Phoenix species identification

[Yort]

I came across this naturalized population of clustering Phoenix palms and can't seem to find any information about them. Before I give more information and a location I am interested to see what species you think it is? Bonus point if you can guess the location.

[gilles06]

Looks like spontaneous phoenix dactilifera.

I think it is in The Canarian islands...

[Pal Meir]

Ph theophrasti on Κρήτη?

[Yort]

There are about 30 individual clumps of these palms scattered over a large area inland from San-Andres in the beautiful valley Barranco de las Huertas in the extreme north of Tenerife. There are no wild Phoenix canariensis present in this valley. I think it is most likely that they are naturalized Phoenix dactylifera but I am a bit uncertain because they seem to have a rather strange look to them and the female inflorescence seemed quite short. Unfortunately there was no fruit. I did not observe these palms anywhere else in the north of Tenerife. Because they are scattered over such a large area and some clumps are very old I believe they have to be growing here for a long time. There is a tiny village in the valley with just a few houses that is called Los Palmitos which suggest that palms probably grew in this valley when the village was named. 

Edited February 16, 2020 by Yort

[UK_Palms]

They don't look like pure Dactylifera. Some of those specimens look like Dacty x Canariensis hybrids. Others look more like Dacty x Pheophrasti. It has to be some form of hybridised Dacty, surely. As you said, they don't look like regular Dacty. Something is definitely amiss about this strand/population.

Is it possible that this Phoenix strand could even be Phoenix Atlantica? Those are endemic to the Cape Verde Islands to the south of the Canaries. Animals or humans could have easily transported the seeds north to Tenerife in previous centuries. Then you've suddenly got an isolated population there. Much like the isolated Theophrasti population in southwestern Turkey.

[Phoenikakias]

On 2/16/2020 at 7:51 PM, Yort said:

There are about 30 individual clumps of these palms scattered over a large area inland from San-Andres in the beautiful valley Barranco de las Huertas in the extreme north of Tenerife. There are no wild Phoenix canariensis present in this valley. I think it is most likely that they are naturalized Phoenix dactylifera but I am a bit uncertain because they seem to have a rather strange look to them and the female inflorescence seemed quite short. Unfortunately there was no fruit. I did not observe these palms anywhere else in the north of Tenerife. Because they are scattered over such a large area and some clumps are very old I believe they have to be growing here for a long time. There is a tiny village in the valley with just a few houses that is called Los Palmitos which suggest that palms probably grew in this valley when the village was named. 

Agree with you, they are rogue dactylifera. The small spines along the petiole are a dead give away.  Imo a very decisive differentiating feature between feral dacties and wild, relative spp. Imo small spines is the result of selective breeding for millennia long.

[Yort]

Ok so they are most likely P. dactylifera. The thing is that most plant parts of these palms are tiny compared to other dactylifera I have seen. For instance, I estimate the leaf length including the petiole of mature specimens just over 2 meters. Offcourse this can be caused by environmental influences like drought but this valley is very moist and green so I think it's a genetic trait.

[Phoenikakias]

Your estimation is wrong lol.  With 2 m only overall length of a frond, palm should look really tiny and, if having a well developed trunk, with a very disproportional crown. I know well because I have a Phoenix loureiroi with leaves of only up to 2 m.