What types of palms grow in Perth, Australia?

[PalmTreeDude]

I am curious about the palms in Perth. What's growing there?

[tim_brissy_13]

Perth is pretty much the southern edge of the range of Cocos nucifera along the west coast. From what I've seen, most sub tropicals and temperate palms are happy. Only the ultra tropicals wont grow at all as well as palms that dont like the 40C regular days (Ceroxylon, Lepidorrhachis etc) assuming irrigation is available.

[Yunder Wækraus]

4 hours ago, tim_brissy_13 said:

Perth is pretty much the southern edge of the range of Cocos nucifera along the west coast. From what I've seen, most sub tropicals and temperate palms are happy. Only the ultra tropicals wont grow at all as well as palms that dont like the 40C regular days (Ceroxylon, Lepidorrhachis etc) assuming irrigation is available.

I know there's a native cycad, but there are no native palms in the region, right?

[Peter G]

1 hour ago, Yunder Wækraus said:

I know there's a native cycad, but there are no native palms in the region, right?

 

1 hour ago, Yunder Wækraus said:

I know there's a native cycad, but there are no native palms in the region, right?

Macro Reidlei and no native palms in Perth

[Peter G]

I've had this Ceroxylon growing for 5 years and my Hedeyscepe is looking pretty comfortable.

would like to try Lepidorrhachis

[Peter G]

Here's a few snaps from my garden , livistona carinensis, chamaerops cerifera, beccariophoenix alfredii

[Peter G]

Baueri crown shaft, Silver Lady, RAv Xerophila

[Mohsen]

I wonder which city , Perth or Sydney are more sub-tropical palms friendly ?

[greysrigging]

6 hours ago, Mohsen said:

I wonder which city , Perth or Sydney are more sub-tropical palms friendly ?

Sydney for sure......superficially both Perth and Sydney seem similar, but Perth has a classic Koppen Classification Mediterranean climate, hot dry summers and cool wet winters which cuts down substantially the species that can be grown easily. The inland suburbs of Perth and Sydney get mild frosts during winter. Sydney region has higher rainfall with a summer bias as opposed to the winter wet in Perth. Perth also has a fairly long hot summer with 30c+ extending into April most years.

Still, put in a bit of effort in Perth and its surprising what will grow.

[Tyrone]

Sydney is cooler than Perth in summer, about the same in winter. As already said, the winters are drier in Sydney so a bit better in that area. But anything requiring stronger summer heat does better in Perth than Sydney. Hyophorbe is one of those.

[hopper]

4 hours ago, greysrigging said:

Sydney for sure......superficially both Perth and Sydney seem similar, but Perth has a classic Koppen Classification Mediterranean climate, hot dry summers and cool wet winters which cuts down substantially the species that can be grown easily. The inland suburbs of Perth and Sydney get mild frosts during winter. Sydney region has higher rainfall with a summer bias as opposed to the winter wet in Perth. Perth also has a fairly long hot summer with 30c+ extending into April most years.

Still, put in a bit of effort in Perth and its surprising what will grow.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I think Perth is about 210km higher in Latitude than Sydney, then Adelaide at 330km below Perth in Latitude.

[Mohsen]

3 hours ago, hopper said:

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I think Perth is about 210km higher in Latitude than Sydney, then Adelaide at 330km below Perth in Latitude.

I believe you are right, but perhaps Latitude is not the only factor here?

[greysrigging]

1 hour ago, Mohsen said:

I believe you are right, but perhaps Latitude is not the only factor here?

Correct.....the East and West coasts are completely  different climatically and ecologically. Different endemic flora and fauna and different  soil types.

Actually the 2016/17 summer it was almost as if the cities of Perth and Sydney  swapped positions. Perth had a mild and very wet summer, close to a record wet I believe. And Sydney  had their hottest summer since records began 150 years  ago.

[Tyrone]

As far as growing things in gardens is concerned the drier summer climate in Perth does not limit what you can grow as anyone who wants to have a garden in Perth needs to irrigate. It's basically compulsory if you want anything to live. The east coast though can basically do without irrigation, so the dependence on rainfall is more of an issue in the east. It's an irrigation culture in west coast gardening.

Things that love summer heat will do better in Perth than Sydney. (Hyophorbe, Wodyetia, Bismarckia etc etc) Perth climates vary a lot though. The metro area is about 160km (100 miles) long north to south along the coast and varies greatly the further inland you go. Sydney would vary the same.

Things that do better in Sydney than Perth are New Caledonian palms, Rhopalostylis of all kinds, and palms that need a milder smaller temp swing with higher humidity, especially along the coast or harbour around Sydney. Go inland from Sydney and it can get frosty and cold.

It's too cold for coconuts in Perth, but I was growing Veitchia joannis really well, Ptychosperma macarthurii was flowering, Carpentarias can grow very well and fruit, Satakentia will grow, Carpoxylon will grow, Hyophorbes do well, but cold winters can hammer a bottle palm, Roystoneas can get massive especially on river loams even inland of Perth, and I've even seen fruiting Adonidias, but most people fail with Adonidia in Perth, but the ones I saw made my eyes pop out.

As for latitudes Perth is almost smack bang on 32S, but the metro area north does extend along the coast to about 31.5S. Mandurah further south on the west coast and basically a Perth suburb is just over 32.5S. There is quite a difference between Mandurah 32.5S and Two Rocks around 31.5S. You could probably succeed along the coast at Two Rocks with a  coconut but it would not look amazing without a lot of help. Forget it in Mandurah.

Sydney's latitude (33.8S) is almost the same as Margaret River in WA about 200km south of Perth. Margaret River is cooler than Sydney though, but winters temp wise would be similar but Sydney would have less rain in winter and be much calmer tucked up a bit on the east coast. Cold fronts smack the west coast hard in winter.

I'm in Albany, about as far south as you can go in WA at almost 35S, about the same as Adelaide, but with 50% more rain that seems to be spread more evenly over the year than Adelaide. From the east it looks like I'm on the west coast, but the climate here is nothing like the west coast. It's almost oceanic and humid year round. Perth can have 30C and blue skies and we'll have 23C and drizzle. I'm about 330km south of Perth.

[Mohsen]

8 minutes ago, Tyrone said:

As far as growing things in gardens is concerned the drier summer climate in Perth does not limit what you can grow as anyone who wants to have a garden in Perth needs to irrigate. It's basically compulsory if you want anything to live. The east coast though can basically do without irrigation, so the dependence on rainfall is more of an issue in the east. It's an irrigation culture in west coast gardening.

Things that love summer heat will do better in Perth than Sydney. (Hyophorbe, Wodyetia, Bismarckia etc etc) Perth climates vary a lot though. The metro area is about 160km (100 miles) long north to south along the coast and varies greatly the further inland you go. Sydney would vary the same.

Things that do better in Sydney than Perth are New Caledonian palms, Rhopalostylis of all kinds, and palms that need a milder smaller temp swing with higher humidity, especially along the coast or harbour around Sydney. Go inland from Sydney and it can get frosty and cold.

It's too cold for coconuts in Perth, but I was growing Veitchia joannis really well, Ptychosperma macarthurii was flowering, Carpentarias can grow very well and fruit, Satakentia will grow, Carpoxylon will grow, Hyophorbes do well, but cold winters can hammer a bottle palm, Roystoneas can get massive especially on river loams even inland of Perth, and I've even seen fruiting Adonidias, but most people fail with Adonidia in Perth, but the ones I saw made my eyes pop out.

As for latitudes Perth is almost smack bang on 32S, but the metro area north does extend along the coast to about 31.5S. Mandurah further south on the west coast and basically a Perth suburb is just over 32.5S. There is quite a difference between Mandurah 32.5S and Two Rocks around 31.5S. You could probably succeed along the coast at Two Rocks with a  coconut but it would not look amazing without a lot of help. Forget it in Mandurah.

Sydney's latitude (33.8S) is almost the same as Margaret River in WA about 200km south of Perth. Margaret River is cooler than Sydney though, but winters temp wise would be similar but Sydney would have less rain in winter and be much calmer tucked up a bit on the east coast. Cold fronts smack the west coast hard in winter.

I'm in Albany, about as far south as you can go in WA at almost 35S, about the same as Adelaide, but with 50% more rain that seems to be spread more evenly over the year than Adelaide. From the east it looks like I'm on the west coast, but the climate here is nothing like the west coast. It's almost oceanic and humid year round. Perth can have 30C and blue skies and we'll have 23C and drizzle. I'm about 330km south of Perth.

Thanks Tyrone

can we also say they Sydney summer is more humid than Perth and that can not be replaced by irrigation and that might be consider a positive factor for Sydney reg growing more toward sub tropical palms?

[greysrigging]

56 minutes ago, Tyrone said:

As far as growing things in gardens is concerned the drier summer climate in Perth does not limit what you can grow as anyone who wants to have a garden in Perth needs to irrigate. It's basically compulsory if you want anything to live. The east coast though can basically do without irrigation, so the dependence on rainfall is more of an issue in the east. It's an irrigation culture in west coast gardening.

Things that love summer heat will do better in Perth than Sydney. (Hyophorbe, Wodyetia, Bismarckia etc etc) Perth climates vary a lot though. The metro area is about 160km (100 miles) long north to south along the coast and varies greatly the further inland you go. Sydney would vary the same.

Things that do better in Sydney than Perth are New Caledonian palms, Rhopalostylis of all kinds, and palms that need a milder smaller temp swing with higher humidity, especially along the coast or harbour around Sydney. Go inland from Sydney and it can get frosty and cold.

It's too cold for coconuts in Perth, but I was growing Veitchia joannis really well, Ptychosperma macarthurii was flowering, Carpentarias can grow very well and fruit, Satakentia will grow, Carpoxylon will grow, Hyophorbes do well, but cold winters can hammer a bottle palm, Roystoneas can get massive especially on river loams even inland of Perth, and I've even seen fruiting Adonidias, but most people fail with Adonidia in Perth, but the ones I saw made my eyes pop out.

As for latitudes Perth is almost smack bang on 32S, but the metro area north does extend along the coast to about 31.5S. Mandurah further south on the west coast and basically a Perth suburb is just over 32.5S. There is quite a difference between Mandurah 32.5S and Two Rocks around 31.5S. You could probably succeed along the coast at Two Rocks with a  coconut but it would not look amazing without a lot of help. Forget it in Mandurah.

Sydney's latitude (33.8S) is almost the same as Margaret River in WA about 200km south of Perth. Margaret River is cooler than Sydney though, but winters temp wise would be similar but Sydney would have less rain in winter and be much calmer tucked up a bit on the east coast. Cold fronts smack the west coast hard in winter.

I'm in Albany, about as far south as you can go in WA at almost 35S, about the same as Adelaide, but with 50% more rain that seems to be spread more evenly over the year than Adelaide. From the east it looks like I'm on the west coast, but the climate here is nothing like the west coast. It's almost oceanic and humid year round. Perth can have 30C and blue skies and we'll have 23C and drizzle. I'm about 330km south of Perth.

I'm amazed Carpentarias and MacArthurs would grow in Perth. They are Top End natives and I wouldn't have thought they would tolerate a Perth district winter ? Happy to be corrected but.... I have seen them growing in Karratha, Wickham and Point Sampson in the Pilbara, but the odd 48c days knock 'em around a bit.

[Tyrone]

11 hours ago, Mohsen said:

Thanks Tyrone

can we also say they Sydney summer is more humid than Perth and that can not be replaced by irrigation and that might be consider a positive factor for Sydney reg growing more toward sub tropical palms?

Not in my experience of growing things in Perth. Sydney is definitely more humid than Perth, so in Perth you'd have to protect your sensitive stuff from the dry easterlies in summer. Maybe if we are talking things like Kerriodoxa that need it mega humid to look good, then yes, but everything else not so much. That being said you have to consider your microclimate in Perth. What might do fine out in full sun in Sydney would fry in Perth, so anything like that would have to go into semi shade in Perth. Red cordylines are a case in point. In Sydney you can put them out in full sun. In Perth if you did that they'd fry and turn grey in summer. New Caledonian palms do better in Sydney than Perth though. They're tough to grow in Perth and need the cooler, more humid weather that Sydney provides. Even still I've heard of sizable Burretiokentia in Perth - though not seen it myself. 

Down here in Albany I've got cooler more humid conditions and so far my New Caledonians are doing much better, as are Rhopalostylis, Ceroxylon, and I have hope for my Oraniopsis. I have what is closer to a southern NSW coastal climate down here. Still, winter canes me down here. :(

[Tyrone]

11 hours ago, greysrigging said:

I'm amazed Carpentarias and MacArthurs would grow in Perth. They are Top End natives and I wouldn't have thought they would tolerate a Perth district winter ? Happy to be corrected but.... I have seen them growing in Karratha, Wickham and Point Sampson in the Pilbara, but the odd 48c days knock 'em around a bit.

In the right position they thrive. Even non palm people sometimes grow them well. There is a pair of Carpentarias near Perth airport in a dry old garden bed that would be about 10m tall and thick trunked and they've been dropping fruit for years. The owners probably dont know what they are. My macarthurs in my Perth garden were planted in a rainforest garden (what this species wants) and were well past my roof line and flowering the last time I was there. I can imagine that the heat of a Pilbara summer would be too much for them to look any good, unless they were protected amongst thick vegetation. I found Adonidia and Carpentaria look better for extreme dry heat in the Pilbara. A few times in my landscaping business in Perth I used macarthurs for that authentic balinese resort look ( as well as Pinangas and Licualas) and on returning a few years later they were growing happily. It's all about the right spot though.

[Tyrone]

On 4 April 2017 6:19:51 PM, Yunder Wækraus said:

I know there's a native cycad, but there are no native palms in the region, right?

There's actually two cycads. Macrozamia reidlii is from Perth and south and is basically a trunkless species and Macrozamia fraserii which is from Perth to north around Eneabba which is a much bigger trunked species that in ancient specimens can look like a Phoenix canariensis but to palm people it is easily distinguished from canariensis. Then out to the SE around Esperance (700km from Perth) is Macrozamia dyeri which is similar to fraseri in size and trunk.