Detailed native range map for Florida Royal Palms.

[Ubuntwo]

Interesting to note that many smaller historical populations of Royal Palms in the Everglades are now extirpated, more than I have on the map. Historical accounts describe them as occuring in several isolated populations in the Ten Thousand islands and north of Cape Sable. There were also several indian mound hammocks in the Everglades where small groves occured. Of all of these, only one population remains, on "Johnson Mound" in the west everglades (Google Maps location - the white stalks are Royals). The reason for the decline of small populations is a variety of factors. In the early days of Miami it was commonplace to transplant palms from the Everglades, and the impacts of this can be seen most visibly in the Paradise Key Hammock. Historical accounts described hundreds of Royals breaching through the canopy. Now they only number in the dozens. Another large reason, specifically for the coastal populations, is salt water encroachment. Sea levels have risen by a foot in the area over the past century, and as a result the coastal hammocks and shell mounds are being invaded by buttonwood and mangrove. This renders them much more susceptible to storm surges and tidal flooding, and royals are only moderately salt tolerant. As an example it seems like Irma's surge may have taken its toll on the previously mentioned Johnson Mound population, with some dead "lamp posts" left standing in recent imagery, mostly those closer to the hammock edge.
 

[SWFLchris]

There is also a native stand of them located in Secret Woods Nature Center off of Marina Mile (SR 84) in Fort Lauderdale. 

[Ubuntwo]

5 hours ago, SWFLchris said:

There is also a native stand of them located in Secret Woods Nature Center off of Marina Mile (SR 84) in Fort Lauderdale. 

This population is naturalized from volunteers. Roystonea regia is not recorded as native in Broward county.

[Jimbean]

They are only recorded native in Monroe, Dade, Palm Beach, Martin, Collier, and Desoto counties.

Below is a map that I made a couple of months ago.  Counties where Roystonea regia are officially recorded native are in dark green, where naturalized in light green, where cultivated long term (planted prior to the 1989 freeze and survived) in grey, and orange is where once native and has since been extirpated.

 

[NOT A TA]

Has anyone ever done a study to determine if current or past stands of Royals were previously seen or are still reproducing in areas where there were Indian villages? According to the FL Department of state there were indigenous peoples here 12,000 years ago and by 1000-1500 AD there were tribes like the Calusa with Cypress log canoes capable of reaching Cuba. Might they have brought Royal seed back with them? Perhaps to be grown for smaller dug out canoes or tree trunk post walls that surrounded some villages? If Indians were planting seeds in areas they knew would be favorable for growth near villages that might explain why there are large gaps between stands referred to as "natural".

[Ubuntwo]

Just now, Jimbean said:

They are only recorded native in Monroe, Dade, Palm Beach, Martin, Collier, and Desoto counties.

Below is a map that I made a couple of months ago.  Counties where Roystonea regia are officially recorded native are in dark green, where naturalized in light green, where cultivated long term (planted prior to the 1989 freeze and survived) in grey, and orange is where once native and has since been extirpated.

 

I remember reading that they had naturalized on Sanibel in small populations, and Royals have naturalized in Koreshan Preserve as well as Caloosahatchee Creeks Preserve. So I think you can mark Lee and Charlotte counties as naturalized, as well as up to Brevard on the east coast. Also the DeSoto county, Palm Beach county, and Martin county populations are vouchered but have no historical backing, so it seems more likely that they are introduced from early habitation by settlers in the late 1800's (You can see Small's historical account here). It also seems quite unlikely that the Royals Bartram observed were natively growing there, but instead transplanted by natives as they likely did with the Okeechobee gourd in the same area. 

[Ubuntwo]

Just now, NOT A TA said:

Has anyone ever done a study to determine if current or past stands of Royals were previously seen or are still reproducing in areas where there were Indian villages? According to the FL Department of state there were indigenous peoples here 12,000 years ago and by 1000-1500 AD there were tribes like the Calusa with Cypress log canoes capable of reaching Cuba. Might they have brought Royal seed back with them? Perhaps to be grown for smaller dug out canoes or tree trunk post walls that surrounded some villages? If Indians were planting seeds in areas they knew would be favorable for growth near villages that might explain why there are large gaps between stands referred to as "natural".

The scattering of populations in the Everglades can be explained by the fact that they only grow on hammocks which have a similar distribution. The Batram account up north, as well as a couple extirpated populations on Indian shell mounds, does seem to suggest that natives planted them in certain areas. However I think it's more likely that they got them from the Fakahatchee instead of Cuba, since the palms are so widespread it seems impossible for it to have started just a few hundred years ago. Maybe someone else has more info on this.

[Jimbean]

6 minutes ago, Ubuntwo said:

I remember reading that they had naturalized on Sanibel in small populations, and Royals have naturalized in Koreshan Preserve as well as Caloosahatchee Creeks Preserve. So I think you can mark Lee and Charlotte counties as naturalized, as well as up to Brevard on the east coast. Also the DeSoto county, Palm Beach county, and Martin county populations are vouchered but have no historical backing, so it seems more likely that they are introduced from early habitation by settlers in the late 1800's (You can see Small's historical account here). It also seems quite unlikely that the Royals Bartram observed were natively growing there, but instead transplanted by natives as they likely did with the Okeechobee gourd in the same area. 

This is an interesting topic.  It sounds like you have done some historical reading regarding Florida ecology. 

I am not at all be surprised that royals naturalized in Lee and Charlotte counties.  I have not noticed any significant naturalization here in Brevard.  I have seen seedlings and a few juveniles less than four feet tall volunteer in wooded areas; they naturalize about as easily as Dypsis lutescens, which are typically less than two feet tall in wooded areas within neighborhoods.  I posted a picture yesterday of a nearly mature Dypsis lutescens, which I though was pretty significant. 

[Jimbean]

7 minutes ago, Ubuntwo said:

The scattering of populations in the Everglades can be explained by the fact that they only grow on hammocks which have a similar distribution. The Batram account up north, as well as a couple extirpated populations on Indian shell mounds, does seem to suggest that natives planted them in certain areas. However I think it's more likely that they got them from the Fakahatchee instead of Cuba, since the palms are so widespread it seems impossible for it to have started just a few hundred years ago. Maybe someone else has more info on this.

This is speculation, but perhaps they were planted thousands of years ago; but I would not know the reason why if this was the case.  It could also be from migrating birds.

[NOT A TA]

3 minutes ago, Jimbean said:

This is speculation, but perhaps they were planted thousands of years ago; but I would not know the reason why if this was the case.  It could also be from migrating birds.

Sometimes birds are swept up and carried a loong way.  I remember years ago when I had homes in CT and FL there was a hurricane that traveled up the coast as it degraded. One of those large dark color long billed squawker birds (that really loud annoying squawk) that live along the canals here showed up in CT. My employees told me there was a prehistoric bird by the river on the property. When I saw it I told them we had them in S FL but I'd never seen them anywhere else. They'd never seen wild birds that large. Here they nest in Sabal Palmetto along the canal my house is on.

[Ubuntwo]

46 minutes ago, NOT A TA said:

Has anyone ever done a study to determine if current or past stands of Royals were previously seen or are still reproducing in areas where there were Indian villages? According to the FL Department of state there were indigenous peoples here 12,000 years ago and by 1000-1500 AD there were tribes like the Calusa with Cypress log canoes capable of reaching Cuba. Might they have brought Royal seed back with them? Perhaps to be grown for smaller dug out canoes or tree trunk post walls that surrounded some villages? If Indians were planting seeds in areas they knew would be favorable for growth near villages that might explain why there are large gaps between stands referred to as "natural".

Oh, and there is one specific example where royals occur in former native-inhabited areas. This is Johnson Mound, (https://www.google.com/maps/@25.5328004,-81.175493,150m/data=!3m1!1e3) and it is an indian shell mound (so clearly was inhabited or frequented by natives). You can see there is still a sizeable population of royals in this specific spot. Sadly it is very, very, very poorly documented so that's pretty much all the info there is.

[hbernstein]

I've seen old photos taken along the Miami River  soon after the construction of the Miami River canal in the early 1900s that included some very large Royals. I doubt that they had been planted.

[Ubuntwo]

51 minutes ago, hbernstein said:

I've seen old photos taken along the Miami River  soon after the construction of the Miami River canal in the early 1900s that included some very large Royals. I doubt that they had been planted.

I know they were reported in a couple spots along Biscayne bay so it seems possible.

[kurt decker]

Royals produce tremendous amounts of seeds that are eaten and moved around by birds everyday.  There's probably not a spot in Florida it hasn't had royal palm seed deposited at some point or another. The limiting factor for the spread of that plant, besides cold weather, is the exacting conditions that seedlings need to survive. They need moisture, but not flooding. They are very cold sensitive. If they dry out at all, they die. The fungus that kills the seedlings as always been relentless, I saw thousands of seeds sprout in my yard over the years and every single one got killed by the fungus. The plant seems to have mutated to the point where the fungus is no longer as virulent. Volunteers sprout all over the place now and grow to maturity, this was almost unknown even 25 years ago. I don't think many Indians moved Royal Palm seed around. They would have no compelling reason to do so. I think birds have done it all. Royal palms grow extremely fast, It's not unusual to see a volunteer get 15 feet of trunk in five or six years, I see it all the time in my farm. So there being a hundred miles between patches of trees makes more sense when you consider the bird angle, if mammals were moving them around the range would be more contiguous.

Edited February 25, 2019 by kurt decker

[Jimbean]

I've noticed that fungus killing seedlings.  Good point.

[Ubuntwo]

Royals are indeed very particular, in fact, the only place they consistently thrive in Florida is the Collier County strand swamps. In Everglades hammocks, however, a national parks report describes the plant as currently propgating poorly. The specific conditions required for optimal growth and not often met, and as a result populations are not growing or spreading much there. The same report also claims that a disturbance may be required for increased propagation. This theory may actually have some merit. Fire burning into a hammock will not only allow seedlings to have more exposure to sunlight, but the resulting organic material deposit will help fertilize seedlings.

[Missi]

On 2/22/2019 at 7:55 PM, Ubuntwo said:

From my minimal research can't find any reason for them to be introduced or naturalized, so I marked them as native on the new map. They sure do look at home!

Edit: Got it! This report has Roystonea as native but very rare in Corkscrew Swamp!

We have sooo many of them used in landscaping and medians. Didn't at the time this big'un started, though.

[Ubuntwo]

2 hours ago, Missi said:

We have sooo many of them used in landscaping and medians. Didn't at the time this big'un started, though.

And those in landscaping usually are closer to those found in Cuba. You can see the straight and thin trunk in this one, which you usually see in the Florida native populations.

[Eric in Orlando]

We have some planted at Leu Gardens grown from Fakahatchee collected seed. Some get some shade and have the thinner straight trunks.

[kurt decker]

Next interesting one to watch is going to be the thrinax radiata. Like royal palms, it was almost unknown in cultivation 25 years ago. Now it is probably the most heavily planted new palm in the state. The range was formerly limited to the middle and upper Keys and possibly Cape Sable. Now they're putting out tens of thousands of trees all over the southern half of the state, and they're all starting to seed. It's another one that doesn't regenerate as easily as you would think. But with that many out there, it's going to, and all over the place. Keep your eyes open

[Jimbean]

23 minutes ago, kurt decker said:

Next interesting one to watch is going to be the thrinax radiata. Like royal palms, it was almost unknown in cultivation 25 years ago. Now it is probably the most heavily planted new palm in the state. The range was formerly limited to the middle and upper Keys and possibly Cape Sable. Now they're putting out tens of thousands of trees all over the southern half of the state, and they're all starting to seed. It's another one that doesn't regenerate as easily as you would think. But with that many out there, it's going to, and all over the place. Keep your eyes open

I've already seen this happen in Cocoa Beach.

[palmsOrl]

I had no idea Roystonea regia was that uncommon in cultivation 25 years ago.  Definitely in Central Florida, but I thought it has been super common in South Florida for 75-100+ years.

[Ubuntwo]

1 hour ago, palmsOrl said:

I had no idea Roystonea regia was that uncommon in cultivation 25 years ago.  Definitely in Central Florida, but I thought it has been super common in South Florida for 75-100+ years.

It was a pretty common planting in parts of the Miami area, but not to the extent it is now. Most royals in cultivation in South Florida right now were planted within the last ~30 years. If that wasn't the case you'd be seeing 70+ foot royals everywhere.

[palmsOrl]

3 minutes ago, Ubuntwo said:

It was a pretty common planting in parts of the Miami area, but not to the extent it is now. Most royals in cultivation in South Florida right now were planted within the last ~30 years. If that wasn't the case you'd be seeing 70+ foot royals everywhere.

Couldn’t that lack of really tall royals be due to lightning, which is super common in South Florida?

[Jimbean]

4 minutes ago, palmsOrl said:

Couldn’t that lack of really tall royals be due to lightning, which is super common in South Florida?

sure but you wouldn't have more tall royals in the Everglades than in cultivated areas

[palmsOrl]

True Jim.  But, other than the exception here and there, I didn’t see any super tall royals towering above the canopy even when I was in the Fakahatchee.

[Jimbean]

1 minute ago, palmsOrl said:

True Jim.  But, other than the exception here and there, I didn’t see any super tall royals towering above the canopy even when I was in the Fakahatchee.

hmm, okay

[Gregory]

Maybe interesting, maybe not. But here is a nice royal growing on the south side of Lake Monroe, east of downtown Sanford in a residential neighborhood. I'm guessing it's roughly 20 ft tall.

[NOT A TA]

Quite a few around my neighborhood over 25 years old, pic below. Last fall I asked my next door neighbor to let one of the flowers on one of his trees go to seed so I could observe and then have the seed. IIRC the tree's about 35 years old.  He started it from seed and he normally cuts off flowers on his Roystoneas so he doesn't have a mess to clean up.  First thing I noticed was wildlife wasn't interested in eating the seed. When I took the whole infructescense down it was loaded so apparently local birds, squirrels, etc. don't like Roystonea seed. I planted the seeds various ways (to test germination techniques) and they started sprouting at just over a month for certain methods up to a little over 2 months for other methods. No problems with fungus so far on seedlings (hundreds).

One thing I've noticed is that in some cases, cultivated Royals in landscape settings die off seemingly "early" after having been in the same place attended to by the same owners for decades. I think there may be a connection to grass trimming, weed chemicals, and/or possibly the lack of debris creating a mound at the base of the tree for new roots to develop in the root initiation zone as they age causing their early demise. My neighbor who let the seed grow for me has been loosing a tree every few years since I moved in. Note the root initiation zone of the palm closest to the camera which is one of his. I see this a lot in older landscape settings here and some trees seem to be affected more than others. After this pic was taken I did get him to mulch around the base of the palm shown after he questioned me about it being the next one expected to die as it's been pencil pointing. After mulching the newer fronds seem to be getting bigger. HOWEVER, he's still using a steel bladed motorized edger around it ever other week so.........

[chinandega81]

I notice naturalized Royals all over Miami. I am always on the lookout. I think something eats the seeds because they sprout up where there is no parent trees, at least not withing seed falling distance.

 

I would guess they are not so common in the wild Everglades becasue of lightning strikes...even in Miami they seem to succumb to lightning quite a bit.

[RedRabbit]

I’d like like to add that I recently saw a small royal growing in the woods at Sawgrass Lake Park in Saint Petersburg so apparently royals are naturalizing as far north as Pinellas County. 

[NOT A TA]

1 hour ago, chinandega81 said:

I notice naturalized Royals all over Miami. I am always on the lookout. I think something eats the seeds because they sprout up where there is no parent trees, at least not withing seed falling distance.

 

I would guess they are not so common in the wild Everglades becasue of lightning strikes...even in Miami they seem to succumb to lightning quite a bit.

Here's a pic of the birds that spread them here in my neighborhood. Perhaps 50-100 in a group fly in and take turns picking ripe seed off the infrutescense that's ready for eating. They'll arrive every afternoon till the ripe ones are gone. Funny but they'll only take them from the palm. I've never seen them go after the fallen ones around the base of the tree. The seed germinates wherever the birds drop them and pop up as volunteers all summer long in gardens etc. Under the phone wires they sit on (near the palm) there's always lots of seed almost like they go pick a few seeds off the tree and sit on the wires chewing the fruit off and dropping clean seed while their buddies take their turn picking seed. What you can't really see in the pic below is that there are probably 20 more birds eating the fruit on the infrutescense on the right.

[Xenon]

Hard to tell from the pic, but it looks like the birds might be a species of parrot. I wonder if all the feral/naturalized parrots in Florida are aiding in seed dispersal, they are generally quite fond of most palm fruits. 

[sonoranfans]

I was unaware that the cuban royal palm(roystonea regia) was native to florida.  Last I read, the taxonomists were saying there was not difference and that roystonea elata(supposed florida royal) was not a separate species and that man brought the cuban royal to florida 200-300(?) years ago.  If true that would make all of these palms naturalized, no?

[kinzyjr]

4 minutes ago, sonoranfans said:

taxonomists were saying there was not difference and that roystonea elata(supposed florida royal) was not a separate species

This is the case per ThePlantList.org

[Cape Garrett]

On 2/22/2019 at 5:11 PM, Ubuntwo said:

Updated map...

Yellow includes the most significant naturalized/maybe native populations - on parts of the St. Lucie River, the Northwest Fork of the Loxahatchee River down to Riverbend Park, Matheson Hammock + Deering Estate, Peace River, and Emerson Point as well as a small grove on Lake Okeechobee.

There is also a small population in Cape Coral, Lee county, right on the Calusahatchee River.  You can see them all from veterans memorial parkway on the north side going towards Fort Myers. Just before the bridge.  Some large specimens growing directly in the water mixed in with the mangroves.

[Cape Garrett]

On 2/24/2019 at 9:49 PM, Jimbean said:

They are only recorded native in Monroe, Dade, Palm Beach, Martin, Collier, and Desoto counties.

Below is a map that I made a couple of months ago.  Counties where Roystonea regia are officially recorded native are in dark green, where naturalized in light green, where cultivated long term (planted prior to the 1989 freeze and survived) in grey, and orange is where once native and has since been extirpated.

 

Why would a native range of anything "skip" over counties?  Especially when the land in south and southwest Florida is flat.

[Cape Garrett]

On 3/1/2019 at 9:34 PM, Ubuntwo said:

It was a pretty common planting in parts of the Miami area, but not to the extent it is now. Most royals in cultivation in South Florida right now were planted within the last ~30 years. If that wasn't the case you'd be seeing 70+ foot royals everywhere.

Fort Myers is nicknamed the city of palms after Thomas Edison lined McGregor Blvd with them wayyyy back in the day.  Definitely more than 70 years ago.

[Jimbean]

2 hours ago, Cape Garrett said:

Why would a native range of anything "skip" over counties?  Especially when the land in south and southwest Florida is flat.

Micro climates and soil composition.  Happens all of the time.  

[Jimbean]

Royal Palm (Roystonea regia) · iNaturalist

 

Look at the map tab and zoom on Florida.  These are wild specimens that have been vouched over the years.