Northern most coconut palm tree??? Daytona beach

[mdsonofthesouth]

Would be interesting to find out if its genetics or just that good of a microclimate. Does it get protected at all? and does it fruit?

[Reeverse]

It had fruit and I was wanting to grab some but the landscapers got to it and cut them off before they were ripe. But I think it just a great microclimate. No protection. We get spared by the cold NW winds in the winter with help from the widest point of the intracoastal waterway around. 

[GottmitAlex]

On 11/30/2017, 1:12:04, epiphyte said:

What I'm curious about is whether this coconut palm is exceptional or lucky.  Has anybody tried growing its coconuts?  

In this thread I shared this Google street view of a strand of coconut palms in Baja California.  I'm guessing that the primary limiting factor is the dryness rather than the cold (or lack of heat).

Picture from 2009. There is another one from 2012 in PT. Who knows how this tall-variety coconut is doing.

https://www.google.com/maps/@32.6635744,-115.4765989,3a,75y,284.08h,87.56t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s_JK1D_GFCfr-I8cdMupnqQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

[epiphyte]

On 12/1/2017, 1:21:05, Reeverse said:

It had fruit and I was wanting to grab some but the landscapers got to it and cut them off before they were ripe. But I think it just a great microclimate. No protection. We get spared by the cold NW winds in the winter with help from the widest point of the intracoastal waterway around. 

Right now I have a nearly ripe seed pod on a particularly nice reed-stem Epidendrum hybrid.  Let's pretend that the seed pod has around 100,000 seeds in it.  I split the seeds with you.  Lucky for us, the seeds don't require flasking or fungus to germinate.  We both end up with 50 seedlings each.  When the seedlings are 1 year old, we exchange half our seedlings with each other.  In your conditions, how will my seedlings do compared to your seedlings?  In my conditions, how will your seedlings do compared to my seedlings?  How noticeable will the difference be?  The more noticeable the difference, the more variation among the seeds, the more adaptable the orchid is.  

The same concept is relevant to coconuts.  But the logistics are easier to imagine with the orchid.  

[climate change virginia]

On 11/19/2017 at 12:01 PM, Paranormal said:

İf there is a risk of dying from the cold really; download her roots deep. I am not sure; Quotation technique...

 

 

that would rot the palm and ut would have a lack of nutrients

[NOT A TA]

2 hours ago, climate change virginia said:

that would rot the palm and ut would have a lack of nutrients

Have any references for this ^^^ statement?

I'm curious if anyone's actually tried deep planting. Maybe not 10" which seems extreme and unnecessary to be deep enough to ward off cold feet.

I dug up a couple coconut seedlings that had sprouted in an abandoned area where a nursery had been previously. The plants grew even though the coconuts had been buried about 2' deep in the soil. When I first started digging I'd expected to find the seed just below soil level. I kept digging, and digging, and eventually to my surprise I hit the nuts.

[PalmatierMeg]

2 hours ago, climate change virginia said:

that would rot the palm and ut would have a lack of nutrients

You are absolutely correct. Palms are very shallow rooted and grow roots from a basal plate at the bottom of the trunk. You have to be very careful not to bury the trunk or the roots will suffocate and die. Years ago someone on PT posted photos of a royal palm after he dumped 2' of soil around the trunk because he wanted to raise the level of his yard. People here warned him he would kill his royal unless got that dirt out of there ASAP. I don't remember if he did.

And remember I told you about people who enjoy stirring up controversies just for their entertainment? This guy was one of them. He wouldn't stop posting nonsense like this about coconuts even after we asked him to let it go. I believe he was banned from the site.

[climate change virginia]

1 hour ago, PalmatierMeg said:

You are absolutely correct. Palms are very shallow rooted and grow roots from a basal plate at the bottom of the trunk. You have to be very careful not to bury the trunk or the roots will suffocate and die. Years ago someone on PT posted photos of a royal palm after he dumped 2' of soil around the trunk because he wanted to raise the level of his yard. People here warned him he would kill his royal unless got that dirt out of there ASAP. I don't remember if he did.

And remember I told you about people who enjoy stirring up controversies just for their entertainment? This guy was one of them. He wouldn't stop posting nonsense like this about coconuts even after we asked him to let it go. I believe he was banned from the site.

I can't believe there are people like that who want to mislead people and kill others plants.

Edited October 26, 2020 by climate change virginia

[climate change virginia]

Those palms don't survive the only reason they have them there is because they replenish them every year

 after Christmas. they dont bother to protect them

Edited October 26, 2020 by climate change virginia

[NOT A TA]

With "regular" trees most can't tolerate the root zone being filled a lot however there are some which can survive. And those that can may only survive depending on maturity of the plant and environmental conditions.

In the case of the Roystonea buried 2', other factors may have been in play. As an example, it may have been that the palm was happy in a low area where it got a lot of water, then when the grade was changed all of a sudden it didn't receive the same water totals because the water runoff was changed.

 

[John Max]

Farthest from the sea, in the north Coconut too tall, huge and happy. Butwal Nepal Himalayan mountain range : https://www.google.co.uk/maps/place/Butwal,+Nepal/@27.6820453,83.3624953,21839m/data=!3m2!1e3!4b1!4m5!3m4!1s0x3996864275d9755f:0x2b1e92d89d4bb3ae!8m2!3d27.6865838!4d83.4322634

Edited January 25, 2021 by John Max

[EastCanadaTropicals]

On 11/27/2017 at 1:03 PM, DCA_Palm_Fan said:

The growing season may match or closely match further south, but its cold season does not.  That is the real issue.  Va beach is substantially warmer than OCMD, largely due to the ocean / bay/ james river / Gulfstream.   The ship building is all in Norfolk/ Hampton/ Newport News.  20+ miles up river / west.  Norfolk is 20 miles or so west.  Its a small city.  VA Beach isnt large enough to give off a heat island.  Its mostly the seaside town and the surrounding largely suburban area and Naval Base (NAS Oceana).   It just doesn't  get a brutally cold, and when it does its usually sort lived.   50's/ 60's in the dead of winter during the day are common there. Even 70's are not that uncommon.    Where it not for the night cooling that occurs in winter, VA Beach could easily be an 8B.  those pesky overnight winter lows tho wont allow for that even though its climate is fairly warm compared to mos areas  near by and north just a bit.  

But Norfolk, Newport News, and other cities combined, will give a great heat island. 

[DCA_Palm_Fan]

On 1/25/2021 at 2:18 PM, EastCanadaTropicals said:

But Norfolk, Newport News, and other cities combined, will give a great heat island. 

Oh there is a heat island affect for sure, but I would not say its "great".  Reasonably good yes.  Norfolk is not that large and has a medium small sized urban core.     The larger influence on the area, especially Va Beach,  is all of the surrounding large bodies of water, and loads of smaller rivers, creeks / marshes / wetlands. The largest influence is the Atlantic Ocean and the Gulf Stream.  From my experience with that area, Sabal Palmettos are possible in and around the Norfolk area, near water, and east into VA Beach.  However the more east / into VA Beach you go the better your success will be in growing S. palmetto and even Butia Odorata.   Windmills are near bulletproof in VA Beach and a good bet for Norfolk as are Needle Palms and Sabal Minor.

[Patrick Sheehan]

Mine is growing just fine in San Diego, so no its not the northernmost.  That one looks terrific though, a pat on the back for who takes care of it.

[Michael Hans]

Bringing this thread back to life... today I found a Coconut Palm growing in Flagler Beach, Florida (can confirm it is definitely a coconut). I think this might be the northernmost one in Florida. However; it was hard to tell whether it was transplanted recently (soil around it looks disturbed). I estimate it to be around 3-4 years old. Wondering if anyone thinks it will survive? Or if anyone has any tips on how to help them survive in Flagler, currently trying to grow my own coconut palm there... 

 

[coco305]

go harvest some of its coconuts, it might have some kind of adaptation to handle the cold. It looks to be in really good shape too

[Aceraceae]

Didn't the large Daytona Beach coconut die in 2018 or get killed by landscapers but somehow that update eclipsed this thread about it? 

[kinzyjr]

26 minutes ago, Aceraceae said:

Didn't the large Daytona Beach coconut die in 2018 or get killed by landscapers but somehow that update eclipsed this thread about it? 

It should still be kicking.  It was in our Florida Christmas Freeze 2022 thread with a good bit of damage, but still living.  @Plantking165 got the photos for us.  The Google Maps link is also helpful as you can see the damage from the Jan. 2018 freeze by going back in time.

[Aceraceae]

Thanks. It looked great in sumer 2022 before the recent freeze. Just as good as a Bermuda coconut. Bigger places in Florida like Miami and the HEFT of the Turnpike have way more streetview updates, multiple times a year. And it's easy to find your car sometimes on it. 

[Palmerr]

On 11/3/2017 at 1:51 PM, DCA_Palm_Fan said:

It is isn't it?  I was shocked when I first discovered it.  I know over the last decade it has become en-vogue to use more tropical palms up north, but usually those were like Queens and maybe Christmas palms.  Well apparently that has changed dramatically in the last decade to now include even more, including the Coconut.  It is all just a marketing ploy to create that oh so desirable tropical vibe where one can be 1000 miles from the nearest palm, yet still enjoy pretending to be in the actual tropics.  Nothing makes that more realistic than the Coconut Palm.  

Chicago has been doing this in sections of their lake shore for quite a few years now, maybe even a decade, especially around the famous Oak Street.  From all that I have read about it, they rent all of those huge tropical palms.  The company comes in, places them in spring after danger of temps below 45 or 50 I think, then removes them in the fall, and places them back into their very large greenhouses.  If I had the capital I would totally start a business like that in a northern climate and I bet it would do amazing.   I just very much dislike the senseless killing of so many trees every year.  With large places like that doing this more and more I would guess the numbers of palm trees that die each year from the practice number in the 10's of thousands now. 

Like give em to me i will take them!!! and try to protect them then plant em again in south florida or something

[PalmsInBaltimore]

43 minutes ago, Palmerr said:

Like give em to me i will take them!!! and try to protect them then plant em again in south florida or something

If you offered, I'm sure they would give them to you instead of paying someone to take them away for mulch!