatorial spots in austrailia have more intense sun than AZ. I guess that palms have a tough time in AZ due to dryness, 8" rain a year. Combine hot sun with dry and you have dessication conditions that permit few plants, certainly no natural savannah. The only palm that can grow from a juvenile age in the lower desert without being on a water line is washingtonia filifera. I will say that my little rigida, planted from a quart strap leaf size( and on a water line) saw 30 110F+ days and 110 100F+ days in its first year in the ground, so it takes the heat too...

[Mandrew968]

Livistona rigida and mariae are now the same palm, more or less...

Wrong Andrew, it's the other way around, it was a var. of L. mariae, but now is recognized, Ed

http://palmweb.org/?...f0-b8438f96cddd

http://www.cosmosmagazine.com/node/5382/full

Edric, do I tell you how to spell your own name? Look at the link I provided and then get back to me.

[edric]

Livistona rigida and mariae are now the same palm, more or less...

Wrong Andrew, it's the other way around, it was a var. of L. mariae, but now is recognized, Ed

http://palmweb.org/?...f0-b8438f96cddd

http://www.cosmosmag.../node/5382/full

Edric, do I tell you how to spell your own name? Look at the link I provided and then get back to me.

My name has nothing to do with it, the article said "L. mariae is in fact genetically almost identical to a similar-looking palm, Livistona rigida", so their almost identical, but that means nothing, this material below is definitive Andrew, that is just an article.

The name Livistona mariae was first used by Mueller (1874b) in notes under L. leichhardtii, with which he considered that it may be conspecific. Previously, Mueller (1874b) had mentioned it only as the palm from the "Glen of Palms" collected by Gilles. These instances had no descriptions and in the former were considered as a provisional name only. A complete description in Mueller (1878) provided validation of the name. He named it in honour of the "... Grandi-principi Mariae, Ducissae Edinensi, cultus hortorum nobilioris tam in Russia quam nunc in Brittania patronae imperiali...". However, Mueller's description included elements ofanother species ("... Mill-stream fluminis Fortescue-River satis numerosa, F. Gregory, J. Forrest..."), later described as L. alfredii from Western Australia (Mueller, 1892). Subsequently, the identities of L. mariae and L. alfredii remained unclear to some botanists, with Gardner (1923) referring to the Millstream Palm (i.e. L. alfredii), as L. mariae and applying L. alfredii to yet another taxon in the Kimberleys. However, other taxonomists distinguished the two taxa (Drude, 1893; Beccari, 1931). The closeness of L. mariae to L. rigida has been recognised by some authors. Johnson (1981) wrote of the relationship of L. rigida:" very closely related to the Fan-Leaved Palm (L. mariae) of central Australia and may even be conspecific". Rodd (1998) resolved this by placing L. rigida as a subspecies of L. mariae, but noting his action as a temporary measure pending a thorough investigation. Considering the above, and while acknowledging that L. mariae and L. rigida are closely related, I have reinstated the latter to specific status. The leaves of L. rigida are comparatively smaller, the folding into a ?v? along the axis of the costa is considerably more pronounced and the segment apices are most often rigid rather than semi-pendulous. The fruit are also comparatively smaller. Although occasionally L. mariae produces smaller than average fruits and L. rigida larger than average fruits. Livistona mariae is a large canopy palm to 30 m tall; leaves are large and regularly segmented; segment apices are pendulous, and with a bifurcate cleft to 65% of the segment length; the inflorescence is unbranched, not extending beyond the limit of the crown, and with up to 14 partial inflorescences; bracts are loosely tubular and covered with dense white-grey scales; flowers are greenish cream to yellow; fruit are globose to 18 mm diam., and semi-glossy black at maturity. (Dowe, J.L.) this is gospel, Ed

[Moose]

Livistona rigida and mariae are now the same palm, more or less...

Wrong Andrew, it's the other way around, it was a var. of L. mariae, but now is recognized, Ed

http://palmweb.org/?...f0-b8438f96cddd

http://www.cosmosmag.../node/5382/full

Edric, do I tell you how to spell your own name? Look at the link I provided and then get back to me.

Bad Mojo reply

Edric - we have seen the related experiences about how much brutal sun this species can withstand. My question. knowing your location, is how much cold can it endure? I am presuming that you can get colder than the metropolitan Orlando area? Leu Gardens also has all those lakes creating a warming microclime.

How low can it go ...

[edric]

Livistona rigida and mariae are now the same palm, more or less...

Wrong Andrew, it's the other way around, it was a var. of L. mariae, but now is recognized, Ed

http://palmweb.org/?...f0-b8438f96cddd

http://www.cosmosmag.../node/5382/full

Edric, do I tell you how to spell your own name? Look at the link I provided and then get back to me.

Bad Mojo reply

Edric - we have seen the related experiences about how much brutal sun this species can withstand. My question. knowing your location, is how much cold can it endure? I am presuming that you can get colder than the metropolitan Orlando area? Leu Gardens also has all those lakes creating a warming microclime.

How low can it go ...

Hi Ron, yes it gets colder here by a few degrees, but Eric says it should take it, he told me " I brought you some cold hardy palms" not saying exactly how could hardy, but we'll see L. chinensis doesn't bat an eye at 25 f., baring in mind that was the coldest winter for us in recorded history, the year before was 26 f., but we had five years in a row before that with no freeze at all, Ed

[Mandrew968]

Edric, that's way too many words. Bottom line is that the two palms are the same palm--1500 years is not enough time for speciation.

Hey, I'm not going around, calling my Saribus rotundifolius a Livistona robinsoniana. The two palms are the same and we need to stop churching it all up--same palms