Sabals, Sabals, Sabals for Sabal Steve

[PalmatierMeg]

I told Sabal Steve I would take photos of some of the Sabal species I am growing. Why? If you have to ask this topic isn't for you.

First up is the group of Sabals I call "Sabal Row." They actually aren't on my property but on the vacant site east of our house. In the 20 years we have lived in CC the owner, who lives a couple miles away, has never visited the property. In 2008 I germinated a slew of Sabal seeds I obtained. Sabals are probably one of the easiest genera to grow from seeds. Around 2009 I started planting various seedlings with the hope they would eventually block out the house a couple lots away.

I planted the following Sabals: causiarum, domingensis, maritima, palmetto, mauritiiformis. They were the same age and 4-5 strat leaves. Over the years the tags disappeared and the only one I easily recognize is mauritiiformis. Anyway, Steve, put on your thinking cap: who is who?

Sabal Row:

[PalmatierMeg]

More Sabal Row:

Sabal minor opposite Sabal Row in my yard

Sabal minor Blountstown Dwarf set seeds last year

On my garden lot I've planted a number of Sabals

Sabal palmetto Lisa from seeds I collected

Sabal minor Emerald Island Giant from NC

Sabal bermudana

Sabal brazoria

[PalmatierMeg]

Sabal blackburniana aka ?????

Sabal minor with purported dwarf characteristics, from Savannah wild mother. I never saw photos of mother so who knows what I have?

Sabal guatemalensis from seeds given me by Peter in Guatemala

Finally, a Sabal palmetto of undetermined age. Apparently, it had struggled to survive on this barren lot for years if not decades. Cape Coral lot mowers mow vacant lots 6 times per year. It probably had mere weeks to grow grasslike tips before the mowers returned. After we bought our 3-lot site we ended mowing. Then we noticed this Sabal emerging from the ground only 12" inside our property line. We decided this survivor deserved a chance and let it grow. We fertilize it with our other palms. So, if it looks a little spidery or anemic, you know why. These are tough palms.

Survivor Sabal palmetto

[Mauna Kea Cloudforest]

The very last picture looks like sabal pumos.

[Sabal Steve]

Yes, Yes, Yes!

[Sabal Steve]

I feel that the deeper I slip into Sabal insanity, the more confused I become...

1st stretch of Sabal Row pictures, 2nd column, 4th row - This is from a different genus, however, I can't say which.

1st stretch of Sabal Row pictures - These all have a similarly formed trunk. Doesn't look to me to be any of the monster Sabals (Uresana, Domingensis/Causiarum, Maritima) Sabals which have a notable bottle look. If they look like anything, I would go with S. pumos (which is reported to have a bluish tinge, which seems present on at least some of them), S. Palmetto, or S. Blackburnia. If I had to guess, I would say that most if not all, are S. palmetto. S. pumos seems logical as well, and from my understanding is widely cultivated (at least in the past). The tall one in the back looks to be a S. yapa (If it is in fact a Sabal).

Within the row you photographed, I don't see S. mauritiformis, S. minor, S. yapa (except for the one in the background), S. maritima, S. domingensis/causiarum, or S. uresana. Other than that, I'm as baffled as most.

You have some really nice specimens, and I am quite fond of the Sabal brazoria - looks very Bismarckish. You also have a few species that I wasn't familiar with (like the Emerald Island Giant and Guatamalensis)- kudos to you!

[Sabal Steve]

My dog was curious as to which Sabal I have in my yard (And yes, I only have 1! A travesty!) If only she had asked, I would have told her.

Edited February 7, 2014 by Sabal Steve

[Mauna Kea Cloudforest]

Ooops, I mean sabal guatamalensis looks like my sabal pumos.

[Sabal Steve]

[Sabal Steve]

[Mauna Kea Cloudforest]

I just looked up sabal guatamalensis, it's the same as mexicana. I am pretty certain what you have is pumos.

[ErikSJI]

Awesome. Some regulars here.

[Brad Mondel]

Second column, fourth row is a Butia Odorata and Erik, your first photo is a bismarckia nobilis with Sabal palmetto behind it.

[PalmatierMeg]

I forgot to mention the interloper Butia I bought as a Big Box reject. It struggled but looks good now. Sorry for the oversight.

Curious thing about the IDs. To my knowledge I've never had access to S. puma, S. yapa or S. uresana. I'm trying to germinate S. uresana with no luck so far. I know about S. guatemalensis/mexicana but refer to it by its outdated name.

[_Keith]

I vow to add more Sabals to my garden this year. Thx for sharing.

[Palmdude]

Thought of you Steve when I took this photo

[Sabal Steve]

Thought of you Steve when I took this photo

You cant go wrong with sunset palm shots!

[Moose]

Don't forget the Boy in the White Shirt's uber rare Sabal Mr. Steve.

[Sabal Steve]

Don't forget the Boy in the White Shirt's uber rare Sabal Mr. Steve.

S. obstinanteii.

[_Keith]

Can Sabal palmetto handle root disturbance, maybe a lot of root disturbance when going from pot to inground?

[Sabal Steve]

Can Sabal palmetto handle root disturbance, maybe a lot of root disturbance when going from pot to inground?

I think it depends keith. I hastily dug six tiny seedlings out of the ground 4 are still alive and pushing growth about 8 months later. Thwy sat and did nothing for a long time. Also, I know that large trunking ones can be transplanted with a very high success rate. I've heard thay the sizes in between are real touchy though. But, if all of the roots remain unbroken, there would be a muchl higher chance of survival. Gut feeling - I think you would be fine, but it may park it for a while. Be liberal with the watering.

[PalmatierMeg]

Can Sabal palmetto handle root disturbance, maybe a lot of root disturbance when going from pot to inground?

I don't know why so-called "root sensitivity" in Sabals has reached earth shaking proportions. These are not Bismarckias. If you plant a Sabal from its pot you should have few problems, assuming you don't pound it with a sledge hammer. Given heat, sun & water they will grow happily in their usual Sabal manner.

You run into problems with Sabals when you dig them from the ground at a vulnerable stage in their lives. The rules I learned are as follows:

1) Small strap leaf seedlings can be dug up if you take reasonable care (no machetes or sledge hammers)

2) Palms with 6' or more trunk can be dug using the trenching method with time & care (see 1) above). Rootballs are ridiculously small on big Sabals awaiting transplant. That's because after planting the palms grow a whole new set of roots. You have to cut off all fronds except the spear to reduce transpiration. Large palms take time to start growing again but that's because they are working on new root systems.

3) But, do not dig Sabals with 4' or less of trunk. That's because the growing point is still underground and you will surely kill the palm when you mess up its growing point. Notice that all my Sabals have only 2' or less trunk. If someone tried to move them he would fatally damage their growing points, which extend deep into the ground. Only when the growing points clear the ground, i.e., when the trunks have topped 5-6' can they be dug up safely.

So, no, it's not about roots. It's about meristems. Otherwise, Sabals are tough.

[AlekLO]

Beautiful sabals PalmatierMag....

[Mauna Kea Cloudforest]

Can Sabal palmetto handle root disturbance, maybe a lot of root disturbance when going from pot to inground?

I don't know why so-called "root sensitivity" in Sabals has reached earth shaking proportions. These are not Bismarckias. If you plant a Sabal from its pot you should have few problems, assuming you don't pound it with a sledge hammer. Given heat, sun & water they will grow happily in their usual Sabal manner.

You run into problems with Sabals when you dig them from the ground at a vulnerable stage in their lives. The rules I learned are as follows:

1) Small strap leaf seedlings can be dug up if you take reasonable care (no machetes or sledge hammers)

2) Palms with 6' or more trunk can be dug using the trenching method with time & care (see 1) above). Rootballs are ridiculously small on big Sabals awaiting transplant. That's because after planting the palms grow a whole new set of roots. You have to cut off all fronds except the spear to reduce transpiration. Large palms take time to start growing again but that's because they are working on new root systems.

3) But, do not dig Sabals with 4' or less of trunk. That's because the growing point is still underground and you will surely kill the palm when you mess up its growing point. Notice that all my Sabals have only 2' or less trunk. If someone tried to move them he would fatally damage their growing points, which extend deep into the ground. Only when the growing points clear the ground, i.e., when the trunks have topped 5-6' can they be dug up safely.

So, no, it's not about roots. It's about meristems. Otherwise, Sabals are tough.

What you say seems to be consistent with what I've seen with mail ordering sabals. Strap leaf bare rooted do fine getting potted up. However, larger sabals past the strap leaf stage have not fared so well at all. The bare rooting has put them into shock and it's taken them over 9 months to recover and start growing again. Mine are just starting to improve.

However, there is some similarity with bismarckia. I've never had any issues with planting a potted sabal with undisturbed roots, but like a bismarckia they take a little time to get going. And they will experience major setback if roots go into the ground from the pot and get cut off.

[PalmatierMeg]

Beautiful sabals PalmatierMag....

Thanks, Alek