Sabal riverside, mexicana and causiarum

[palmsrgreat]

3x9" bands

$25ea plus shipping

[Sabal King]

Great seller and fantastic palms.  I have already acquired many of these from him, and truly appreciate the quality!

[palmsrgreat]

1 hour ago, tlow said:

Great seller and fantastic palms.  I have already acquired many of these from him, and truly appreciate the quality!

Thank you Tom. I appreciate the kind words.

[Darold Petty]

Really well grown !  

[OC2Texaspalmlvr]

9 hours ago, palmsrgreat said:

3x9" bands

$25ea plus shipping

Put me down for 2 Riverside. Where did you get the seed from ? 

T J 

[palmsrgreat]

53 minutes ago, OC2Texaspalmlvr said:

Put me down for 2 Riverside. Where did you get the seed from ? 

T J 

Will do.

Seeds are from my 13yr old tree here in North Texas. 

[Jtee]

These are the one on eBay huh. I see them listed for $30. Are you dropping the price to $25?

[palmsrgreat]

4 minutes ago, Jtee said:

These are the one on eBay huh. I see them listed for $30. Are you dropping the price to $25?

They are. I've got to cover additional fees on ebay and offer a better price here for the good people of PT. Ebay pricing will not change.

[Jtee]

13 hours ago, palmsrgreat said:

They are. I've got to cover additional fees on ebay and offer a better price here for the good people of PT. Ebay pricing will not change.

Ok cool. Do you happen to have a pic of your Sabal Riverside. I’m really interested to see how big it is after 13 years and seeing record cold in North Texas. 

[BeyondTheGarden]

@palmsrgreat do you have pic of the mother palms?

[palmsrgreat]

A pic of the riverside from today and prior to the 2021 artic blast.

In response to last years snowpocalypse I cut off all fronds and wrapped it up tight with insulation so it's still working its way out of that setback. In hindsight, I dont think it was needed at all. I have a couple smaller ones in ground that I didnt even bother covering through this year's cold events and they look like nothing happened.

Sabal riverside is the ultimate North Texas palm in my opinion. 

[BeyondTheGarden]

I've heard that Riverside should do well up here also, though i have yet to see any.  Sabals aren't common here.  

I love the long petioles and oversized fronds. 

[palmsrgreat]

Jesse, 

I think it would do well for you up there.  I know the summers can get dry up there so as long as it gets good water at that time it will thrive. Mine dont seem to care about wet, cold or soggy conditions at all. These are very hardy sabals that take awhile to get going but when they do it'sone of the faster in my garden. I definitely overcompensated on the measures I took before the 2021 storm, but I think this year is poised for a lot of growth.

Mine was planted out as a 7 gal almost 9yrs ago. They love to widen their footprint before going vertical. It's awesome to see how fat its getting. The base of the heel to the otherside of the palm is over 21" wide. 

 

[BeyondTheGarden]

Palmpedia says,"It does well in hot and dry or cool and damp conditions. "   

If that's true, it should be happy here. It also says that it's among the fastest growing of palmetto's.

[OC2Texaspalmlvr]

2 hours ago, palmsrgreat said:

Sabal riverside is the ultimate North Texas palm in my opinion. 

I think its a great palm for any climate =) also put S.Causiarum in that category 

T J 

[Sabal King]

16 hours ago, Jesse PNW said:

Palmpedia says,"It does well in hot and dry or cool and damp conditions. "   

If that's true, it should be happy here. It also says that it's among the fastest growing of palmetto's.

Honestly, given how wrong many of these zone recommendations are... wouldn't trust any of this as well.  Sabals love water, wet soil, clay, sand, more water, sun, even more water...   I've got six of these S. Riversides from the seller around our property, with the largest being a 15G we were lucky enough to pick up.

[GoatLockerGuns]

15 hours ago, OC2Texaspalmlvr said:

also put S.Causiarum in that category 

That has not been my experience.  Sabal causiarum is a great, large, fast growing member of the Sabal genus.; however, I have found it to be less cold hardy than Sabal mexicana, Sabal palmetto, and Sabal minor.  I experienced spear pull and meristem rot on two juvenile Sabal causiarum two winters in a row.  Both succumbed to wet, cold freeze events, while the other aforementioned Sabal sp. of similar age (or younger) sailed through with no problems (and little to no damage).

[RJ]

9 hours ago, GoatLockerGuns said:

That has not been my experience.  Sabal causiarum is a great, large, fast growing member of the Sabal genus.; however, I have found it to be less cold hardy than Sabal mexicana, Sabal palmetto, and Sabal minor.  I experienced spear pull and meristem rot on two juvenile Sabal causiarum two winters in a row.  Both succumbed to wet, cold freeze events, while the other aforementioned Sabal sp. of similar age (or younger) sailed through with no problems (and little to no damage).

It is less cold hardy then palmetto and minor. There are several in Augusta, GA that have seen low teens and were damaged but quickly out grew that damage. I’ve had one planted at my folks place, down the road zero issues last winter. 
 

are you sure they’re s.causiarum ? 

[GoatLockerGuns]

11 hours ago, RJ said:

are you sure they’re s.causiarum ?

Positive. 

First death: February 2021...overnight lows of 6F and 9F on two nights...four days below freezing...snow and freezing rain...Sabal causiarum died, but Sabal mexicana, Sabal palmetto, and Sabal minor sailed through...lost a lot of other stuff too; Sabal causiarum was just one of them.

Second death: February 2022...overnight low of 21F...freezing rain...layer of ice covered palms for two days straight...Sabal causiarum died, but Sabal mexicana, Sabal palmetto, and Sabal minor. sailed through.  Suffered spear pull on a few other palm genera as well, but most recovered and are now pushing new growth.

Like I said, it is a great, nice looking palm...and cold hardy (relatively speaking)...but it does not come close to the hardiness of Sabal mexicana, Sabal palmetto, and Sabal minor IMHO.  My opinion is biased by my own anecdotal observations obviously; I fully acknowledge others may have observed differently, and would love to hear about it.

As for the palm known as Sabal sp. 'Riverside' that was mentioned in the original post of this form; I am not familiar with it from a cold hardy perspective.  Given that Riverside, California has no know native Sabal genus, I would suspect it is actually a synonym for some other species in the Sabal genus; therefore, its cold hardiness would be commiserate with whatever species it actually is.

[Chester B]

On 4/21/2022 at 9:51 AM, GoatLockerGuns said:

That has not been my experience.  Sabal causiarum is a great, large, fast growing member of the Sabal genus.; however, I have found it to be less cold hardy than Sabal mexicana, Sabal palmetto, and Sabal minor.  I experienced spear pull and meristem rot on two juvenile Sabal causiarum two winters in a row.  Both succumbed to wet, cold freeze events, while the other aforementioned Sabal sp. of similar age (or younger) sailed through with no problems (and little to no damage).

I agree and most others on here will, causiarum is less hardy then the other three.  Appears to be a long term zone 9a palm, whereas the others can take much colder.

[Jtee]

Would y’all say the Sabal Causiarum is as cold hardy as a robusta? 
 

I haven’t picked up a causiarum because I don’t want a seedling to suffer and have to regrow out of it but if Augusta, GA can grow them then they would probably last as long here. I just don’t trust them long term. Especially with them being native to Puerto Rico I’d expect them to at least be a zone 9 minimum palm. 
 

I wonder what Riverside is comparable to. Maybe Uresana? 

[Steve in Florida]

1 hour ago, Jtee said:

Would y’all say the Sabal Causiarum is as cold hardy as a robusta? 
 

I haven’t picked up a causiarum because I don’t want a seedling to suffer and have to regrow out of it but if Augusta, GA can grow them then they would probably last as long here. I just don’t trust them long term. Especially with them being native to Puerto Rico I’d expect them to at least be a zone 9 minimum palm. 
 

I wonder what Riverside is comparable to. Maybe Uresana? 

My trunking Sabal causiarum took 17F with heavy frost this winter and had zero cold damage.

[Jtee]

24 minutes ago, Steve in Florida said:

My trunking Sabal causiarum took 17F with heavy frost this winter and had zero cold damage.

Damn that’s impressive, I’ve heard some people talk about them being cold hardy but then read different things online about how they are an iffy zone 8 palm. I guess I should try one. 

[RJ]

Imo it’s a solid 8b palm . 

[Sabal King]

On 4/22/2022 at 5:08 PM, Steve in Florida said:

My trunking Sabal causiarum took 17F with heavy frost this winter and had zero cold damage.

Is this the parent of your S. Causarium seedlings that took 12F ?  That inspired me to try one from ya and it is doing quite well.  Had a rough first winter as its small but really coming back with a vengeance this spring.  We had 17F, 18 a few times, 22 and ice for 36 hours, and still came out the other end actually, for its size, looking fine.

[Fallen Munk]

On 4/22/2022 at 12:59 PM, Chester B said:

I agree and most others on here will, causiarum is less hardy then the other three.  Appears to be a long term zone 9a palm, whereas the others can take much colder.

I've got a few in strap leaf doing ok, but slower than molasses in the PNW.  All of my sabal are super slow for that matter, but it seems causiarum is the slowest.  I'm hoping that will change once it gets out of strap leaf.

[Chester B]

6 hours ago, Fallen Munk said:

I've got a few in strap leaf doing ok, but slower than molasses in the PNW.  All of my sabal are super slow for that matter, but it seems causiarum is the slowest.  I'm hoping that will change once it gets out of strap leaf.

I have 3 in ground with palmate leaves, but they are far from the slowest of my Sabals.  

[palmsrgreat]

causiarum are one of the faster sabals I grow.

[Jubaea_James760]

I have a Causiarum seedling in the ground 2+ years now & it took 19f this winter no problem.  No protection.  My bigger Riverside, no protection as well had some burns on the leaves, maybe 10%. 

Several lows in the 24-26f range, even more 27-32f, heavy frost, some snow etc.. 

[Fallen Munk]

17 hours ago, Chester B said:

I have 3 in ground with palmate leaves, but they are far from the slowest of my Sabals.  

Hopefully mine will get faster once they get fronds.  I've got a sabal minor planted in full sun that has been pushing the same spear for two years, so that one might take the prize for my slowest.

[NWpalms@206]

Are there any causarium left to purchase?

[palmsrgreat]

Yes there are

[Borassus2892]

Do you have pic of the mother plant of the sabal causarium?

Edited May 3, 2022 by Borassus2892

[palmsrgreat]

22 minutes ago, Borassus2892 said:

Do you have pic of the mother plant of the sabal causarium?

Unfortunately I do not have a photo of the mother for causiarum. 

[Dartolution]

Causiarum is a mixed bag. 

I received 10 seeds from Meg a year ago and germinated 6 of the 10. Of the 6 only 1 defoliated after a month of pretty consistent lows in the mid to low 20's in January, and an ultimate low this past winter of 19F. The other 5 did not seem to be affected at all. 

Also, these were in 4" pots sitting on the patio and fully exposed overhead. Seedlings. 

 

Seems to be the consensus they are a variable lot. 

 

Edit: The 1 that defoliated did NOT have spear pull, and immediately began regrowing as soon as temps got up into the 60s.