Phoenix Roebelenii x Dactylifera hardiness

[DAVEinMB]

Anybody have any first hand experience with one of these regarding hardiness? I have one coming from MPOM along with the silver queen and don't have much knowledge of them. If I was gonna take a stab at it I'd guess 20F or maaaaaybe high teens but wanted to get feedback from you guys. Thanks as always!

[Dimovi]

I would agree, around 20F. Dactylifera takes at least mid teens and robelenii is mid 20s so rule of thumb is to average.

By the way where is your silver Queen coming from? I've been trying to get one for a while.

[DAVEinMB]

13 hours ago, Dimovi said:

I would agree, around 20F. Dactylifera takes at least mid teens and robelenii is mid 20s so rule of thumb is to average.

By the way where is your silver Queen coming from? I've been trying to get one for a while.

Good deal, thanks! 

I ordered mine from Mule Palms of Mississippi 

[Dimovi]

On 7/11/2020 at 7:55 AM, DAVEinMB said:

I ordered mine from Mule Palms of Mississippi 

Great, I also ordered one from there.

[jwitt]

This Palm survived -5f in 2011

[Dimovi]

12 hours ago, jwitt said:

This Palm survived -5f in 2011

That's impressive, though I suspect the temperature this exact palm experienced was a bit higher because it is right up against that tall cinder block building, which can retain heat and provide shelter.

[Fusca]

Must have been extremely low humidity also to survive temps that low.  And it wasn't as tall back then so wasn't exposed to north winds as I'm assuming that it's planted on the south side of that building.

[jwitt]

12 hours ago, Fusca said:

Must have been extremely low humidity also to survive temps that low.  And it wasn't as tall back then so wasn't exposed to north winds as I'm assuming that it's planted on the south side of that building.

Couple points about that event at this locale at nearly 4000'  elevation:

You are correct this Palm missed the "North" winds. You see, the "real" cold here comes from the east as it did in this event. So this Palm was fully exposed to the wind .  That wind was a constant 20-30 mph during that -5f as evidenced by the weather station a couple blocks away(NMSU). 

 

The records indicate the relative humidity during that -5f was between 80-90% .  This was preceded by rain, then snow, followed by the Arctic event without the crown drying. That being said, -5F degree air is extremely dry anywhere in the world regardless of humidity. That is the property of air.

 

Winter Solar isolation in this region is the highest anywhere in the US. That is why a P. Dac is shown to survive in a 8a climate.

 

No P. Rob in this region.

 

Here are some robusta that survived that same event a couple blocks away.  Some did die, probably less than 10% at this location.

 

[jwitt]

Forgot to mention the high was 7.5f!

[DAVEinMB]

@jwitt that's insane that dactylifera and those robustas pulled through that event, especially given the precipitation that accompanied it. -5F here would kill a lot of things including some people haha

[jwitt]

8 hours ago, jwitt said:

Forgot to mention the high was 7.5f!

Actually I think this is inaccurate(mid teens?)

[DAVEinMB]

Well I can share some experience with mine from its first winter in the ground.

We had a very wet but mild winter with our lowest temp bottoming out at 24f. I got it planted late July and I decided to not protect it unless we were forecasted to be at 20f or below. Christmas night we dropped to 24f and it was wet leading into it. I'm not sure if it was this night alone or the combination of the initial 20 degree night coupled with some other nights in the 20s but it did spear pull. I can't remember if it was in January or February but either way it was still very much during the winter. I was able to nurse it back to health so luckily it fought through. The picture is from today; by the looks of it, 3 fronds were comprised. 

I think if it had been bigger and/or more established it may not have had this issue but I guess we'll see as time goes on. My question is since it battled through losing a spear will that help its resilience moving forward or does that not matter?

[Collectorpalms]

11 minutes ago, DAVEinMB said:

Well I can share some experience with mine from its first winter in the ground.

We had a very wet but mild winter with our lowest temp bottoming out at 24f. I got it planted late July and I decided to not protect it unless we were forecasted to be at 20f or below. Christmas night we dropped to 24f and it was wet leading into it. I'm not sure if it was this night alone or the combination of the initial 20 degree night coupled with some other nights in the 20s but it did spear pull. I can't remember if it was in January or February but either way it was still very much during the winter. I was able to nurse it back to health so luckily it fought through. The picture is from today; by the looks of it, 3 fronds were comprised. 

I think if it had been bigger and/or more established it may not have had this issue but I guess we'll see as time goes on. My question is since it battled through losing a spear will that help its resilience moving forward or does that not matter?

Past freezes won’t matter. No muscle memory. I am just confirming that the fatter the date no matter the species the more likely it will come back. Mature CIDP is outperforming Dacty, Theo etc.. here during a long duration freeze girth matters.

I just put in an order for a Phoenix Roebelenii x CIDP to replace my dead looking Dates. Maybe my Reclinata will come back since it’s a natural clusterer? Otherwise I’ll only have a couple female CIDP.... and maybe something is happening with my 35FT Sylvestris?? Something is happening up top, can’t tell yet. Need a drone. 

Edited April 12, 2021 by Collectorpalms

[Matt N- Dallas]

Roebelleni x dactylifera has been nearly as tender to cold as roebelleni judging by spear pull & leaf damage in Harlingen, TX after a 23* low.  

[DAVEinMB]

2 hours ago, Matt N- Dallas said:

Roebelleni x dactylifera has been nearly as tender to cold as roebelleni judging by spear pull & leaf damage in Harlingen, TX after a 23* low.  

Well that's disheartening news. Guess my protection plans will have to be adjusted by a few degrees. 

How big is the one you're referring to?

[Matt N- Dallas]

It has about 1’ of trunk.  

[DAVEinMB]

17 hours ago, Matt N- Dallas said:

It has about 1’ of trunk.  

Well balls...