Can cocos survive in Lindos,Rhodes in Greece?

[southathens]

Below an non exhaustive list of official met stations in Greece with the highest average annual Ts

 

 

[Aceraceae]

Annual temp above 20 is a must (70 F). And not by way of very hot summers of 30 C against winters of 10 C. 

20 C annual temp with mild summers of 25 C, and winters of at least 15 C (at least upper 50s in coldest month), in the eastern Mediterranean or Azores etc. 
Most places with Cocos are over 25 C annual average temp. At this temp even places with strong seasons or a hot dry season can grow Cocos at least with basic watering. 25 C with 10 degree seasonality would be a summer of 35 (almost too hot if temps often exceed 100 F or 40 C), and winters still meeting the 15 C coldest month threshold. 

Seeing so many areas in the northern mediterranean with temps above 20 is promising, but some are due to hot desert-like summers with colder winters than the outer islands. 

The Haifa peninsula in the east med is over 14 C in the coldest month, and neary 29 C in August, giving an annual temp of 22. 

[southathens]

On 4/29/2024 at 3:27 AM, Aceraceae said:

The Haifa peninsula in the east med is over 14 C in the coldest month, and neary 29 C in August, giving an annual temp of 22. 

Are u sure Haifa is so high?

I thought it was around 20.5C to 21C annual T. I have never seen a station in Haifa at 22.0C avg. annual T.

[southathens]

After a record breaking hot April by Greece's standards Lindos now standing at 22.0°C avg. annual temperature. 

The first area in geographical Europe to do so. 

[SeanK]

On 5/4/2021 at 4:24 AM, southathens said:

Hello everyone! Its been a long time since my last posts here and given that we now have more than 7 years of meteorological data from the area of Lindos in SE Rhodes in Greece, we can see some very interesting things according to the National Observatory of Athens fan aspirated meteorological station in Lindos.

It appears that it is by far the warmest area annually in geographical Europe beating even the warmest areas of the Canaries islands (which are not located in Europe anyways). Below Lindos data the past 7 years that the station is operating.

By achieving an amazing 21.89C mean annual temperature it beats even Tenerife South AP station in the Canaries for the same period which is the warmest met station in the Canaries.

Below some more info for meteo enthusiasts 

https://www.ukweatherworld.co.uk/forum/index.php?/topic/117931-greek-islands-cyprus-v-canaries-madeira-2018/&do=findComment&comment=1137494

Sure the data are for a limited period of only 7 years and the winter temps in Lindos seem cool at a first glance to support cocos. However, we have examples of cocos surviving in Newport Beach, California which is even cooler compared to Lindos. Apart from the cool winter temps do you think the extremely hot summer temps can harm any attempts to grow cocos in Lindos? The excruciating high summer temps of Lindos are due to constant foehn winds throughout the summer.

So, I am skeptical..But what do you think it would take for cocos to grow in Lindos?

Three years have passed since this thread was started. Did you plant the Cocos? Are there current photos?

[southathens]

On 6/2/2024 at 2:36 PM, SeanK said:

Three years have passed since this thread was started. Did you plant the Cocos? Are there current photos?

I dont live in Lindos. 

If you check the previous posts you will see that some of the Greek members tried to motivate locals to grow cocos over there but without success.

However, just outside Lindos in Lardos we have a member here who has successfully grown an outdoor surviving coco and there are pictures in the previous posts. 

[Victor G.]

I planted one, but I don't give it a high chance of surviving 

[Phoenikakias]

On 6/5/2024 at 10:59 PM, Victor G. said:

I planted one, but I don't give it a high chance of surviving 

Waste of time and resources. I keep wondering, if in summer we get constant 40 and sometimes hypothetically 50 C, which will surely  give mathematically the annual average a significant rise, would that promote in any sense the cultivation of a coconut in our latitude? I think you know the answer. A big NO, instead it would limit even further the potential of cool tolerant, most probably of oceanic origin, palm spp for our region (eg Rhopalostylis, Chambeyronia, Kentia, Archontophoenix etc).

[mnorell]

My own experience and feelings would be that it is not the heat but the cold that would be the most likely culprit to "do in" any Cocos where you are in Greece. Remember that the coconut in La Quinta, California--located in one of the hottest deserts in the world--is doing fine for decades now and stands in the open sun. Even the brief winter here, however, mars somewhat the visual quality of the crown (prematurely browns lower leaves) and the dryness makes manual removal of leaf-bases a likely necessity to keep a neat look. From my own experiments here I see that some cultivars will collapse in cold-waves during winter, while others hold steady. And partial shade while young, and positioning in a south-facing sun-trap, has been obviously important in getting them established in my personal tests here near Palm Springs. I think those of you there who love Cocos should not be daunted in experimenting with different varieties and growing positions (it's the only way we learn, after all)...but perhaps you would want to back them up with some Beccariophoenix or other coconut-ish palms for safety's sake.

[southathens]

btw Lindos recorded its all time high of 43.6C a few days ago... On the 13th of June

 

 

[southathens]

On 6/5/2024 at 10:59 PM, Victor G. said:

I planted one, but I don't give it a high chance of surviving 

where did you plant it?

[southathens]

 

[Aceraceae]

Is that for just summer 2024, or is that the average for the whole 2014 to present climate chart? 

[southathens]

On 9/2/2024 at 3:50 PM, Aceraceae said:

Is that for just summer 2024, or is that the average for the whole 2014 to present climate chart? 

Not its only for 2024.

[southathens]

 

[southathens]

https://twitter.com/FiladelfeiaHeat/status/1859150902361309319

[southathens]

https://twitter.com/FiladelfeiaHeat/status/1866749057487737042

https://twitter.com/FiladelfeiaHeat/status/1867634599700181165

 

[Janni]

This year should be very challenging for any really tropical plant (like Cocos or Adonidia) on Rhodos. Not because of unusual cold temperatures, but due to the huge amount of rain! 
At the northern tip of the island, where the island capital is located, they have until now over 550liters rain per square meter only for december! The rest of Rhodos has experienced a wet december as well. 
Would be interessting to hear what effects this rain has on the more tender palms, combined with normal mediterranean winter temps. 

[Phoenikakias]

On 12/26/2024 at 1:06 PM, Janni said:

This year should be very challenging for any really tropical plant (like Cocos or Adonidia) on Rhodos. Not because of unusual cold temperatures, but due to the huge amount of rain! 
At the northern tip of the island, where the island capital is located, they have until now over 550liters rain per square meter only for december! The rest of Rhodos has experienced a wet december as well. 
Would be interessting to hear what effects this rain has on the more tender palms, combined with normal mediterranean winter temps. 

In the much colder Attica, soil had become so thirsty, that all plants, even the most tropical ones like Ravenala, Roystonea and Mangifera, are still in active growth, albeit at a slower pace. I suppose that in Rhodos accordingly situation must be even better. Bear in mind, that coldest soil temps every year follow by about 10 weeks delay shortest day time. So the timing should not be that bad for this gift from the sky.

[mlovecan]

On 12/26/2024 at 1:06 PM, Janni said:

This year should be very challenging for any really tropical plant (like Cocos or Adonidia) on Rhodos. Not because of unusual cold temperatures, but due to the huge amount of rain! 
At the northern tip of the island, where the island capital is located, they have until now over 550liters rain per square meter only for december! The rest of Rhodos has experienced a wet december as well. 
Would be interessting to hear what effects this rain has on the more tender palms, combined with normal mediterranean winter temps. 

December's rain and also last weekend's (we had over 30 cm in most parts of the island) had no effect on the more tropical plants as this winter has been quite mild so far with 18-20 degrees most days. Our cold extremes are in February. I drove past a grove of papaya in the south Rhodes suburbs last night and they are doing exceptionally well. My palms are all sending up new spears right now.

[Than]

On 1/8/2025 at 6:08 PM, Phoenikakias said:

In the much colder Attica, soil had become so thirsty, that all plants, even the most tropical ones like Ravenala, Roystonea and Mangifera, are still in active growth, albeit at a slower pace. I suppose that in Rhodos accordingly situation must be even better. Bear in mind, that coldest soil temps every year follow by about 10 weeks delay shortest day time. So the timing should not be that bad for this gift from the sky.

That explains why so many people are reporting late blooms this year! I have also noticed that some of my plants keep growing although they are tropical, including Dypsis.

[Phoenikakias]

3 hours ago, Than said:

That explains why so many people are reporting late blooms this year! I have also noticed that some of my plants keep growing although they are tropical, including Dypsis.

I am inclined to add, that whatever damage is manifested in April and towards summer is not a winter foliage damage but it is what it is, namely root damage because of the coldest soil temps. Another argument for sandier soil, which warms up faster!

[southathens]

On 12/26/2024 at 1:06 PM, Janni said:

This year should be very challenging for any really tropical plant (like Cocos or Adonidia) on Rhodos. Not because of unusual cold temperatures, but due to the huge amount of rain! 
At the northern tip of the island, where the island capital is located, they have until now over 550liters rain per square meter only for december! The rest of Rhodos has experienced a wet december as well. 
Would be interessting to hear what effects this rain has on the more tender palms, combined with normal mediterranean winter temps. 

Depends which part of Rhodes we are talking about....

Basically the city of Rhodes was mostly hit by the floods. Well the northernmost tip of the island to be fair. 

Lindos in the SE of Rhodes received 189 mm of rain in December. A bit higher than average. 

[southathens]

Btw 

Coastal Kastellorizo NOA station now at 11b hardiness zone

A first for Greece!

[southathens]

On 1/8/2025 at 6:08 PM, Phoenikakias said:

In the much colder Attica, soil had become so thirsty, that all plants, even the most tropical ones like Ravenala, Roystonea and Mangifera, are still in active growth, albeit at a slower pace. 

Indeed!

The extreme south of the Athens Riviera hardly managed 205 mm of annual precipitation in Anavyssos NOA station for 2024. Lagonisi closely followed at 209 mm.

Btw Anavyssos and Lagonisi are now the only areas in continental Greece with average annual rain less than 300 mm for their entire time series. There are only 4 areas in mainland geographical Europe than have climate normals less than 300 mm of annual precipitation: 

- European Kazakhstan 

-SE Spain

-Sulina, Romania

- South Athens Riviera 

[southathens]

On 3/9/2024 at 7:14 PM, mlovecan said:

As requested, here's a photo of 5 cocos sitting outside of Praktiker in Rhodes Town Greece since just after Christmas including during the cold snap we had January. I asked a member of staff if they bring them in for the night and he replied "why would we?".  

Hey again!

How are your cocos doing?

Are they still surviving outdoors? 

Do you have any recent photos for us?

[southathens]

Below the updated 30 year POR climate normals for Rhodes AP 

Mind you that the AP is around 15 km from the Port of Rhodes which is considerably milder during the winter compared to Paradeisi. Its a clear Csa climate, with very mild winters and mild summers (by Greece's standards). Zone 11a. Temperatures have never dropped below 1.2C or reached over 40.2C from 1977 when the new AP and HNMS station are operational. A truly maritime climate by Greece's standards. 

[Aceraceae]

Very nice. Just a little bit cold and rainy in the winter, with 13 C months. 

[southathens]

39 minutes ago, Aceraceae said:

Very nice. Just a little bit cold and rainy in the winter, with 13 C months. 

The port of Rhodes , well within the city's UHI should be around 14.0C to 14.5C winter means. 

We only have data for 6 years though.

Also note that the Port of Rhodes has NEVER seen snow as far as we are aware. Not even back in the great East Med cold snap of 1950 when Beirut and Tel Aviv were buried in snow. We can safely go back until the late 19th century through the local and international  press. No snow ever for the city or the Port of Rhodes. 

[Aceraceae]

Those are some more promising looking numbers, albeit for a very short, not even 15 year climate normals period. No extreme heat in the summer, just extreme dry with 0 rain. The half meter of winter rain may be a lot for below 15 C mean temp. It's only a meter of summer rain and halving the winter rain and it would be Orlando, Florida Cfa subtropical lol. 

No temp above 100 F / 40 C is great, but at this higher latitude, as with desert coconuts in the southwestern USA, it seems like the long days of intense sun with 400 hours of sunshine per month in the summer with low humidity could be excessive for the foliage despite irrigation. 

It would be a great sign to see success in slightly less dramatic locations such as Alexandria, Haifa (would stil be a latitude record over Bermuda at near 33 N vs 32 N), and Ensenada and Puerto Penasco in Mexico just one degree south of the border. 

[southathens]

1 hour ago, Aceraceae said:

Those are some more promising looking numbers, albeit for a very short, not even 15 year climate normals period. No extreme heat in the summer, just extreme dry with 0 rain. The half meter of winter rain may be a lot for below 15 C mean temp. It's only a meter of summer rain and halving the winter rain and it would be Orlando, Florida Cfa subtropical lol. 

No temp above 100 F / 40 C is great, but at this higher latitude, as with desert coconuts in the southwestern USA, it seems like the long days of intense sun with 400 hours of sunshine per month in the summer with low humidity could be excessive for the foliage despite irrigation. 

It would be a great sign to see success in slightly less dramatic locations such as Alexandria, Haifa (would stil be a latitude record over Bermuda at near 33 N vs 32 N), and Ensenada and Puerto Penasco in Mexico just one degree south of the border. 

You do remember that we already have outdoors surviving cocos on the island of Rhodes in Lindos right? They should be around 3-4 years old now according to mlovecan 

[southathens]

And below a head on comparison between the Rhodes AP and the Port of Rhodes for the same period.

Which goes to show that the Port of Rhodes is significantly milder during the winter compared to the Airport. I remind everyone that the 2 stations are about 15 km apart.