King Palm in San Diego

[Cweaver22]

I had 4 triple trunk king palms planted. One of them died, it was replaced and then died again. I’ve been told I over watered and I’ve been told I didn’t water it enough. I had a soil sample done and the sodium level was like 250, not sure if that’s crazy high or not but the normal range is supposed to be like 0-30. The original tree was basically planted in a hole the exact size of the 24” box. The second one has maybe a couple inches of amended soil. This time I’ve dug the hole 3’ x 3’ and I’m amending the soil 50/50 cactus soil and native soil. I’m also adding gypsum in the soil and around the hole. My question is given all that how much water given the time of year initially and long term in the winter and summer months? 

Edited October 23, 2021 by Cweaver22

[James B]

In summer I don’t think it’s possible to overwater a king palm. In winter in a colder 9B climate where it doesn’t get much sun would be one of few scenarios where you could overwater Archontophoenix. Now are they in a spot where they get sprayed by irrigation on the leaves and trunk? Because that can take out a King Palm. But if you have it only getting drip irrigation then that can’t be it.

[Cweaver22]

17 minutes ago, James B said:

In summer I don’t think it’s possible to overwater a king palm. In winter in a colder 9B climate where it doesn’t get much sun would be one of few scenarios where you could overwater Archontophoenix. Now are they in a spot where they get sprayed by irrigation on the leaves and trunk? Because that can take out a King Palm. But if you have it only getting drip irrigation then that can’t be it.

Good to know, thank you! It does get full sun and often can be a bit windy as we are up on a hill a bit. They are on drip emitters but my wife likes to water the leaves from time to time.

[Billeb]

55 minutes ago, Cweaver22 said:

Good to know, thank you! It does get full sun and often can be a bit windy as we are up on a hill a bit. They are on drip emitters but my wife likes to water the leaves from time to time.

I wouldn’t be watering the leaves just to limit the possibility of crown rot. 
 

I agree with @James B, it virtually impossible to over water a King UNLESS you have poor drainage. You say you used 50% cactus and 50% native soil. I have a quad Alexandrae and initially it was played lower than it should have been, I also used about 50% native soil and after a couple months…things weren’t going well. I dug it up, dug a deeper hole, planted it higher and used less native soil when I replanted it. I currently water the heck out of it and it’s thriving. 
i think the soil makeup and depth of hole was the contributing factor. Not well drained and not deep enough so the roots were literally sitting in water. 
 

-dale

[Tracy]

2 hours ago, Cweaver22 said:

The second one has maybe a couple inches of amended soil. This time I’ve dug the hole 3’ x 3’ and I’m amending the soil 50/50 cactus soil and native soil. I’m also adding gypsum in the soil and around the hole. My question is given all that how much water given the time of year initially and long term in the winter and summer months? 

Welcome to the forum Cweaver22.  A little more information may be helpful in providing useful advice on a watering schedule as well as a few other tips based on the specific climate you have.

How much water depends on where you are in San Diego and what type of soil the native soil is.  San Diego County and even city limits have lots of micro-climates, from coastal with higher humidity and milder daytime high temps to inland areas where it can be much drier and get much hotter, so water demand is a sliding scale.  You mention adding gypsum to the soil so I assume that you have a high clay soil naturally?  I probably wouldn't add a salt like Calcium Sulfate (Gypsum) to my already heavily amended soil with the cactus mix, but only to the clay soil adjacent to the amended soil where it actually provides a useful function.  

Generally speaking, frequently watering the top or crown of a young palm can be problematic.  Another consideration is where the palm was grown prior to its being planted, particularly if it was in shade or in a green house prior to being introduced into a full sun position or hotter drier position in your garden, which would introduce some stress when planting.  Lots of questions because in many parts of the county King palms (Archontophoenix cunninghamiana) are generally pretty adaptable unless you underwater them.  Do you see many King palms in your neighborhood, or are they only seen infrequently?  If you can share what part of town you are in there are a lot of us from the County and someone is likely to know a great deal about growing palms in your specific area.  Also if you can confirm soil type as I have made an assumption based on how you are treating the soil without actually hearing what type of soil you have.

[Cweaver22]

Hi thank you! I live in Rancho penasquitos near the 15 and 56. The soil is clay or like a sandy clay. When I dug up the old tree there was a little bit of water in the bottom of the hole. The tree was purchased from moon valley in Escondido and it was in the middle of many other king palms and their canopies were overlapping. Also we have maxima king palms. There are tons of king palms in surrounding neighborhoods and I have three others that were planted at the same time that are all fine.

Edited October 23, 2021 by Cweaver22

[JubaeaMan138]

So I would honestly of guessed it was a green house or heavy shade grown Planted out specimen not acclimated . And it burned so bad it is having a hard time keeping up. kings need to be flooded with water everyday only way I can keep Mine happy . When was this planted?

[Cweaver22]

5 minutes ago, JubaeaMan138 said:

So I would honestly of guessed it was a green house or heavy shade grown Planted out specimen not acclimated . And it burned so bad it is having a hard time keeping up. kings need to be flooded with water everyday only way I can keep Mine happy . When was this planted?

It was planted June 11, 2021

[JubaeaMan138]

Seems like it was planted awfully high to . 

[Tracy]

 

On 10/23/2021 at 5:37 AM, Cweaver22 said:

ive in Rancho penasquitos near the 15 and 56. The soil is clay or like a sandy clay. When I dug up the old tree there was a little bit of water in the bottom of the hole. The tree was purchased from moon valley in Escondido and it was in the middle of many other king palms and their canopies were overlapping. Also we have maxima king palms. There are tons of king palms in surrounding neighborhoods and I have three others that were planted at the same time that are all fine.

Based on your information and that you have others planted at the same time it is a little more puzzling.  If there was water in the bottom of the hole, you don't have very good draining soil, which also fits the description of clay soil.  Given that these are water hogs though, I wouldn't expect that to be the cause of it's demise if the others you planted are doing well and receiving similar treatment.   While the largest trunk was planted a little high with the exposed roots, the two smaller in the trio look to be planted fine.  You can try again or since you have other king palms, look at it as an opportunity to try something a little more exotic.  You can grow a lot of other interesting palms in Rancho Penasquitos so consider it an opportunity rather than as a loss.  One parting piece of advice is to discourage your wife from trying to do foliar irrigation.  While it's ok to use the hose to blast off bugs, it isn't ideal to water the foliage in the middle of the day in summer here.  You could post a new thread on palm recommendations for your spot in Rancho Penasquitos, as there are a lot of folks in a similar climate zone both here in San Diego and in other parts of Southern California that would love to tell you what you should plant in the spot instead of more kings.

[Jim in Los Altos]

In a mild zone, drainage is not an issue at all with King palms. They are semi-aquatic palms. In fact, fast draining soil is detrimental. Out of the over fifty mature ones in my landscape, a few are growing IN water 365 days per year and they LOVE it. Even stagnant water won’t harm them. If you want fast lush growth, big fat trunks, and large spaces between growth ring on their trunks, keep the soil wet all the time all year. Getting a lot of tap water in the crown of most palms is usually not a good idea however. I’ve seen a number of palms with crown rot due to that. Rain water is never a problem in their crowns though. 
 

We got over 5” of rain yesterday and I’ll be watering my Kings in eight or nine days if it stays dry and mild in that time period. Otherwise, they are watered several times per week when it’s warm, sometimes daily. 

Edited October 25, 2021 by Jim in Los Altos

[3 Milesfrom Gulf of Mexico]

Nice looking Kings 

[Briank]

Welcome. 
 

ive probably grown 10-12 Kings on my property about 15 miles south of you in Clairemont. 
 

From my experience w Kings, which are my Favs, you might be better off Starting Smaller in Size so it can adapt and not be in any kind of Shock it is experiencing.  Kings grow so fast that 2nd - 3rd yr after they have Acclimated and set Roots vs buying a Large Box multi Trunker.   The larger it is the longer it takes to acclimate. 
 

I bought a 5ga Maxima king and a 15ga Royal palm 4 yrs ago.  Planted 4’ apart.  In 4 yrs the Maxima has Past up the Royal by few inches and it was 5-5-1/2 Feet shorter in the beginning. 
 

In my opinion you save Money and the Palm always look better when dealing w kings when you start a little smaller.  No bigger than 15ga.  
You don’t want to buy the King palms that are grown in Groves as the have skinny trunks and look Penciled.   I can always tell the Home Depot Specials in my neighbors yards.  They burned and Skinny. 

[Jim in Los Altos]

30 minutes ago, Briank said:

Welcome. 
 

ive probably grown 10-12 Kings on my property about 15 miles south of you in Clairemont. 
 

From my experience w Kings, which are my Favs, you might be better off Starting Smaller in Size so it can adapt and not be in any kind of Shock it is experiencing.  Kings grow so fast that 2nd - 3rd yr after they have Acclimated and set Roots vs buying a Large Box multi Trunker.   The larger it is the longer it takes to acclimate. 
 

I bought a 5ga Maxima king and a 15ga Royal palm 4 yrs ago.  Planted 4’ apart.  In 4 yrs the Maxima has Past up the Royal by few inches and it was 5-5-1/2 Feet shorter in the beginning. 
 

In my opinion you save Money and the Palm always look better when dealing w kings when you start a little smaller.  No bigger than 15ga.  
You don’t want to buy the King palms that are grown in Groves as the have skinny trunks and look Penciled.   I can always tell the Home Depot Specials in my neighbors yards.  They burned and Skinny. 

All mine are grown in groves and their trunks are pretty massive. 
 

[Briank]

59 minutes ago, Jim in Los Altos said:

All mine are grown in groves and their trunks are pretty massive. 
 

Yeah they can get huge !  When I meant groves I mean as how nursery have boxes or pots all stuck together in groves.   In ground yes in pots not so well when trying to buy king palms.  
 

I bought some 24” box Kentish palms in the Begining just beautiful.   But where stretched out and never acclimated to my soil every frond died when I transplanted them into ground from box grown 

 

silver trunk your fatty must be an Alexander Beatrice! 

[Jim in Los Altos]

17 hours ago, Briank said:

Yeah they can get huge !  When I meant groves I mean as how nursery have boxes or pots all stuck together in groves.   In ground yes in pots not so well when trying to buy king palms.  
 

I bought some 24” box Kentish palms in the Begining just beautiful.   But where stretched out and never acclimated to my soil every frond died when I transplanted them into ground from box grown 

 

silver trunk your fatty must be an Alexander Beatrice! 

Hmm, I’ve had dozens of multi planted Kentia palms installed from 24” boxes as well as 15 gallon size in client’s yards over the years, some full shade, some full sun, and they’ve all flourished. Lots of water is key. I have several in my own yard too and they get watered heavily like my king palms and trunks stay green and leaf scars are far apart.