Photos Of Coconut Palms In The Rio Grande Valley

[Mr. Coconut Palm]

Here is a link to some photos of some mature and semi mature Coconut Palms in the Rio Grande Valley.  They include photos of mature Mexican Talls, mature Green Malayan Dwarfs, and some other mature ones that I am not sure of the variety.  Some of the palms have coconuts on them.  Most of these photos were taken about 2 to 3 years ago, but the last photos of the mature Green Malayan Dwarf with immature coconuts on it were taken about a year ago.  As far as I know, all of these palms are survivors of the 2011 freeze, which did kill some Coconut Palms, especially immature ones in the Rio Grande Valley, and a few of these palms like the first two tall Mexican Talls survived the Christmas snowstorm in Brownsville in 2004, the first time that Brownsville had measurable snow in 105 years.  Most Rio Grande Valley Coconut Palms would fruit more often and grow larger coconuts if they were adequately watered in the hot dry months, but since it is a semi arid climate and many of these palms do not receive sufficient water, they only sporadically fruit and usually do not develop fully mature nuts due to lack of watering, though I have personally seen two large nuts on a couple of palms years ago, so the nuts can grow to maturity there.

There are more Coconut Palms scattered throughout the Rio Grande Valley (RGV), with some as far inland as the McAllen/Edinburg area.  I personally know of a large mature Mexican Tall growing in a rural backyard of a country home a few miles north of Edinburg in an area that probably gets 2 to 3 frosts in a normal winter.  It would be fruiting too if adequately watered as I informed the homeowner when I met him about a year ago.  I wish I would have had my camera with me, as this is the farthest inland mature Coconut Palm that I know of in the RGV.  I have seen at least a couple of mature Golden Malayans in the RGV, one that used to be in a yard of a home facing the freeway in San Benito, but it is no longer there, and one in the ground at a nursery in Bayview, northeast of Brownsville.  There are more Coconut Palms in the Bayview area, and in the Port Isabel area.

John

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=1708059492769609&set=oa.1662652573995239&type=3

Edited February 13, 2016 by Mr. Coconut Palm

[Palmaceae]

Nice pictures John, good to see coconut palms growing there!

[Mr. Coconut Palm]

42 minutes ago, Palmaceae said:

Nice pictures John, good to see coconut palms growing there!

Thanks, Randy.  If I could convince more people to keep them adequately watered in the hot dry months and to use MicroLife Organic Fertilizer, then I think most of them would produce nuts on a regular basis, plus be a little stronger and healthier and have a little more cold tolerance going into each winter.

[Zeeth]

Nice pics! How old do you think the oldest ones are? 

[Xerarch]

Here are the two on Red Snapper on google street view in April 2011 right after a harsh winter with unusually brutal temperatures.  They both look terrible so I'm happy to see how well both of them (and others) have recovered.   These are the most recent street view photos so it's hard to have a good time street view palm hunting on SPI. 

[Silas_Sancona]

Great to see Coconuts from the west side of the Gulf. Nice pictures John

[RedRabbit]

Thanks for sharing John!

[Mr. Coconut Palm]

4 hours ago, Zeeth said:

Nice pics! How old do you think the oldest ones are? 

Hey Keith,

The big Mexican Talls at the Flamingo Motel in Brownsville are about 20 years old.  A member of the family that owns the motel brought them over as sprouted nuts from Matamoros in the late '90's.  I suppose they hid them well and it was probably a day when the Customs inspectors weren't checking much.  They are definitely Mexican Talls, and they have occasionally fruited.  One year I saw a large nut on each of the palms.  I have told the family there that they need to keep them well watered in the hot dry summers if they want them to fruit more, but I don't think they listened.  Also they had tree trimmers come over the years that used spikes to climb the palms, leaving ugly black holes in the trunks, which I promptly corrected them on, telling them that it is very BAD for palms and opens them up to pest and disease problems.

The bad news is that both of these palms are probably dead and have been removed now, as a little over a year ago, it looked like both of them had contracted Lethal Yellowing.  What a shame for the two oldest most robust Mexican Tall Coconut Palms that I know of in the RGV!  If only I could have gotten a few viable nuts off of them!

John

[Mr. Coconut Palm]

4 hours ago, Xerarch said:

Here are the two on Red Snapper on google street view in April 2011 right after a harsh winter with unusually brutal temperatures.  They both look terrible so I'm happy to see how well both of them (and others) have recovered.   These are the most recent street view photos so it's hard to have a good time street view palm hunting on SPI. 

Ammon,

That was a bad freeze that wiped out 9 of the 13 Green Malayans at the place on the resaca in Brownsville that I posted the last photos from.  The owner had planted 13 of them, but fortunately 4 survived, which is amazing considering that these talls on the Island (a slightly milder climate) looked so bad after the freeze.

John

[Mr. Coconut Palm]

48 minutes ago, Silas_Sancona said:

Great to see Coconuts from the west side of the Gulf. Nice pictures John

Thanks, Nathan.  I hope to become the Johnny Appleseed of the Coconut Palm on the South Texas Coast!

John

[cm05]

Nice!! I've always read about Texas coconuts but I've never seen any until now. Thanks for sharing.

Edited February 14, 2016 by cm05

[Mr. Coconut Palm]

9 minutes ago, RedRabbit said:

Thanks for sharing John!

You're welcome, Tiberius.

[Mr. Coconut Palm]

41 minutes ago, cm05 said:

Nice!! I've always read about Texas coconuts but I've never seen any until now. Thanks for sharing.

You're welcome, C.M.  I am glad everyone has enjoyed the photos and descriptions.  The next time I am in the Rio Grande Valley, I will try to get some recent photos of them.  I am always on the lookout for new ones that I haven't seen before, and have kind of developed a keen radar sense when it comes to finding them.

[Really full garden]

It has been my experience that crotons are a very good indicator of where Coconuts can survive. If you can keep crotons alive with little foliage drop for three consecutive years that is a good indication that a coconut will survive as well.

[palmfriend]

John, 

thank you very much for sharing these pictures!

I have printed out a map with the so called "coconut belt" which is quite interesting to look at!

Focussing on an area and recalling what I know about the coconuts growing there is a very

satisfying task and I am very thankful to fill gaps about areas I do not know much about.

It seems that the Mexican ones do pretty well in Texas while Malayans obviously need 

a lot of care. Very interesting!

I think I am going to put some more efforts in learning about the different types of coconut

palms - I am pretty sure we have plenty of varieties here as well and it might be a good 

contribution to the forum to round up the picture about what kind of coconuts are 

grown or have a good chance to be grown here or there (in the world).

best regards

Lars

 

[Yunder Wækraus]

On 2/14/2016, 12:06:44, scottgt said:

It has been my experience that crotons are a very good indicator of where Coconuts can survive. If you can keep crotons alive with little foliage drop for three consecutive years that is a good indication that a coconut will survive as well.

Does this apply to CA?

[Really full garden]

13 minutes ago, Yunder Wækraus said:

Does this apply to CA?

I am not familiar with CA,but crotons are very sensitive to long cold spells (leaf drop), crotons are very sensitive to lack of mositure (leaf drop). Heat, moisture are also key factors in establishing Cocos.

[palmfriend]

On 2016/2/15 2:06:44, scottgt said:

It has been my experience that crotons are a very good indicator of where Coconuts can survive. If you can keep crotons alive with little foliage drop for three consecutive years that is a good indication that a coconut will survive as well.

That is a very interesting fact! Crotons are growing here everwhere - they are beautiful! The leaves of one plant combine four or more different colors.

Some of them are sold cheap, others are quite expensive.

Thank you for sharing this information!

best regards

 

[Mr. Coconut Palm]

On ‎2‎/‎14‎/‎2016‎ ‎11‎:‎06‎:‎44‎, scottgt said:

It has been my experience that crotons are a very good indicator of where Coconuts can survive. If you can keep crotons alive with little foliage drop for three consecutive years that is a good indication that a coconut will survive as well.

Scott,

That sounds like a good way to tell, but which Croton varieties?  I have found that the Mamies do pretty well here, but the Petras sometimes drop there leaves in the winter.

John

[Mr. Coconut Palm]

16 hours ago, palmfriend said:

John, 

thank you very much for sharing these pictures!

I have printed out a map with the so called "coconut belt" which is quite interesting to look at!

Focussing on an area and recalling what I know about the coconuts growing there is a very

satisfying task and I am very thankful to fill gaps about areas I do not know much about.

It seems that the Mexican ones do pretty well in Texas while Malayans obviously need 

a lot of care. Very interesting!

I think I am going to put some more efforts in learning about the different types of coconut

palms - I am pretty sure we have plenty of varieties here as well and it might be a good 

contribution to the forum to round up the picture about what kind of coconuts are 

grown or have a good chance to be grown here or there (in the world).

best regards

Lars

 

Lars,

I'm glad you like the pictures and info.  Check back here tomorrow, and when I have a little more time, I will try to post a link to another mature Mexican Tall that I found a couple of pictures of from last year.  It is the largest inland growing Coconut Palm I know of in the Rio Grande Valley, growing in the country outside of any heat island effect a few miles northeast of Edinburg, which is just north of McAllen.

John

[Really full garden]

9 hours ago, Mr. Coconut Palm said:

Scott,

That sounds like a good way to tell, but which Croton varieties?  I have found that the Mamies do pretty well here, but the Petras sometimes drop there leaves in the winter.

John

John, I am talking about landscape type crotons.The large growing yellow leaved ones. Petra is not a good indicator because it was developed somewhere in former Yugoslavia as a house plant not really intended for landscape use.

[Mr. Coconut Palm]

11 hours ago, scottgt said:

John, I am talking about landscape type crotons.The large growing yellow leaved ones. Petra is not a good indicator because it was developed somewhere in former Yugoslavia as a house plant not really intended for landscape use.

Hey Scott,

I am only familiar with the Petras, Mamies, and Gold Dust (I think that is the name of the green leaved one that is sprinkled with lots of gold colored dots all over it, thus the name.)  I am sure like many other tropical trees and plants that there are many varieties, but that is pretty much it that we have over here.

John

P.S.  Check back here shortly and I should have the link to the photos of the mature Mexican Tall northeast of Edinburg posted here.

[Mr. Coconut Palm]

Here are a couple of photos of a mature Mexican Tall Coconut Palm in the country outside Edinburg, Texas, which is just north of McAllen.  This area is probably a low end 10A Climate and probably receives about 3 frosts on average each winter, which goes to show you that the right variety of Coconut Palm can not only survive but grow to maturity in subtropical Zone 10A climates that experience a few frosts and even light freezes on a fairly regular annual basis.

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=1709819409260284&set=pcb.1664297053830791&type=3&relevant_count=2

[Zeeth]

10 hours ago, Mr. Coconut Palm said:

Here are a couple of photos of a mature Mexican Tall Coconut Palm in the country outside Edinburg, Texas, which is just north of McAllen.  This area is probably a low end 10A Climate and probably receives about 3 frosts on average each winter, which goes to show you that the right variety of Coconut Palm can not only survive but grow to maturity in subtropical Zone 10A climates that experience a few frosts and even light freezes on a fairly regular annual basis.

 

That one looks pretty good! It would be nice if it ever set viable fruit. That'd be a good one to try in marginal areas. 

[Mr. Coconut Palm]

11 hours ago, Zeeth said:

 

That one looks pretty good! It would be nice if it ever set viable fruit. That'd be a good one to try in marginal areas. 

Exactly what I was thinking, Keith, but the problem is that most people who have Coconut Palms in the RGV don't adequately water them during the hot dry months.  If they would just water them enough, I am sure they would have nuts on them most years.  It is my dream to get a few viable nuts from mature palms in the RGV and sprout them to plant up here in Corpus Christi.  The Mexican Tall so far, is the variety that has the most promise for relatively long term growth (15 to 20 + years between coconut killinghard freezes) with some nut production for home consumption in the RGV, and for growth as a viable coastal ornamental palm here in Corpus Christi that will occasionally produce nuts ( I think they could last about 8 to 12+ years here between killing hard freezes).  If the two previous winters here had been as mild as this one, or even just normal winters, instead of the two back to back chilly damp winters that they were, I am sure that this palm and all of them in the RGV would look twice as good.

John

[Zeeth]

How cold was that area in 2010 and 2004? The Edinburg airport says 27˚ for Dec 2010, 24˚ for Jan 2010, and 23˚ for 2004. The last 2 numbers sound way too low for coconut survival to me. 

[Mr. Coconut Palm]

The last across the board Coconut Palm killing freeze in the RGV was the 1989 freeze, and before that the 1983 freeze, but before that, I don't think there was a killing hard freeze since the 1960's.  Since the 1989 freeze, the 2011 freeze probably wiped out about 30% of the Mexican Talls, most likely younger ones and ones that weren't as healthy and too neglected, as well as the ones further inland in cooler 10A regions (at night in the winter). The one in the photo above survived the 2011 freeze and probably the 2004 Christmas snowstorm in which a couple of inches of snow fell along the South Texas Coast and RGV, but not accompanied by a killing hard freeze (I think the temp dropped briefly to the upper 20's, but warmed up above freezing pretty quickly).  However, the 2011 freeze probably wiped out about 80% + of the Green Malayans and Golden Malayans in the RGV, with virtually all the survivors from the east side of Brownsville toward Port Isabel and South Padre Island.  My best guess is that there were no Malayan survivors west of a Harlingen to Brownsville line.  I personally know of a few mature Green Malayans that survived the 2011 freeze on the north side of Harlingen, but they were really cold injured and took a couple of years to recover.  Now, they look pretty good again, though at least two or three at that location died.   With both the tall and dwarfs, like in Central and South Florida, survival rates during bad winters are higher closer to the water.

[Zeeth]

Do you think the temperatures in Edinburgh were warmer than the airport recorded? 

[Mr. Coconut Palm]

15 minutes ago, Zeeth said:

Do you think the temperatures in Edinburgh were warmer than the airport recorded? 

Keith,

I didn't know it got that cold there during that time frame.  It was the 2011 freeze I was referring to, but whatever the temps got down to, that Mexican Tall was in the ground during the freezing temps and survived.  It is way too big to have grown that much in just 5 years, and as I recall when I met the homeowner who has a small nursery there, he told me it had been in the ground for years before then.  He got the palm when it was little from a roadside vendor in the area.

John

[oliver]

Can someone identify the variety of this one. I planted it 10 years ago at my office in Brownsville. I brought it back from Matamoros (when it was still safe to go there for dinner) from a street vendor at a 5 gallon size. It gets some brown leaves in the winter (as you can witness right now) but has been growing well. Last year, I did get several viable fruits that have germinated. It is well protected from the building from the north winds, as are the other tropical palms around it.

[Cluster]

Some very nice looking coconuts here especially considering the conditions they are facing. I still think coconuts are very tropical but with all the data gathered from the US enthusiasts it is clear that some varieties are indeed more resistant to cold and others that are probably almost as sensitive as lipsticks in terms of heat requirements. 

[Xenon]

On 2/18/2016, 8:08:14, Zeeth said:

Do you think the temperatures in Edinburgh were warmer than the airport recorded? 

Looks like the airport is significantly north of the city (~12 miles) and located in a very unpopulated area. Temperatures in Edinburg are probably closer to the readings in McAllen. 

[Xenon]

Here's another one (growing on an abandoned lot and recovering from 2011 freeze...there are actually a few growing on abandoned lots):

Here is the same palm in 2007: https://www.google.com/maps/@26.0810139,-97.2535101,3a,75y,15.27h,84.11t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sO-_jlUiT8JvjeiDHm9B84w!2e0!7i3328!8i1664!6m1!1e1

Another abandoned coconut (on South Padre Island)...amazing that it survived the 2011 freeze. Look at how sad the queen palm next to it looks...pic taken in 2012.

This one must have been the champion in Texas

[Mr. Coconut Palm]

4 hours ago, oliver said:

Can someone identify the variety of this one. I planted it 10 years ago at my office in Brownsville. I brought it back from Matamoros (when it was still safe to go there for dinner) from a street vendor at a 5 gallon size. It gets some brown leaves in the winter (as you can witness right now) but has been growing well. Last year, I did get several viable fruits that have germinated. It is well protected from the building from the north winds, as are the other tropical palms around it.

Hi Oliver,

It looks like a Green Malayan Dwarf since it doesn't seem to have a large swollen base of the trunk and the Malayans get more beat up by the winter chill and winds than the Mexican Talls do.  Also, a Mexican Tall would probably be about 6 to 8ft+ taller over 10 years time.  I would love to get one or two of those sprouts that you have from it.  I would even be willing to trade you a bag of my high quality MicroLife All Organic Fertilzer for them.  I use it on all my plants and have had really good results with it.

John

[Cluster]

Hm if it is a dwarf it is way fatter than the ones I have seen in the internet and the one I have seen in the Marina of Funchal, I think we do see a bit of the bole it is just that the green leaves in front of it don't let us see everything:). Another thing I have noticed is that the fruits are very elongated which is not found on dwarfs. 

I could be wrong though:)

[Mr. Coconut Palm]

55 minutes ago, Xenon said:

Here's another one (growing on an abandoned lot and recovering from 2011 freeze...there are actually a few growing on abandoned lots):

Here is the same palm in 2007: https://www.google.com/maps/@26.0810139,-97.2535101,3a,75y,15.27h,84.11t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sO-_jlUiT8JvjeiDHm9B84w!2e0!7i3328!8i1664!6m1!1e1

Another abandoned coconut (on South Padre Island)...amazing that it survived the 2011 freeze. Look at how sad the queen palm next to it looks...pic taken in 2012.

This one must have been the champion in Texas

Hey Jonathon,

I know that one on South Padre quite well, and I have watched the petioles change color over the years.  When I first saw it years ago, I thought it was a Yellow Malayan Dwarf, since it had very yellow petioles, but more recently it has had more greenish petioles.  In 2008, the crown of the Queen Palm fell over into the Coconut Palm crown during the hurricane, but the Queen Palm recovered as I recall as did the Coconut Palm.  That is a really hardy one since it is totally exposed there with no winter protection from a building nearby, and I don't think it ever gets any water at all other than rainwater.  If it ever produced nuts that were viable, I would like to collect some, but that is highly unlikely since it is so dry and barely has enough moisture to survive in its location.

I will have to check that one out in Laguna Heights.  It looks like a neglected Mexican Tall that hasn't received enough water.  If it had enough water, the bowl at the base should be bigger, the trunk should be taller, the crown should be more robust, and their should be at least a dozen or more viable nuts on it.  If I could get my Mexican Tall, my Maymex,, and my Maypan to get about 1/2 to 2/3 that size and have a few nuts on them, I would be happy.

Where was the really tall but dead Coconut Palm at?  It looks kind of like a Mexican Tall trunk, and considering the number of them that survived the 2011 freeze in the RGV, it was probably Lethal Yellowing that did it in.

John

[Mr. Coconut Palm]

41 minutes ago, Cluster said:

Hm if it is a dwarf it is way fatter than the ones I have seen in the internet and the one I have seen in the Marina of Funchal, I think we do see a bit of the bole it is just that the green leaves in front of it don't let us see everything:). Another thing I have noticed is that the fruits are very elongated which is not found on dwarfs. 

I could be wrong though:)

Hi Pedro,

The dwarfs do occasionally produce a little bit of swelling at the base and those palms would probably have slightly wider trunks all the way up than the Malayans that don't have any swelling at their base.  Also, I have noticed over the years, many Malayans that have elongated nuts, yet they are shorter than the Jamaican Tall and Mexican Tall nuts.  I have read somewhere online that the Malayans have more rounded nuts, but many of them I have seen and grown have longer nuts similar to the talls, just shorter in overall length.  Keith in Palmetto has confirmed this, and he has studied the many different varieties even more than I have.  Also, the Jamaican Talls have a more triangular shaped long nut, whereas the Malayans have a more rounded long nut, which may be the "rounded" effect I have read about online and mistakenly assume they were referring to the overall shape of the nut rather than looking head on at the front of the nut and seeing the rounded shape.  The Panama Tall, though does have an overall rounded shape to it.  There are a lot of nuances to understanding the various shapes and varieties, and since so many varieties hybridize so easily, it makes it difficult sometimes to make a certain determination as to what variety a given palm is.  Some of them are easy and obvious, like the photos of mature Mexican Talls in the RGV that I have posted photos of, and the mature Green Malayan that I have posted photos of in Brownsville, as well the really tall swollen base Jamaican Talls seen on Florida beaches, but sometimes I honestly get stumped trying to determine the variety.

John

[Cluster]

Hello John,

Could it be that the green malayan with elongated nuts are maypans or something or at least maypan with malayan cross? Anyway it does get very complicated I always thought pure malayans would look like these from Malaysia:

 

Green and Gold malayans with round like fruits.

 

Always learning something:)

[Mr. Coconut Palm]

52 minutes ago, Cluster said:

Hello John,

Could it be that the green malayan with elongated nuts are maypans or something or at least maypan with malayan cross? Anyway it does get very complicated I always thought pure malayans would look like these from Malaysia:

 

Green and Gold malayans with round like fruits.

 

Always learning something:)

Hey Pedro,

You've got me.  I have been trying to figure out positive id's on different varieties of coconuts for years.  It may have something to do with the conditions and climates they are grown in.  I do know that the Malayans I have grown and the ones I have seen in Florida have a more elongated yet round type of nut, whereas the Jamaican Talls and to an extent the Mexican Talls which I think are closely related to the Jamaican Talls as the ancestry of them is probably Jamaican Talls, have a longer and more triangular shaped nut as you look at the front of the nut.

John

P.S.  One of the nuts I collected off the beach here last year that sprouted was a fairly small and roundish overall nut that appeared to produce a pure Green Malayan.  I think that the various varieties have hybridized so much over the centuries and the ones that are naturally self pollinating like the Malayans have probably been hand pollinated with pollen form other varieties in commercial production worldwide, that it may be hard to find a 100% pure variety of any type, so therefore, you may end up with nuts and offspring that look different from what they should look like.

Edited March 3, 2016 by Mr. Coconut Palm

[Mr. Coconut Palm]

I love the look of the Golden Malayans, by the way, and the fact that they can produce their first nuts when the palm is only about 4 years old with a short trunk is pretty neat.