Help building rat proof box?

[Cindy Adair]

I do not have a major rat problem, perhaps due to the occasional boas I have seen. I actually had more rat issues in suburban VA.

I would prefer to avoid poisons partly because a neighbor's dog sometimes visits.

However with some seeds and seedlings it would be nice to protect them from rodent and bird marauders.

Due to my penchant for travel, owning a cat or any sort of trap (which ideally should be checked regularly) are not my top choices. 

Right now I have hardware cloth I lay on top which does seem to help but with different size pots it is annoying and must be removed as soon as seeds are up.

What I would like to try is a cover for my most special seeds/seedlings until they are a few inches tall at least.

Anyone have building suggestions?

Preferably somewhat tropical weather resistant and easy to access pots to set on top of a wire bench or on the ground.

I was thinking chicken coop wire stapled to a treated wood frame, but am open to any suggestions.

If I were in the states I'd likely find something from a thrift store to repurpose!

Since I am only a hobby grower and my building skills are rudimentary, maybe a prototype using the size of the wire would minimize cuts? 24 inches tall would then be the height.

Not sure of other dimensions. Fewer cuts and not too heavy would be guidelines.

Below is a photo of one product but I have not purchased anything yet.

How best to construct the "box" ?

If I set it on top of one of my metal tables I would make it bottomless.

On the ground it would still be easier to be bottomless, but maybe you could recommend easy to remove anchor(s) to keep it better in place like small short stakes part of the bottom that I could plunge into the dirt?

Of course keeping costs down would be great too.

Thanks for your help!

 

 

[Darold Petty]

How about a manufactured bird cage ?  No labor cost, and close enough wire spacing to exclude rodents. 

[Cindy Adair]

It is a great idea Darold although not sure if easy to find here in PR. I guess I could check out the local pet store and Agricultural supply store. Nothing in PR's online classified ads and Internet shipping of a large item here makes no sense

I do miss the VA thrift stores which often had them.

[foxtail]

1 hour ago, Cindy Adair said:

It is a great idea Darold although not sure if easy to find here in PR. I guess I could check out the local pet store and Agricultural supply store. Nothing in PR's online classified ads and Internet shipping of a large item here makes no sense

I do miss the VA thrift stores which often had them.

Pet smart.

[ahicks51]

PVC pipe frame and chickenwire? A little like this:

Secure the wire or plastic mesh to the PVC with wire ties; should go fast. I suspect rats will make quick work of plastic mesh.

 

[Cindy Adair]

Thank you!

I like this idea a lot because PVC pipes are so easy to work with.

They survive beautifully in my jungle and are light weight and cheap.

What sort of wire ties do you suggest?

 

[ahicks51]

20 minutes ago, Cindy Adair said:

What sort of wire ties do you suggest?

Whatever's on sale at Home Depot!

In all seriousness, all but the most expensive are going to be plastic; if they're plastic and don't have "UV resistant" or something like that on the package, they'll embrittle and fall apart relatively fast. Search for "Cable ties" + UV on HomeDepot.com (Lowes doesn't seem to be quite so helpful in finding UV-resistant ties).

Another option would be solid copper wire. Cut, loop it through, twist it, move to the next one. Galvanized steel wire would probably be less expensive, but harder to handle.

And always trim or bend over the ends. I almost put my eye out once on chickenwire, gouged the safety glasses I was wearing.

[Cindy Adair]

I do like the ease of cable ties so will compare cost and look for UV resistance and compare to the other wires you mentioned.

Again, thanks!

[fan palm]

Hi Cindy, i had a bit of a rat problem here too, lost heaps of seedlings over the years soI made  a box out or treated pine and mouse mesh which did the trick. Also as others have said, keep an eye out for second hand bird cages with the fine wire mesh as mice and rats can squeeze through the smallest of holes! I picked up one cheap with three compartments made from a steel frame.

 

 

[ErikSJI]

Here is our Rat / Squirrel proof box for seeds. You could use it for seedlings as well. It is a pretty simple build. We also have frames built on the ground with these covers on top for Areca palm seedlings we do every year.

[Palm Tree Jim]

3 hours ago, ahicks51 said:

PVC pipe frame and chickenwire? A little like this:

Secure the wire or plastic mesh to the PVC with wire ties; should go fast. I suspect rats will make quick work of plastic mesh.

 

This seems like a great idea.....and easy to move when needed.

[ErikSJI]

Unless you put the wire in the ground on the pvc one. The rats can get underneath this one with quite ease. We tried this one before. Works well for gardens and birds.

 

[Steve Mac]

I know that this does not answer your question, but it is how I solved the same problem.

Specific rat poison stations.

It was the easiest way for me and it took my safety concerns into account.

I had to put snail bait in the bottom because they ate the rat bait faster than the rats did.

 

[Cindy Adair]

Foxtail, Thanks for the idea, maybe if they have a damaged cage they would discount it?

Wow, such an elegant design ErikSJI!!! Might be beyond my current building ability but I'm sure I could pay someone here to copy it. Lots of job seekers. And thanks for the note about including a floor! So I would need a door of sorts then?

Fan Palm, I will continue to be on the lookout for an old bird cage here but the box design I could likely manage and was along the lines of what I had guessed. Even pressure treated lumber rots here I think but it would likely last awhile. No scrap lumber on site so I would need to buy it and the hardware. 

I so much appreciate all the replies and photos folks! My Pelagodoxa seeds planted 7 months are beginning to germinate and I would be unhappy if they were chewed up. At this moment covered loosely with hardware cloth, but soon to be better protected. It makes me want to head out in the darkness with a flashlight and bring the 3 showing growth above ground inside tonight!

 

[TexasColdHardyPalms]

I use final Blox in stations. You'll never have a problem if you go that route. The squirrels however are the toughest to keep out and you will need 1/2"square wire similar to Erik"s box to keep them out. I've lost thousands of expensive seedlings from both rodents .  

[Cindy Adair]

I resisted going out in the dark to safeguard seedlings but must admit the three Pelagodoxas are now in my kitchen awaiting completion of my rat proof box. it took three different hardware stores to purchase supplies and I do not want to add up the cost. So far I have glued nothing and I can see some adjustments are needed as it is a bit too tall for the 1/4 inch 2ft. tall hardware cloth I bought. I designed it to use a total of 24 ft. out of the 25 ft. roll.

If there is a PVC connector all in one for the corners it is not in hardware stores in my area.

I did find UV resistant cable ties and I will have a bottom to the box. 

I plan to attach the separate top with slightly loose cable ties (along one long side only) to the open box below, hoping it will function as a hinge. That way I can open it to reach the seedlings.

I like the $10 tool to cut the PVC pipes as I had been using a saw to cut my plant marker pipes.

I have not heard of mice around here, only rats but decided to go with the 1/4" mesh size just to be sure.

Of course I can stack flats on shelving inside and if way too much rain I could put a plastic cover to partially block it as well as a shade cloth for part if needed.

If you have any more suggestions it is only a mock up so speak up! Thanks!

If this does not work I will likely be forced to use the "protected poison" idea.

 

[TexasColdHardyPalms]

The major big box hardware stores in the states have corner tees that will save 4 tees on that design and make it easier to wrap the mesh on the outside of the box. 

[Yunder Wækraus]

You should combine approaches and both protect the most vulnerable plants and safely use poison stations. 

[Cindy Adair]

On October 27, 2016 at 7:22:13 AM, Yunder Wækraus said:

You should combine approaches and both protect the most vulnerable plants and safely use poison stations. 

Good thought. 

Well I finished my box today and immediately filled it up of course. I am happy to feel that it would take quite a determined rodent to enter so I hope the creatures will just help themselves to the many many other tasty items I am willing to share, like bananas.

Again, thanks for all the replies. I measured the size correctly so had only a few inches of unused hardware cloth. This is not the final location of the box and I am glad to report that I can easily lift it but think it is too heavy for normal, non hurricane force winds to dislodge.

Of course my hat is just for scale.

On October 26, 2016 at 11:57:44 PM, TexasColdHardyPalms said:

The major big box hardware stores in the states have corner tees that will save 4 tees on that design and make it easier to wrap the mesh on the outside of the box. 

I definitely have seen them in the states but my only local big box store had none in any size and after checking two more ferreterias I gave up.

I still need to reconfigure the closures attaching the top on three sides because what I had around the house is nylon, which of course won't work long term. Only small spaces there, though maybe a mouse could get through.

 

[Mandrew968]

If mammals are the culprit, cayenne pepper will deter them. Capsaicin is designed to deter mammals.

[TexasColdHardyPalms]

14 hours ago, Mandrew968 said:

If mammals are the culprit, cayenne pepper will deter them. Capsaicin is designed to deter mammals.

I've used cayenne pepper, the capsaicin mix in the jug and it doesn't work at all. A hungry, determined rodent, especially squirrels will walk right past it onto a treated seedling and eat the seed and destroy the plant.

[Cindy Adair]

I had also heard that hot peppers will not deter squirrels but happily no squirrels in PR! 

I would think any sort of repellant would be quickly diluted by my frequent rains. 

My neighbor says we do have mice so I am glad I chose the small mesh size for the hardware cloth.

I read that rats can enter if holes are as big as a quarter and mice in through nickel sized holes. I think I am OK here so my Pelagodoxas are back outside (inside the box) where they belong to enjoy the mist.

 

[Mandrew968]

11 hours ago, Cindy Adair said:

I had also heard that hot peppers will not deter squirrels but happily no squirrels in PR! 

I would think any sort of repellant would be quickly diluted by my frequent rains. 

My neighbor says we do have mice so I am glad I chose the small mesh size for the hardware cloth.

I read that rats can enter if holes are as big as a quarter and mice in through nickel sized holes. I think I am OK here so my Pelagodoxas are back outside (inside the box) where they belong to enjoy the mist.

 

Good point on the rain. Good luck Cindy!

[Sabal Steve]

Your box looks great, and looks like it will hold up just fine.  I've always avoided poison, since I wasn't sure if a rat could eat the poison, and die elsewhere - potentially ending up in the path of pets that may find it.  People have told me that this is possible.  I've used spring loaded traps, and they've always been effective.