Newbie questions for Christmas Palm

[New to Palms]

Newbie looking for guidance with a Christmas Palm. At least I think it's a Christmas Palm???

A friend of mine found seeds on the ground under a palm in Florida. The palm looked like it had red berries hanging and from what we've been able to find we think it is a Christmas Palm. It has taking a few years to get to this size since planting the seed. To be honest, I'm excited that it actually sprouted knowing my track record for plants.

I transplanted the palm last year into a larger pot. I used Scott's palm mixture and water it using distilled water. I typically water it once per week, giving it 3-4 cups of water. I also spray the palm with distilled water using a spray bottle. The palm is indoors the majority of the time in a window that faces south. I do take it outside on the weekends. I would leave it out everyday, but we have pretty strong breezes and I'm concerned the wind will damage the palm. The palm will more than likely stay potted as I don't think it will survive the Missouri winter season.

With this information and the pics below, I'm hoping someone can give me guidance.

Is it healthy?

Should I water more or less?

Should I feed it? If yes, what product?

Should I trim off the brown leaves? Is there a thread for direction how to properly remove them?

Does it need more dirt?

Should I support the trunk?

There is one set of leaves that has brown spots. Is that sun damage?

Lastly, should I spray it for insects? If yes, with what product?

Thanks for looking. I'm sure someone will have some good advise.

[stevethegator]

Welcome to the forum!

The palm in question is a Veitchia species (likely Veitchia arecina) and not what is commonly known down here as "Christmas Palm" (Adonidia merillii) although both are related and have similar looking fruit.

Veitchia arecina is a tropical sepcies that doesn't like cold so good thing you have been growing it inside!

It is a large palm at maturity (up to 100' tall), and while it obviously won't ever get that big in a pot it will start producing leaves up to 6' long rather quickly if healthy so be prepared to give it some space.

I tried to grow this inside once in college and failed, veitchias like a lot of light indoors and they are very susceptible to spider mites. Yours looks relatively healthy and the fact that you've kept it indoors for a few years means you have already been taking good care of it.

I would go ahead and spray for insects because they could be responsible for the brown spots (also could be sun damage, see below). I like using neem oil as it is non-toxic to people and pets but it is slow acting so you will have to spray every 2 weeks or so for awhile to get rid of the bugs completely.

As far as the the brown fronds are concerned, they should pull off easily on their own if you start with the oldest ones first (veitchias have what is known as a "crown shaft" which means they rapidly shed dead fronds on their own). If they don't pull off easily, trimming fronds that are completely brown will not harm the plant at all.

As for the cultural requirements, make sure that when its indoors you place it in the sunniest spot possible as they do like a lot of light. However, if the palm has been somewhere darker make sure you acclimate it to the sunnier position slowly so as not to burn the fronds. When outdoors keep it in shade only, never take it from inside the house to full sun. Put it outside as much as you can when the temperatures are warm (above 65 during the day) and bring it inside if it is to fall below 50 at night.

Don't give it too much water and make sure the soil is well drained. Only water when the top surface of the soil is getting dry but don't let the soil completely dry out either. It is beneficial to "flood" the palm every now and again to flush out salts that may accumulate in the soil, just make sure the water drains away freely and it isn't sitting in water for any extended period of time.

To fertilize, any slow release granular houseplant fertilizer will be fine, use a small amount 2-4 times a year. You could also supplement this with some diluted liquid houseplant fertilizer occasionally as well.

Finally, like I said with good care it will get large eventually so plan on giving it plenty of room! Repot only when the roots start growing out of the drainage holes in the pot, keeping the palm root bound will keep it smaller longer.

Good luck!

Edited June 24, 2014 by stevethegator

[New to Palms]

Thank you! This is exactly what I am looking for! After reading your post, I'm guessing it has some sun damage. As mentioned, I put it out on the weekends and the front porch that faces south. That spot has a fair amount of sun. I'll try another spot that is shaded.

Thanks again!

[Jerry@TreeZoo]

Agree with what Steve said.

I looks like it may already have a spider mite problem or a nutritional problem or both. Try a clean sponge soaked in soapy water on it and wipe the undersides of the leaves. If you have spider mites it will leave a brownish smear on the sponge. The soap will kill the mites. If you have mites, repeat weekly until they are gone. You don't have to use distilled water on the palm, just make sure it is not cold water. If you collect rain water, that is good, but not necessary.

Use Dinomite fertlizer you get at one of the big box stores or preferably a small business garden center. Follow label directions. You can also use soluble fert but I would dilute it to at least quarter strength.

[New to Palms]

I'll see if our local store has it before going to big box. Is Dawn okay to use for the soapy water?

Thanks for the advice!

[doranakandawatta]

Bob,

I hope you have Green thumbs

Since I know the Veitchia (joannis or arecina…) from my experience in Sri Lanka I am afraid the atmospheric humidity in Missouri may be not high enough.
I am not sure keeping this palm outside can be a good and durable experience unless you give him a humid environment...

If sunny and dry : you should try Bismarckia!

[Funkthulhu]

My veitchia triple (in pot) was doing so well until it went outside this spring. The largest of the three has toppled completely. It is currently being held upright with wire and pipe-cleaners. . .

It's only about 2 feet high, so no big loss; but it is the largest juvenile I have from all the seed I collected in Ft Lauderdale 3 years ago.

[Kumar]

Hi and welcome to PT! Here's a photo of my Veitchia taken 4 years ago when it was the same size as yours. It's one of my fastest palms and is today about 8 feet high + 7 feet of spear -- in full shade I must add. It doesn't seem to slow down much in the dry months.

Edited June 24, 2014 by Kumar

[Kumar]

Welcome to the forum!

The palm in question is a Veitchia species (likely Veitchia arecina) and not what is commonly known down here as "Christmas Palm" (Adonidia merillii) although both are related and have similar looking fruit.

Veitchia arecina is a tropical sepcies that doesn't like cold so good thing you have been growing it inside!

Steve, how do you distinguish between V arecina and V joannis at that (juvenile) size?

[Cindy Adair]

Welcome to the forum! Lots of nice folks here with lots of good information!

[Tyrone]

To do well, these need a minimum of a subtropical environment and to be kept moist to do well. In the heat, these things are fast, provided they are fed and watered enough to keep up with their potential growth speed. They're a beautiful palm when well grown.

[stevethegator]

Welcome to the forum!

The palm in question is a Veitchia species (likely Veitchia arecina) and not what is commonly known down here as "Christmas Palm" (Adonidia merillii) although both are related and have similar looking fruit.

Veitchia arecina is a tropical sepcies that doesn't like cold so good thing you have been growing it inside!

Steve, how do you distinguish between V arecina and V joannis at that (juvenile) size?

Well it's nearly impossible but V. arecina is commonly planted in Florida these days, the other species are less common.

Since that is where the seeds came from Id imagine it's most likely arecina but it very well could be joannis

[Matt in OC]

I hate to hijack the thread, but would you guys mind taking a look at my A. Merillii seedlings? I bought 6 on ebay a few months ago and lost half of them to rot. These last three have been doing ok, but the worst looking has been brownish for a while, but new growth on all looks good.

I hadn't thought about spider mites, so I just did some soap and sponge. Any other thoughts? I'm taking care not to over-water and they are indoors in bright, indirect light.

[New to Palms]

Hi and welcome to PT! Here's a photo of my Veitchia taken 4 years ago when it was the same size as yours. It's one of my fastest palms and is today about 8 feet high + 7 feet of spear -- in full shade I must add. It doesn't seem to slow down much in the dry months.

DSCF0078.JPG

I would be happy with that!!!

[New to Palms]

Just a quick update. . .

The palm appears to still be growing okay. I'm not sure what I should expect in regard to growth rate.The leaves recently started showing signs of browning and the end of the leaves look like something might be eating at them. Then again, I know absolutely nothing about plants in general.I have been keeping it inside by a window that faces east, but not sure that is working to well. I rarely take it outside because I don't have a spot that is shaded. I either have morning sun, evening sun or full sun. If one of these will work please let me know. I am concerned about the leaves not looking so good.

Any advice would be appreciated,

Bob

[PalmatierMeg]

They need heat and really high humidity - think sweltering. Your house is probably too dry and if air conditioned (down to what temp?), probably too cold. Think 80-90 degrees or more. In FL they grow in full sun. Your house may be too dark even with an eastern window. Take yours outside and let it get some heat and at least morning sun. Summer's about over up there but give it some air until your nights fall below 45-50F. Finally, check for spider mites, which love dryness and hate humidity. Spray palm all over with insecticidal soap solution. Indoors, mist leaves often to raise humidity. This palm will suffer doubly in winter if you keep your house in the 60s along with low humidity from central heating.

[New to Palms]

They need heat and really high humidity - think sweltering. Your house is probably too dry and if air conditioned (down to what temp?), probably too cold. Think 80-90 degrees or more. In FL they grow in full sun. Your house may be too dark even with an eastern window. Take yours outside and let it get some heat and at least morning sun. Summer's about over up there but give it some air until your nights fall below 45-50F. Finally, check for spider mites, which love dryness and hate humidity. Spray palm all over with insecticidal soap solution. Indoors, mist leaves often to raise humidity. This palm will suffer doubly in winter if you keep your house in the 60s along with low humidity from central heating.

Thank you for the feedback! During the summer we keep the AC around 74 degrees. What do you recommend for the insecticidal soap solution? I used a damp paper towel and wiped the bottom of the leaves and did not see anything on the towel. I have noticed some type of gnats around the palm, typically on the pot itself or on the soil. I spray the palm with plain water 3-5 days per week. I need to add another inch of soil to the pot. The soil in the spot now is Miricle Grow Palm potting mix. Unfortunately, I can't find any at our local stores. Any idea what to use for soil?

Thanks again for the help,

Bob

[New to Palms]

Moderator, please delete this duplicate post.

Edited August 26, 2015 by New to Palms

[Hammer]

They need heat and really high humidity - think sweltering. Your house is probably too dry and if air conditioned (down to what temp?), probably too cold. Think 80-90 degrees or more. In FL they grow in full sun. Your house may be too dark even with an eastern window. Take yours outside and let it get some heat and at least morning sun. Summer's about over up there but give it some air until your nights fall below 45-50F. Finally, check for spider mites, which love dryness and hate humidity. Spray palm all over with insecticidal soap solution. Indoors, mist leaves often to raise humidity. This palm will suffer doubly in winter if you keep your house in the 60s along with low humidity from central heating.

Thank you for the feedback! During the summer we keep the AC around 74 degrees. What do you recommend for the insecticidal soap solution? I used a damp paper towel and wiped the bottom of the leaves and did not see anything on the towel. I have noticed some type of gnats around the palm, typically on the pot itself or on the soil. I spray the palm with plain water 3-5 days per week. I need to add another inch of soil to the pot. The soil in the spot now is Miricle Grow Palm potting mix. Unfortunately, I can't find any at our local stores. Any idea what to use for soil?

Thanks again for the help,

Bob

I gotta disagree with Meg, I would stop spraying the leaves immediately. Rain water outside is fine. But avoid tap water. In other words, find other ways to raise humidity. If spider mites are a concern, continue to wipe the leaves with a damp cloth that has soap. Dish soap or hand soap will work.

It sounds like you have a soil that retains too much water...giving you the gnats. The palm will appreciate a lot of water but a better draining soil will help you out a lot. Imho.

Finally, I do agree, warmer temps and more light will make the palm happier. Maybe not full sun all day. That may be too much of a shock at the moment. But some time outside will be appreciated. Your hot and humid Missouri weather should do nicely.

[PalmatierMeg]

The gnats may be fungus gnats. You may be keeping the soil too wet - soggy mix can suffocate the roots and promote the gnats, whose larvae live in wet soil. Consider repotting it in a clean pot and very well-draining potting mix. Add pumice or extra perlite to improve drainage. Also study the roots. Healthy roots should be white. Rotting roots will be black. If the roots rot they can't support the rest of the palm and it dies.

[New to Palms]

I transplanted to the current pot a little over 2 years ago. I put a few inches of pea sized rocks (like small river rock) in the bottom of the pot then filled it with Miricle Grow Palm potting mix? The pot has a 2" hole in the bottom that I covered with a piece of metal mesh to allow water to drain without losing and of the contents. I have been spraying the palm a couple times per week (not soaking as it is in the house and on a table) with distilled water and then giving it 2-3 cups of distilled water once every 7-10 days. The top couple of inches of soil feels dry when I get around to watering.

This week, I have been putting the palm outside (north side) everyday for 12-14 hours. It is getting morning sun for a few hours, then shade for 7-8 hours, followed by a few hours of evening sun. I have been spraying it with distilled water every morning this week. I would leave it out overnight, but the deer seem to eat anything we have in a pot.

Thoughts?

[Hammer]

Sounds like the sun situation is much improved. Palm should be happier. But it may take a while to notice the visible signs of improvement.

Again, I am not a fan of misting palm leaves. Especially one that is stressed. I have killed my fair share of palms as a result of moisture getting into the crown and rotting it out.

I agree with Meg that something seems to be up with the soil. It seems that your soil in retaining water causing some possible root rot. Yet the photos look like there are signs of not enough water too. You might try to drench the roots with hydrogen peroxide. If there is some rot occurring that will help kill the harmful nasties.

You might consider repotting with a cactus mix soil for better drainage. And then upping the frequency of watering.

Once the palm starts to come out of its funk, maybe add some slow release palm fertilizer to the pot.

[New to Palms]

Sounds like the sun situation is much improved. Palm should be happier. But it may take a while to notice the visible signs of improvement.

Again, I am not a fan of misting palm leaves. Especially one that is stressed. I have killed my fair share of palms as a result of moisture getting into the crown and rotting it out.

I agree with Meg that something seems to be up with the soil. It seems that your soil in retaining water causing some possible root rot. Yet the photos look like there are signs of not enough water too. You might try to drench the roots with hydrogen peroxide. If there is some rot occurring that will help kill the harmful nasties.

You might consider repotting with a cactus mix soil for better drainage. And then upping the frequency of watering.

Once the palm starts to come out of its funk, maybe add some slow release palm fertilizer to the pot.

How do you drench the roots in peroxide? Maybe I should repot with new soil, that way I can see what the roots look like???

[PalmatierMeg]

Sounds like the sun situation is much improved. Palm should be happier. But it may take a while to notice the visible signs of improvement.

Again, I am not a fan of misting palm leaves. Especially one that is stressed. I have killed my fair share of palms as a result of moisture getting into the crown and rotting it out.

I agree with Meg that something seems to be up with the soil. It seems that your soil in retaining water causing some possible root rot. Yet the photos look like there are signs of not enough water too. You might try to drench the roots with hydrogen peroxide. If there is some rot occurring that will help kill the harmful nasties.

You might consider repotting with a cactus mix soil for better drainage. And then upping the frequency of watering.

Once the palm starts to come out of its funk, maybe add some slow release palm fertilizer to the pot.

How do you drench the roots in peroxide? Maybe I should repot with new soil, that way I can see what the roots look like???

Unpot the palm, rinse soil off the roots so you can see them. Stand the palm in a bucket or container then fill the container with H2O2 from the bottle until the roots are covered. If the H2O2 fizzes you know the peroxide is working on problem areas (H2O2 disinfects dead/damaged tissue but leaves healthy tissue alone). I'd soak the roots for an hour, rinse, then repot in fresh potting mix.

[New to Palms]

Yesterday, I left the palm out and the soil got a full flush from rain storm that pushed through. Ill give it a few days to see how it looks after getting rain water for the first time along with flushing out the soil. I'll grab the necessary product to repot this weekend.

Thanks for the feedback,

Bob

[New to Palms]

I'm getting ready to repot as some suggested. I have a couple of bags of Miricle Grow Cactus and Palm potting soil along with a bag of Perlite and peroxide. Any opinions on how much Perlite I should use? I plan to reuse the same pot if it is the appropriate size. Should I replant at the same depth in the pot or maybe add more soil to get the palm higher in the pot? What about drainage? There is a hole in the bottom approximately 5cm in diameter. Should I drill more holes? You can see the small rock I have in the bottom of the pot as well. I've attached a few pics if it helps. I haven't disturbed the palm yet, just getting ready.

Pics aren't great, the pot is approximately 32cm diameter, 32cm tall. Palm is approximatley 51cm above the soil, trunk 2cm.

Thank you in advance for your suggestions

Edited September 6, 2015 by New to Palms

[Hammer]

I'm getting ready to repot as some suggested. I have a couple of bags of Miricle Grow Cactus and Palm potting soil along with a bag of Perlite and peroxide. Any opinions on how much Perlite I should use? I plan to reuse the same pot if it is the appropriate size. Should I replant at the same depth in the pot or maybe add more soil to get the palm higher in the pot? What about drainage? There is a hole in the bottom approximately 5cm in diameter. Should I drill more holes? You can see the small rock I have in the bottom of the pot as well. I've attached a few pics if it helps. I haven't disturbed the palm yet, just getting ready.

Pics aren't great, the pot is approximately 32cm diameter, 32cm tall. Palm is approximatley 51cm above the soil, trunk 2cm.

Thank you in advance for your suggestions

For your own health, I would suggest using pumice over perlite.

[New to Palms]

Where is the best place to look for pumice? What should I be looking for? When you say my own health, is there a health concern with Perlite?

[PalmatierMeg]

Perlite is dusty so wear a mask when you use it (preferably outdoors). Don't take off mask until you are done. Can't speak for MO but pumice is impossible to find in FL. Most people never heard of it. You can probably find some on eBay and it will cost you but if you only need a little go for it. I'd have to remortgage the house to buy what I need. Some people push vermiculite but I dislike the stuff.

[New to Palms]

Perlite is dusty so wear a mask when you use it (preferably outdoors). Don't take off mask until you are done. Can't speak for MO but pumice is impossible to find in FL. Most people never heard of it. You can probably find some on eBay and it will cost you but if you only need a little go for it. I'd have to remortgage the house to buy what I need. Some people push vermiculite but I dislike the stuff.

The big box retailers (only shops open today) did not have it. One of the associates that I talked to, said they had never heard of it. I saw vermiculite, but I was confused by the label. In one area it said great for drainage, while another are on the bag said great for retaining moisture??? I'll see if I can find pumice at our local nursery. I think I might have a hard time finding a small bag though.

What do you think about the pot size? Am I good keeping it in this pot?

Edited September 6, 2015 by New to Palms

[Hammer]

Perlite is dusty so wear a mask when you use it (preferably outdoors). Don't take off mask until you are done. Can't speak for MO but pumice is impossible to find in FL. Most people never heard of it. You can probably find some on eBay and it will cost you but if you only need a little go for it. I'd have to remortgage the house to buy what I need. Some people push vermiculite but I dislike the stuff.

The big box retailers (only shops open today) did not have it. One of the associates that I talked to, said they had never heard of it. I saw vermiculite, but I was confused by the label. In one area it said great for drainage, while another are on the bag said great for retaining moisture??? I'll see if I can find pumice at our local nursery. I think I might have a hard time finding a small bag though.

What do you think about the pot size? Am I good keeping it in this pot?

I would think the pot size is probably good. Wouldn't necessarily increase it. But it's always hard to tell when looking at photos online.

I would urge great care with the roots. Avoid damage to the roots if at all possible.

[New to Palms]

I am a little concerned as a few have mentioned rinsing off the roots. I always thought it was a bad idea to disturb the root ball.

[PalmatierMeg]

I wouldn't wash off roots unless you have reason to believe they may have rot and want to confirm (healthy roots are white) or if your potting mix is sludgy. I wouldn't waste valuable time hunting your area for pumice. Check online.

[New to Palms]

I decided to hold off when I noticed a new frond. Although, this new frond doesn't look the same. It isn't green, but more yellow. Is this more to be concerned about? 

[New to Palms]

How do the roots look to you?

 

 

[aztropic]

Root system looks healthy to me.

Aztropic

Mesa, Arizona

 

[Hammer]

I agree with Aztropic.  Those roots look fantastic. 

[New to Palms]

The Palm isn't looking so good after repotting. I'm hoping I didn't do something wrong. I'm not sure what to do. Any ideas?

 

Edited October 2, 2015 by New to Palms

[Pal Meir]

Your palm doesn't look good although the roots seem to be healthy, but also quite dry. – It is very risky to replant a sick palm again and again, but I think you should choose a much smaller pot and another soil mix which excellent drainage allowing regular (i.e. almost daily) watering (something like e.g. "French pine bark 2-8 mm" here in Europe) without getting soggy. Then put the palm on a very light place, but not in direct sun. Maybe you have to protect it also with a transparent plastic bag against drying out …

[doranakandawatta]

Being a tropical gardening amateur I would cover this plant under a transparent  plastic bag in order to keep a higher humidity of the atmosphere...