Cycad ID?

[Matt in OC]

I'm not very good with Cycads. Thanks!

 

[redbeard917]

Me either, but it's a great plant. I'm just going to guess Ceratozamia.

[redbeard917]

Here is a Ceratozamia latifolia for comparison. This plant is in full shade, which is why (I suspect) the leaflets are so much farther apart.

[Matt in OC]

Thanks for the input. Here's a few better pictures. 

[Pedro 65]

Matt, the only "spineless" Ceratoamia is Microstrobila, I had 3  as a group planting and lost them all as I planted them in heavy soil and in a very wet year they all died. I dont recall any of them with such red new leaves as yours, mine opened just green , so what a bonus for you a very nice variant Microstrobila. Yours doesnt seem to have spines am I right , and the leaflets look very Micro.  Dont overwater it..   Pete    

 

 

                                                                                        

[Matt in OC]

Great question, Pete. There are small but sharp spines widely spaced on the petioles (?). Too small to really get a picture of but if you run your finger along them, you can find them!

[Pedro 65]

1 hour ago, Matt in OC said:

Great question, Pete. There are small but sharp spines widely spaced on the petioles (?). Too small to really get a picture of but if you run your finger along them, you can find them!

Matt, 1 that looks very similar to Micro "but" has" the pink/red rachis  on the last half of the rachis( middle of where the leaflets start n finish)  is Ceratozamia  Miqueliana which Micro does not have, so looks like you have a Ceratozamia miqueliana ?. Interesting to see what Cycadcentre/ Cycadjungle input is.   Pete  

Heres a pic from Pacsoa of Miqueliana for ya to check out, sorry the pic doesnt enlarge, just look it up..

 

 

 

                                         

 

 

 

                                                                                                    

 

 

[Matt in OC]

Thanks, Pete. I concur. It looks a lot like Miqueliana. Thanks!

[LJG]

For sure not Miqueliana. With the spikes on petiole now confirmed I will say Latifolia. In fact I am almost positive. 

[Matt in OC]

 Thanks for the input, Len.

[Pedro 65]

5 hours ago, LJG said:

For sure not Miqueliana. With the spikes on petiole now confirmed I will say Latifolia. In fact I am "almost' positive. 

Matt O, after reading this I had to get out the 2nd edition of David Jones Cycads of the World and the 1st Ceratozamia  I mentioned Microstoliba new leaves can be bronze, brown or red, and the petiole can be unarmed or prickly. In the Notes researches say that     Micro and Latiflolia    fall within the range of variation and regarded as a       "synonym".           It would be great for Cycad Jungle to chime in on your Ceratozamia and Lens right re "not" migueliana as it prickles are .5cm long and always opens its new leaf green. Happy growing/gardening Matt and Len see above how I highlighted your "almost"  

Pete  

[LJG]

Pete, Microstoliba is a pretty rare plant. It is also slower growing and a smaller plant in general from Latiflolia (very common plant). I have both these plants and it is easy to see the difference when growing side by side. I used "almost"'because there are a few others that look similar and flush red and by only looking at pictures, I wouldn't throw my hat in for 100% confident.   

To quote you so there is no "blah, blah, blah" I will post pics 

First two show my Latifolia just now. Second two show two forms of Miqueliana flushing. You can see the bluish tint even in the new leaflets. Those harden off to a nice glaucous color - which makes Miqueliana so desirable. My Microstoliba is flushing too. It has no prickles on it. Never knew there were ones with prickles.  

 

[LJG]

[TexasColdHardyPalms]

Tom would know for sure.

[Pedro 65]

Len, beautiful pics of yr Cycads   Im only going off what "written" from DJ 2nd edition , I dont have Loran Whitelocks latest thick book, no doubt you do so pls look up Microstroliba and see if "he" mentions the variations between it and Latifolia and whether its become synonymous. Len, I rarely believe everything thats written in books or on the net, I have a cold/flu @ the moment and finding it hard to decipher anything right now, after seeing you Miqueliana , I'll have to "chase" some 1 day..     Pete  

[Darold Petty]

I know very little about cycads, but I did grow two Ceratozamia latifolia plants to large size in my greenhouse.  My first impression of the image was that It was that species, C latifolia.

[cycadjungle]

Looks like you guys are figuring it out. Microstrobila has a chocolate brown emergent leaf with smooth petiole. This plant has only very slight spines. I will see if I can post a micro pic. Most likely, with that color a latifolia type. Robustas have bigger spines. Nice miqueliana pic, yea, they are always green, if not blue/green when they come out. The blue is weird though, only when you look at the leaflet at just the right angle.  Tom

[Al in Kona]

Here are 2-pics of my Ceratozamia microstrobilia, one showing the leaf color right after a new flush of growth. 

[Pedro 65]

Mmmmmm, "very" interesting, note the pink rachis on Matts   and Als, but not Lens    but      the leaves are certainly fatter and closer 2gether

Tom (Cycad Jungle) does Loran Whitelock mention these 2 are very similar but differ in different locations and Micro may be put into a Latifolia variant  or  has it already been "sorted" ??

Grat pics, Tom and Al         Pete  :)

[cycadjungle]

Al, yours looks like it is getting quite a bit of sun. Is it? I haven't read Loran's book for a good 5+ years, but I know what you are asking. The taxonomist type people, I say that because most of the people right now looking at this have no formal training as a taxonomist, haven't made any decisions. BTW, I do have a few micros with marginal spines on them, but they do have perfect color. The same goes with kuesteriana. I have a few, very old, kuesterianas with a few spines as well. If I remember right, I think sabotoi is also spineless.

[LJG]

Loran stated that a "taxonomist" said they were the same. Loran clearly states that is false and anyone that cultivates them knows they are separate species. 

[Matt in OC]

Thanks everyone for the input. So, latifolia? The new growth was a while ago so I couldn't say if it had spines or not. The spines on the old growth are irregularly spaced and very small. 

[Pedro 65]

5 hours ago, LJG said:

Loran stated that a "taxonomist" said they were the same. Loran clearly states that is false and anyone that cultivates them knows they are separate species. 

  Wait until  "taxonomists" start lumbering Primo Licuala's in Livistona's    How, will Palm enthusiasts take that ??   I will say no more.     Pete  

[cycadjungle]

I know what you mean. At one time I was growing 275 species of palms. I had learned how to spell all their names and knew what they would prefer for culture, and then they took a half dozen genera I was already growing and threw it all into Dypsis. I don't know, that did something to me and I sold out the majority of my palm collection soon after that. I'm OK when they change this one or that one, but when they remove a whole bunch of genera, that's a whole different thing. That was the time you could buy a 4 foot tall pink walking stick palm for $20.

[Tracy]

On 7/8/2016, 5:08:34, LJG said:

First two show my Latifolia just now.

I will have to look up a couple of photos of a Ceratozamia which I didn't have an id for, but now believe could be C microstrobilia.  The one pictured below is either C latifolia or a hybrid of C latifolia.  It didn't transition well when I moved it, and this is the first flush in almost 2 years now.  It also has been putting a lot of energy into coning between flushes, even before the move.  Its been in the same pot for a while now, and never in the ground.  I bought it from Phil at Jungle Music as a band many years ago... somewhere around 2007 or 08 if I recall correctly.  Any thoughts on the latifolia or a hybrid?

[Tracy]

Here is a photo of the one I suspect is C microstrobilia.  No spines and when it flushes it has the bluish tint to it.