Coldest Temperatures since the Arctic Outbreak of December 1989

[buffy]

I'm sitting at 0F. Heavy on the "F". All time record low is -4F back in the 1930. 1899 was the other time we touched 0F. Longview didn't hit 0F in '89 or '83. Couple more hours of cooling to go.

[Meangreen94z]

It looks like the panhandle warmed up, temperatures have risen in the last few hours. I did see Canadian, TX hit -14*F before I went to bed around 2am.

[Reyes Vargas]

We were supposed to get down to 23° Last night but I woke up this morning and the sky was completely covered in clouds.  My thermometer read 30°.  Clouds saved us.

[romeyjdogg]

Weather stations near me showing -1° F here in Fort Worth, TX. This is unbelievable. Farewell Sabals and JxB...I barely knew yee

Edited February 16, 2021 by romeyjdogg

[Collectorpalms]

[buffy]

We hit -4F tying our all time record low. Obliteration. 

[Swolte]

Oh man... this was the worst. Hitting the teens later this week doesn't even sound that bad now.  

[TexasColdHardyPalms]

@buffy I looked at temps this morning and was surprised to see Tyler colder than DFW as that doesn't happen too often. 

[TexasColdHardyPalms]

I woke up to water on the floor so i was preoccupied and didnt get to take these screenshots earlier. 

[mnorell]

20 hours ago, mulungu said:

Thanks much for that reference article. 

From what I gather, no protective measures were afforded to the palms in those freezes-- was that your sense as well(?)-- which would make their recovery all the more impressive. 

This has me clinging here to a vestige of hope that when the protective blankets/pots/bins/tarps are peeled back this weekend I will encounter something more than just the acrid, sickly-sweet aroma of frostbitten, dead plant material.

Yes, I think you're right, I don't think any of the plants in that article were protected. And you will certainly get some of that bacterial slop depending on how quickly you cut away dead material. But you should in no way give up hope. In 2018 after the 13F in Natchez, most everything I had in the ground came back, despite the fact that nothing was protected (including things like Acoelorrhaphe, Rhapis, courtyard-protected (and bud-in-ground) Livistona, the hardy species of Chamaedorea, etc. Sabals were fine, as were all my cycads, and all the tropical herbaceous perennials. Even one of my trunking mule palms survived.

I'm seeing from Wunderground that it looks like central San Antonio stayed more or less in the 10-13F range so not nearly as bad as in some years past. Depending on what you have in your landscape, much may return in spring/summer. If it doesn't, it might be a sign you want to rethink your planting plan and make a larger percentage of your landscape out of hardier foundation plants, since this is a periodic event in San Antonio. Think about using Sabal and live oaks, sweet olives, Michelia skinneriana,  etc. as your foundation plants with all the fun stuff planted under and amongst them. And consider using more clustering palms that have a chance to return from the roots, as well as hardier natives that you might have passed over previously in favor of marginal tropicals. To me, it's a wonderful thing after one of these occasional events in the Deep South to see a beautiful grove of Rhapidophyllum in the shade of hardy subtropical evergreen trees, with tall Sabal, plus Fatsia, Aspidistra, Aucuba, et al. (which you can interplant with your more disposable crotons, Cordylines, gingers, etc.); and they look like they just had a walk in the park. 

[SailorBold]

Woke up to another inch of snow.. this is headed your way...and another one.. 

oh.. thats the siberian express??

I dont think I wanted to know that.

[NBTX11]

33 minutes ago, mnorell said:

I'm seeing from Wunderground that it looks like central San Antonio stayed more or less in the 10-13F range so not nearly as bad as in some years past. 

San Antonio's official low last night was 13 at the airport.  I think downtown dropped to about 15.  Monday night ended up being warmer than Sunday night be 4 degrees.  I am not sure why, Monday night was forecasted to be colder.  So the 2 coldest nights in SA will end up being 9 and 13 degrees.  It will be interesting to see what recovers.  Should make it above freezing today (barely), with lows "only" in the 20's tonight.  

[ShadyDan]

I know this isn't exactly palm related, but I imagine this also spells devastation for the Texas citrus industry? I eat a lot of grapefruit and the usual stuff I get come from Texas (why not California? I don't know...). I can't imagine the trees surviving those temperatures. Guess I better expect to pay out the @$$ for my grapefruit addiction this year. Better start my own orchard up here...

Edited February 16, 2021 by ShadyDan

[NBTX11]

7 minutes ago, ShadyDan said:

I know this isn't exactly palm related, but I imagine this also spells devastation for the Texas citrus industry? I eat a lot of grapefruit and the usual stuff I get come from Texas (why not California? I don't know...). I can't imagine the trees surviving those temperatures. Guess I better expect to pay out the @$$ for my grapefruit addiction this year. Better start my own orchard up here...

I just watched a news clip on how the RGV grapefruit industry is devastated.  I don't know what their official lows were, but hear they were in the low to mid 20's in areas.

[TexasColdHardyPalms]

Weather station has the low at the nursery at -3f this morning. 

[ahosey01]

21 minutes ago, NBTX11 said:

I just watched a news clip on how the RGV grapefruit industry is devastated.  I don't know what their official lows were, but hear they were in the low to mid 20's in areas.

This is probably true for most of their crops there.  Stuff that's budding this time of year is probably going to be tender enough to die in the low-20s they experienced.  I think there's a minor economic disaster looming for the RGV.

[mulungu]

1 hour ago, mnorell said:

Yes, I think you're right, I don't think any of the plants in that article were protected. And you will certainly get some of that bacterial slop depending on how quickly you cut away dead material. But you should in no way give up hope. In 2018 after the 13F in Natchez, most everything I had in the ground came back, despite the fact that nothing was protected (including things like Acoelorrhaphe, Rhapis, courtyard-protected (and bud-in-ground) Livistona, the hardy species of Chamaedorea, etc. Sabals were fine, as were all my cycads, and all the tropical herbaceous perennials. Even one of my trunking mule palms survived.

I'm seeing from Wunderground that it looks like central San Antonio stayed more or less in the 10-13F range so not nearly as bad as in some years past. Depending on what you have in your landscape, much may return in spring/summer. If it doesn't, it might be a sign you want to rethink your planting plan and make a larger percentage of your landscape out of hardier foundation plants, since this is a periodic event in San Antonio. Think about using Sabal and live oaks, sweet olives, Michelia skinneriana,  etc. as your foundation plants with all the fun stuff planted under and amongst them. And consider using more clustering palms that have a chance to return from the roots, as well as hardier natives that you might have passed over previously in favor of marginal tropicals. To me, it's a wonderful thing after one of these occasional events in the Deep South to see a beautiful grove of Rhapidophyllum in the shade of hardy subtropical evergreen trees, with tall Sabal, plus Fatsia, Aspidistra, Aucuba, et al. (which you can interplant with your more disposable crotons, Cordylines, gingers, etc.); and they look like they just had a walk in the park. 

Great suggestions, and appreciate the benefit of your experience with 13 F.  I was kind of freaking out because while I had encountered some pretty low temps here before, the degree of cold with this event was a new experience for me: in my yard the first night of the full blast it went to 6*F and last night went to 10*F... plus we stayed below freezing for so many hours.  My part of the city is long term zone 8b; however, while realizing that much lower temps have been recorded here historically, I had felt relatively safe by sticking to mostly 8b and 8a palms.  I wasn't sure how to manage expectations when even they would be pushed to the brink with 7b temps (when forecasts were in flux, some were even predicting 7a lows).  But it appears from the article and your experience that perhaps all is not lost.  I am so looking forward to the return of spring weather this weekend!

[mnorell]

2 hours ago, ahosey01 said:

This is probably true for most of their crops there.  Stuff that's budding this time of year is probably going to be tender enough to die in the low-20s they experienced.  I think there's a minor economic disaster looming for the RGV.

I believe in general the procedure after a big bad freeze in citrus areas, provided the fruit are mature enough to have fixed sugars sufficiently, is to immediately harvest all possible fruit and juice it. So there may be a glut of juice and a paucity of fruit this year coming out of the Rio Grande Valley. To me personally it's a shame, because IMHO the grapefruit that comes out of the California low desert and Indian River territory in Florida is vastly inferior to the Texas RGV fruit. I don't know why exactly that would be, but when I lived in Natchez all the fruit would come from Texas and was delicious. In Florida it was from Indian River and was insipid. California is better but still can't match that Texas stuff. Luckily they do import the Texas grapefruit into California as well. Sad to hear this, because that industry is always tough and now in the midst of the pandemic, but this is not their first rodeo...and the trees should be able to recover for the most part if temps halted at mid-20s. I had a Rio Red in Natchez (in a protected area) return above the graft after teens, several times.

[buffy]

Officially new all time record low of -5F in Longview, Texas.  It will be interesting to see what survived.  Never thought this would be possible.

[Meangreen94z]

A few pictures near Lago Vista, TX.  Last one is several cars not able to make it back up the hill 

[GoatLockerGuns]

My ambient temp reading was 6 in NW Bexar County, TX yesterday.  Dude was snowboarding on the hill across from my house!  It will be a miracle if any of my palms make it!

 

[ShadyDan]

1 hour ago, mnorell said:

I believe in general the procedure after a big bad freeze in citrus areas, provided the fruit are mature enough to have fixed sugars sufficiently, is to immediately harvest all possible fruit and juice it. So there may be a glut of juice and a paucity of fruit this year coming out of the Rio Grande Valley. To me personally it's a shame, because IMHO the grapefruit that comes out of the California low desert and Indian River territory in Florida is vastly inferior to the Texas RGV fruit. I don't know why exactly that would be, but when I lived in Natchez all the fruit would come from Texas and was delicious. In Florida it was from Indian River and was insipid. California is better but still can't match that Texas stuff. Luckily they do import the Texas grapefruit into California as well. Sad to hear this, because that industry is always tough and now in the midst of the pandemic, but this is not their first rodeo...and the trees should be able to recover for the most part if temps halted at mid-20s. I had a Rio Red in Natchez (in a protected area) return above the graft after teens, several times.

Yea, that makes sense. I imagine a alot of those trees will get some serious damage, with some mortality. But if things stay in the mid 20's as you stated most should pull through. Any mandarins should shake off those temps as well, but areas that saw below -5C might be in trouble. I feel bad for citrus growers all over the States, having a rough go with disease and weather.

 

I have to disagree with the Texas VS California Grapefruit taste though.  The Texas "Ruby Red" I can get is pretty good and usually my go-to, but sometimes I can find some stuff grown in California that is terrific... best grapefruit I have ever had. The only problem is it is organically grown (therefor almost double the price as the Texas stuff), so its a treat for me haha. We never get fresh Florida citrus out here, I've only tried it while vacationing there and it was also fantastic... but you can never beat fresh off the tree. My BC grown manadarins are just OK compared to California stuff... I need more heat up here!

[mnorell]

1 hour ago, ShadyDan said:

Yea, that makes sense. I imagine a alot of those trees will get some serious damage, with some mortality. But if things stay in the mid 20's as you stated most should pull through. Any mandarins should shake off those temps as well, but areas that saw below -5C might be in trouble. I feel bad for citrus growers all over the States, having a rough go with disease and weather.

 

I have to disagree with the Texas VS California Grapefruit taste though.  The Texas "Ruby Red" I can get is pretty good and usually my go-to, but sometimes I can find some stuff grown in California that is terrific... best grapefruit I have ever had. The only problem is it is organically grown (therefor almost double the price as the Texas stuff), so its a treat for me haha. We never get fresh Florida citrus out here, I've only tried it while vacationing there and it was also fantastic... but you can never beat fresh off the tree. My BC grown manadarins are just OK compared to California stuff... I need more heat up here!

I don't know why, perhaps I just have bad luck in selecting grapefruit, but for whatever reason I got great Texas (red) grapefruit at Walmart in Mississippi while I don't think I ever got a good one in the Florida Keys in ten years. I think the old rule is that the best fruit is always exported, so you are likely to get the better stuff out of the growing state especially if it's a "hero" crop like citrus. Locals get to enjoy "seconds" for the most part. Always has been a problem in California, though I have to say the organic berries that Whole Foods gets in the Coachella Valley are obviously straight from the fields just south of here and they are of excellent quality (and inexpensive in relative terms). The berries I find in the markets in the Florida Keys are also mostly from California or the Yuma area, occasionally in winter from Homestead (FL); and are the worse for wear after the trip across country. And I must say that I have had good California grapefruit, just not reliably as it was with the Texas fruit; and god knows about every yard from Palm Springs to Yuma has a grapefruit tree laden with fruit reveling in the heat, and I have had good stuff via that route...

In any event, I hope that the majority of the TX trees pull through after this. But it's always wise to remember the saying: "there's nothing between here and the North Pole but a barbed-wire fence."

[NBTX11]

23 minutes ago, mnorell said:

In any event, I hope that the majority of the TX trees pull through after this. But it's always wise to remember the saying: "there's nothing between here and the North Pole but a barbed-wire fence."

And that barbed wire fence is down.  

The only somewhat saving factor for South Texas is the low latitude.  Usually cold runs out of punch before getting to S. TX.  That didn't happen this time.    

[Brian F. Austin]

Sad day for palm growers in Texas.

we have been out of power in our neighborhood going on 48 hours. Expecting an ice storm tonight. Here’s my little sabal causarium and CIDP this morning.

[mnorell]

Thank goodness your S. causiarum is small, plus insulated with snow, it should come back. I have tested this species with an arborescent bud to 13F in a long wet freeze and only cosmetic damage to the leaves. You'll lose those leaves but I'll bet the bud survives. CIDP who knows. 

Terrible that so many of you are without power in the midst of days and days below freezing. I just saw that it stands at roughly 200,000 outages of the 650,000 or so connections in Travis county. Does everyone have firewood, or even fireplaces? Or generators? I can hardly believe that would be the case. Eventually cars will run out of fuel while everyone sits in them trying to get warm and charge their phones. And then no way to refuel, with ice blocking everyone's travel. This situation, and the millions more out of power for this long event, makes quite a statement about Texas's surprisingly un-robust power infrastructure, despite enjoying the fruits of a huge population boom that's been going on for years now. It's not like these statewide freezes don't come along every few decades, so there can be little excuse for being caught with their pants down like this. I know very little about Texas's internal policies on that front, but if people start dying from cold, it seems likely that there will be some sort of scandal at the end of all this, with foxes guarding the hen-house or something of the sort...

[jwitt]

I suggest staying away from the weather channel. They may have an agenda...... This was their prediction from 2 weeks ago!

 

[NBTX11]

1 hour ago, Brian F. Austin said:

Sad day for palm growers in Texas.

we have been out of power in our neighborhood going on 48 hours. Expecting an ice storm tonight. Here’s my little sabal causarium and CIDP this morning.

The CIDP will completely defoliate, but might come back.

[Collectorpalms]

1 hour ago, jwitt said:

I suggest staying away from the weather channel. They may have an agenda...... This was their prediction from 2 weeks ago!

 

I am curious why people put any faith into FREE weather services general public or government. If you are a company that depends on weather, you should seriously consider hiring a private meteorologist.

Edited February 17, 2021 by Collectorpalms

[Xerarch]

4 hours ago, mnorell said:

I don't know why, perhaps I just have bad luck in selecting grapefruit, but for whatever reason I got great Texas (red) grapefruit at Walmart in Mississippi while I don't think I ever got a good one in the Florida Keys in ten years. I think the old rule is that the best fruit is always exported, so you are likely to get the better stuff out of the growing state especially if it's a "hero" crop like citrus. Locals get to enjoy "seconds" for the most part. Always has been a problem in California, though I have to say the organic berries that Whole Foods gets in the Coachella Valley are obviously straight from the fields just south of here and they are of excellent quality (and inexpensive in relative terms). The berries I find in the markets in the Florida Keys are also mostly from California or the Yuma area, occasionally in winter from Homestead (FL); and are the worse for wear after the trip across country. And I must say that I have had good California grapefruit, just not reliably as it was with the Texas fruit; and god knows about every yard from Palm Springs to Yuma has a grapefruit tree laden with fruit reveling in the heat, and I have had good stuff via that route...

In any event, I hope that the majority of the TX trees pull through after this. But it's always wise to remember the saying: "there's nothing between here and the North Pole but a barbed-wire fence."

About the Texas grapefruit, they have developed their own varieties that taste far better than the yucky Ruby Red they grow in Florida.  The Texas varieties Rio Red/Rio Star/Star Ruby are superior both in red color and in flavor, to me anyway, and many agree with me.  Last I checked most of what they grow in Florida is still Ruby Red.  A brief history of Ruby Red (*according to my memory).  In the old days there was a white variety of grapefruit called Duncan, it had great flavor and a lot of seeds.  Then came a new variety of grapefruit called Marsh, it is yucky and doesn't have a lot of seeds, the market favored low seed count to flavor, Ruby Red is a pink variation of Marsh, it retained the yuckiness and low seed count, it's just that it's pink and the market loves the pink color.  So Texas developed their own varieties that taste good and have a deep red color and I overwhelmingly prefer them to Ruby Red.  As far as climate goes, Texas and Florida both have excellent grapefruit climates that support heavy, juicy, sweet, grapefruit.  Grapefruit does well in inland areas of California that have enough heat to produce sufficient sugars.  In general all citrus grown in California or Arizona will be prettier to look at on the outside, not as juicy and with a thicker peel than Florida or Texas.  Thus it is well known that oranges in California are primarily sold for eating (prettier, easier to peel, balanced acid/sweet flavor), while Florida oranges are for juicing (not as pretty, harder to peel, juicy and sweet).

[Ben G.]

2 hours ago, jwitt said:

I suggest staying away from the weather channel. They may have an agenda...... This was their prediction from 2 weeks ago!

 

They couldn't have been more wrong, huh? I usually don't put a ton of faith in any forecast more than a few days out, and even then sometimes they swing and miss. Yesterday afternoon I was looking at a nightime low of -5F from the weather channel. Our cat woke me up at 4:30 and my phone told me it was -14F at the weather station in the town nearest to me about 10 miles to my north.

I guess that got them in a panic because this morning they revised their forecast for tonight from -2F down to -12F. By this afternoon we rose all the way up to a balmy 21F, some clouds rolled in and they changed their prediction for tonight up to +12F now.

If I had known we would drop to -12F, I would have dug up at least one more of my palms. It is going to be rough when I unwrap the ones I left in the ground this Saturday. I am going to be pretty surprised if any of my needles even survive this...I really only expect my sabal minors to survive at this point because their growth points were under the snow.

[jwitt]

Best of luck Ben! Saw those OK temps, ouch!

[kinzyjr]

For a bit of bad Weather Channel comedy, look at the record for South Padre Island for Feb. 15th.  A high of 33 and a low of 34.

[Paradise Found]

What kind of effect will this historic cold have on nursery's and garden center. Their going to have big financial losses.  

[Brian F. Austin]

18 hours ago, Brian F. Austin said:

Sad day for palm growers in Texas.

we have been out of power in our neighborhood going on 48 hours. Expecting an ice storm tonight. Here’s my little sabal causarium and CIDP this morning.

CIDP looking pretty wrecked today. Loquat trees looking pretty sad. Small Brazoria

[NBTX11]

San Antonio in the mid and upper 40s today.  Everything melting off like crazy.  There could be freezing precip tomorrow for the last time, but the crazy cold is gone.  

Edited February 17, 2021 by NBTX11

[NBTX11]

[necturus]

My loquat in Houston has damage to the newest leaves, but the old leaves look fine. Pretty much all tropicals and palms in the ground look nuked. Most citrus have floppy leaves, and many tropical trees are bleeding sap. My garage got to 33 at the lowest, so I think my decision to dig plants may pay off. Only wish I’d dug more stuff.

Gonna have to invest in a good chainsaw. Any recommendations? Don’t want to break the bank but also want something that can last for years and cut big trees. Nothing electric powered.

[Xerarch]

13 minutes ago, necturus said:

My loquat in Houston has damage to the newest leaves, but the old leaves look fine. Pretty much all tropicals and palms in the ground look nuked. Most citrus have floppy leaves, and many tropical trees are bleeding sap. My garage got to 33 at the lowest, so I think my decision to dig plants may pay off. Only wish I’d dug more stuff.

Gonna have to invest in a good chainsaw. Any recommendations? Don’t want to break the bank but also want something that can last for years and cut big trees. Nothing electric powered.

Want a great chainsaw? Stihl is the best, if not Stihl then Husqvarna is the only other one I would recommend

[Palmaceae]

43 minutes ago, Xerarch said:

Want a great chainsaw? Stihl is the best, if not Stihl then Husqvarna is the only other one I would recommend

I second that, Stihl is the best.