PALM TRASH -WHAT DO YOU DO WITH IT?

[Really full garden]

I dont think I have ever seen this topic covered in this forum.

I have two acres of beachfront garden that are primarily planted with coconuts (about 80) and the amount of litter (dead leaves,nuts and spent flowers) is incredible.I tried composting them and the leaves just do not decompose so I have to burn them or have them hauled off.Are there any other alternatives?

                                                                   Scott

[bgl]

Wow, Scott, just posted this photo yesterday in the Lundkvist Palm Garden thread! This is our solution: A-L-L the way in the back. On someone else's property...

[Tad]

use thwm as mulch, and they will eventually compost away

[Carlo Morici]

I cut them in smaller parts and leave them below the palm, somehow hidden beneath the herbaceous plants. In the palmetum they collect leaves and chop them in a large machine, then the product is spread back as mulching.

I just do what the palms asked me to do.  

Carlo

[Carlo Morici]

(scottgt @ May 27 2007,23:37)

QUOTE

I have (...) coconuts (about 80) .I tried composting them and the leaves just do not decompose so I have to burn them or have them hauled off.Are there any other alternatives?

Purchase a chopping machine and make mulch or make a huge mound of leaves and let them compost.

If they don't compost, it is because compost basically needs "50%brown and 50%green" to kickstart the right biological processes. I know little but my guess is that you should mix the dry coconut leaves with "green" material, such as lawn mowings. Excess of salt on leaves can also delay composting. Other people can surely tell you more.

Scott, if you are on a sandy beach, you will really need a huge amount of organic matter to improve growth in your garden. I would not burn a single leaflet.

Carlo

[Really full garden]

I think that in a wet tropical climate they do breakdown fairly fast.The climate at the beach is dry most of the time.Coconut fronds are by far the slowest to break down(years).Roystonea,Ptychospermas,Syagrus and Licualas are more biodegradable.

                                                                            Scott

[chris.oz]

I dont have many leaves since palms grow slowly here,  so I chop them up and mulch them in a shredder.  In a garden like Bo s you would need to shred all day once a week.   The sheer mass of trash is a problem in any tropical garden,  large gardens require weekly clean ups.

[Really full garden]

Carlo, thank you for the composting advice. I think the reason coconuts do so well at sea also explains why they do not break down.

                                                            Scott

[DoomsDave]

Use it for mulch:

[LJG]

Here is SoCal we are allowed 6 trash cans full of yard waste each week in our weekly trash pick up. So I get rid of mine that way.

I like the shredder idea to create my own mulch.

[Kris]

Dear Scott  

here in india & at my place we used to make broom sticks to

sweep the floor from this coco leaves.and the rest is usually

sent out as garbage.i have never heard that the leaves or

spent flowers or nuts being used as mulch here in india.

they are hard to become a bio product,since they take time to

disintegrate.and if used in tropical countries,they will lead to the grouth of insects,pests and even mosquitos....and last

but not the least even fungus & mashroom grouth !

so think about it.mulch from dicots become bio composites very easily unlike coco nut products.

Love,

Kris(India)  

[PalmGuyWC]

It takes years for palm debris to decay in California with our long dry summers, and since palm debris is very fiberous, shreading is not an option.  I used to try it but it just didn't work and it's very time consuming. Even our local garbage dump requires that palm debris be put in a seperate area because the palm fiber gums up their shreader.

My solution was to buy an old pickup truck and it makes about 10 trips to the dump a year. It seems like I always have a pile of old fronds, spent inflorescences, etc.  When the pile gets to big, away to the dump it goes. The main disadvantage of my system is that my friends are always asking to use my truck and I bet they put more milage on the truck than I do.

I have two large Oak trees and they put down an amazing amount of debris.  I save all the Oak leaves when they come down in the winter, as it makes excellent mulch.

Dick

[NCpalmqueen]

Easy solution.  Please send your coconut palms to me.

[Jeff Searle]

In our small town, we have bulk pick-up every friday. It's great, I put it on a corner of which 2 or 3 others also put their clippings out in the same pile. Off it goes.

Jeff

[DoomsDave]

The long breakdown period makes palm leaves perfect mulch here in Cali.  Once my palms really get going, I won't have to buy mulch again.

[Gonzer]

Many areas make you separate palm fronds from other, "normal" green waste. They wreak havoc on a chipper's belt. Just ask Dr. D.

[Walt]

I burn all my palm waste (fronds), along with other wood debris, such as dead and downed tree limbs (pine, oak, etc.) and lots of pine needles and pine cones. The burning creates quite a bit of ash over a year period.

I have very acidic soil, below 4.0 pH. Wood ash has an approximate calcium carbonate (lime) equivalent of 25 - 50% (depending on wood species), and also acts as a mild fertilizer, as it contains about 10% potash and has smaller amounts of magnesium, phosphorus, iron, manganese, boron, copper, zine et al.

I use the ash mainly as a lime substitute, and also as a supplement to my standard fertilization regime.

Just this week I put down a 20 CF cartload of ash around some of my palms and plants which exhausted my supply of ash. Right now the state of Florida (where I live) has a state-wide ban on burning yard waste due to drought conditions. Once the ban is lifted I will start burning again.

[Tad]

(Gonzer @ May 28 2007,14:16)

QUOTE

Many areas make you separate palm fronds from other, "normal" green waste. They wreak havoc on a chipper's belt. Just ask Dr. D.

who is dr. d?

[Carlo Morici]

Yes, composting in the tropics can attract unwanted insects (Rhynchophorus, Oryctes, Opogona...), especially freshly shredded palm leaves. This can be controlled by various means, but again I am no expert. ... something like mixing different debris and/or covering the pile with landscape fabric.

There must be a way to do it. If you have a large amount of leaves and a poor soil, you need to rescue that organic matter somehow. Burning leaves sends the carbon to the sky and so the organic matter, so helpful to clayish or sandy soils. Some nutrients are left in the ash, but the big C is lost in the smoke.

Carlo

[PalmGuyWC]

The waste people have a quarterly pickup here, but the amount they take away hardly puts a dent in my pile of fronds, also one bin a week, with the weekly pickup.....but that hardly takes care of the weeds I pull in a week. Open fire burning is strictly forbiden in Contra Costa County, and it can get you a heafty fine. A good Bar-B-Q with smoke, (Opps, burned it again)! will attract the fire department in my parts.

Jeff, your lucky you have a weekly pick up.  Coral Gables used to have a weekly pickup, but they discontinued it years ago....except after a hurricane.

Lets face it, palms produce a lot of debris, but at least it's a gradual thing, not like my Oak leaves that come down all at once, and my pool seems to be a magnet for the Oak leaves.  I remember when I lived in Florida....one fallen Royal palm frond could wipe out bromelaids, orchids, vines, etc. where it fell. I suppose thats the reason they have such clean trunks.

One thing I have learned, if you put large fan fronds on the truck bed with the petioles at the gate, the bed can be piled up, and then when you get to the dump, the whole load can be eaisly slidden out with two guys tugging on it. It takes 1 or 2 hrs, to load the truck, 10 seconds to unload it, anything that makes it eaiser.

I hate going to the dump, but that's where I usually pick up nice plastic pots.  I haven't bought plastic pots in years, and I usually unload where a landscaper has dumped dozens of nice pots. The waste management people frown on taking pots, but if you are nice to them, or slip them 5 bucks, you could haul away the dump.

Dick

[RRONNIE]

Same here Jeff, in my town "city hall" contractors pick up prunes (and other non organic trash - boxes furniture etc.) every Friday and Sunday. All one has to do is place it in front of the house, in an accessible location, in the sreet.

Our tax money works sometimes...

Ronnie

[chris.oz]

(PalmGuyWC @ May 28 2007,07:36)

QUOTE

I used to try it but it just didn't work and it's very time consuming. Even our local garbage dump requires that palm debris be put in a seperate area because the palm fiber gums up their shreader.

Dick,

To stop the long fibres from gumming up the shredder,  the fronds have to be cut into short lengths with secateurs.

AND mix them in with dicot leaves and twigs.   Dry twigs and branches also help to clear the long fibres from the shredder chamber/blades.

With a big palm garden,  this would not be practical.

[DoomsDave]

Dead palm leaves make the BEST kindling for a fire place, and I've got two.

Burn baby burn . . .

dave

[Tomsky]

Years ago, I would save my palm debris for the last week in the year. I would rent out a pickup truck to bring this stuff to the city dump. Prior to renting the truck, I would go through prepping the palm stuff for several days by bring them out to the front yard and cutting them into smaller manageable segments.

Then the city closed the dump and gave us large garbage cans: black for regular garbage, blue for recyclables, and green for garden cuttings. However, according to their regulations, the palms had to be put in the black can. I have palm prunings every week. So the black cans consist of about one-third real garbage and two-thirds palms.

[fiji jim]

On our 6 acres we have heaps of palm debris and when it is freshly fallen or trimmed off we put it through a chipper that is a Troy Built, 8hp and another that is powered by a 6hp engine.

They cut it all including coconuts once they have been halved. Chippers do not like soft wet matter like ginger stems but cut up anything that is woody including all palm fronds so long as they have not been lying around getting wet and soggy. Hard woods should be fed through while still green.

Then the piles decompose and are fed back to the plants the next year and the compost is just like a cross between a peat potting mix and a fine soil.

The only disadvantage is that some insects use the pile as a breeding location. Perhaps covering with a plastic would prevent that and increase the rate of decomposition.

Jim

[BS Man about Palms]

  Jeff Searle said:

In our small town, we have bulk pick-up every friday. It's great, I put it on a corner of which 2 or 3 others also put their clippings out in the same pile. Off it goes.

Jeff

Gee, been there, done that.