Chlorosis Issues

[Looking Glass]

I’ve been having chlorosis issues with two palms.  B. Alfredii & D.Carlsmithii both were a little pale, but I noticed last week, they were starting to look critically pale.   Since I’m probably a heavy fertilizer and both were planted in amended holes in full sun, I don’t think it’s a nitrogen issue, so I settled on iron.  

Other palms are nice and green.   

Both are growing, (Carlsmithii put out a monster leaf recently) but new leaves are getting more and more pale.   

I tried a shot of liquid fertilizer with N, K and chelated iron…. No change.   I tried a shot of EDDHA chelated iron drench…. No major change in a week..  So I tried a foliar application of iron sulfate…. That seemed to create a little improvement to interval chlorosis, making me think iron actually is the culprit.   

Today I hit them both with iron chelated in sodium glucoheptanate and hit the soil around them with humic acid 12%/fulvic acid 2% - 9oz in a couple of gallons of water each.  

I fertilize with 8-2-12 with micros regularly and hit everything with extra langbeinite regularly, so this isn’t a simple nutritional issue.   It could be an over-fertilization, compacted soil, overwatering issue though.   

Hopefully I can bridge them with foliar treatments.  I’ve done that with a couple palms before.  I don’t like chelated iron on the leaves, cause it’s caused some blight and spotting on some of my palms in the past.   
Though it got them through til I could fix the potting soil.  

Anyone got any bright ideas?  
 

D Carlsmithii with a new 9 ft pale leaf….

B Alfredii with pale new growth…

Potted Alfredii x 2 also showing similar pallor….

Edited July 2, 2022 by Looking Glass

[Looking Glass]

In the shade you can really see the color difference…..

[Merlyn]

My notes on iron deficiencies are:

• Many times caused by overly mucky soil and root rot. Starts with new spear leaves with yellow-green or even white, possibly with spots of green.

The older fronds on the Alfredii seem like they are pretty nice, which would indicate an iron deficiency.  It might be pH-related, root rot, overwatering, or maybe something else?  I've had that kind of issue in potted seedlings in my nursery area, which *seemed* to be due to my soil mix being about 50% (or more) perlite and Turface MVP.  Both of those retain about 65% of the water in tests by a Bonsai YouTuber https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mt_a7g6C2Ls&ab_channel=AppalachianBonsai.

Pumice only retains 25% water, and my "small gravel" mix with Sakrete Paver Base is most like the Granite Chips with only 5% water retention.  Overly wet (especially with recent rains) could be a contributor to your issue.

[Looking Glass]

30 minutes ago, Merlyn said:

My notes on iron deficiencies are:

• Many times caused by overly mucky soil and root rot. Starts with new spear leaves with yellow-green or even white, possibly with spots of green.

The older fronds on the Alfredii seem like they are pretty nice, which would indicate an iron deficiency.  It might be pH-related, root rot, overwatering, or maybe something else?  I've had that kind of issue in potted seedlings in my nursery area, which *seemed* to be due to my soil mix being about 50% (or more) perlite and Turface MVP.  Both of those retain about 65% of the water in tests by a Bonsai YouTuber https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mt_a7g6C2Ls&ab_channel=AppalachianBonsai.

Pumice only retains 25% water, and my "small gravel" mix with Sakrete Paver Base is most like the Granite Chips with only 5% water retention.  Overly wet (especially with recent rains) could be a contributor to your issue.

I could have easily overdone the water.   After like 10 inches of rain the first week of June, we’ve been bone dry for 3 weeks, which means lots of irrigation for the lawn, and that’s a wet spot for irrigation.   All the storms are missing us lately.   I also had been watering aggressively in the spring.   

I’m fairly sure that with the Alfredii, it’s a sin of commission, not omission.   Sometimes I get carried away.   

[kinzyjr]

18 minutes ago, Looking Glass said:

I could have easily overdone the water.   After like 10 inches of rain the first week of June, we’ve been bone dry for 3 weeks, which means lots of irrigation for the lawn, and that’s a wet spot for irrigation.   All the storms are missing us lately.   I also had been watering aggressively in the spring.   

I’m fairly sure that with the Alfredii, it’s a sin of commission, not omission.   Sometimes I get carried away.   

I'd have to throw my lot in with @Merlyn.  My Beccariophoenix sp. prefer to get a break between rains/watering.  My Beccariophoenix fenestralis is especially sensitive to over-watering, so it is mound planted and never receives supplemental water.

[Looking Glass]

32 minutes ago, kinzyjr said:

I'd have to throw my lot in with @Merlyn.  My Beccariophoenix sp. prefer to get a break between rains/watering.  My Beccariophoenix fenestralis is especially sensitive to over-watering, so it is mound planted and never receives supplemental water.

I guess I’ll let things dry out around these guys, maybe keep adding the humic acid from time to time.  It makes the most sense.  It seems to be an absorption/root related issue.  Hopefully I didn’t muckidy-muck up the holes too bad.  They were both small holes.  Maybe if I ease up on watering and the roots can power out of those holes, they’ll be ok.   I’ll keep up the foliar iron for support and hope for the best.  

[Merlyn]

My biggest Alfredii is about 8 to 10 feet downhill from a roof downspout.  It grew a lot faster than the other 4 planted around the same time at the same ~5ft height.  Lots of water probably isn't an issue with fast draining soil, but could definitely be an issue in dense soil.  My palms were also a LOT bigger with pretty established root systems in a 3g pot.  I don't know anything about "Stumpy' palms other than the nickname... 

[kinzyjr]

27 minutes ago, Merlyn said:

Lots of water probably isn't an issue with fast draining soil, but could definitely be an issue in dense soil. 

Good point!  My soil is VERY different from the sandy soils typically found in South Florida.  Very dark and full of organic matter.  My experience is probably not applicable in the case presented.

[Merlyn]

I just remembered something MB Palms told me when I bought the first three Alfredii: "Watch out for iron deficiencies."  He didn't elaborate, but I took this to mean he had to add extra iron to the field of 3g Alfredii he was growing at the time.  So I'd guess that's the issue.

The Carlsmithii looks like it might be kinda pale green all over, maybe it is a "too much sun" or "wrong pH" issue?

[Looking Glass]

I’m on a base of sand, if you dig, but it’s highly variable up top.  Some spots that are now grass, used to be garden areas or spots where large trees grew decades ago.  You can hit sand 24” down or 6 inches down depending.  I also put a foot of organics down in the garden beds near the house 2 years ago, under heavy mulching over that.  It’s possible, that plus overwatering did it.

It’s also possible that alkaline sand underneath is the problem.  But you’d think that would correct with a couple soil hits of EDDHA Fe.   

My water lovers are super green and happy.  The Carribean palms and Pseudophoenix, I consciously restrain myself from watering, but these two got watered as much as the Satakentias and Teddies.  Oops.   

[Merlyn]

If it's alkaline sand under everything, no amount of chemicals will change it's mineral composition.  It's the reason why people here (in South FL and the Keys specifically) say they can't grow certain species in the ground.  I know @PalmatierMeg has commented on this with some species, but I don't know if B. Alfredii or D. Carlsmithii were a concern.  It's a big problem when pure limestone (or crushed shells) are only a couple of inches down. 

One possibility is the locations of large trees.  The guys that grind stumps usually grind it about 1 foot below the surface, because time = money.  I had to literally dig 3' deep holes 6 to 10' in diameter to extract the stumps of old water oaks, and that was *after* they had been ground.  If the stumps are less than 5 years old there might be a huge chunk of oak sitting 1 foot below the surface.  That'll limit root growth and might (depending on the shape of the top) act like a pool for water.

[D. Morrowii]

Could it be your water? I’m wondering if the potted B. alfredii is actually showing the same symptoms, than it might not be a soil issue. My non-expert 2 cents just adding to the conversation. 
 

[sonoranfans]

15 hours ago, Looking Glass said:

I could have easily overdone the water.   After like 10 inches of rain the first week of June, we’ve been bone dry for 3 weeks, which means lots of irrigation for the lawn, and that’s a wet spot for irrigation.   All the storms are missing us lately.   I also had been watering aggressively in the spring.   

I’m fairly sure that with the Alfredii, it’s a sin of commission, not omission.   Sometimes I get carried away.   

Yeah overwatering is the culprit.  Water the grass, drown the palms.  ANd alfredii likes deep roots, those will get killed without a dry cycle.  I water interval for palms not grass.  IF the grass lives, it got enough I guess.  Overwatering in florida is complicated by rain and soil dry cycle.  I water 2x a week for 25 minutes in 6 zones with irrigation and add some hand watering if things run dry.  The extra water is in response to how palms look and how dry the soil is around them.  Sometimes I turn irrigation off and just let the rain do it if it rains hard the day before or the day of scheduled irrigation.  Hand watering in the rainy season(now) should be infrequent.  My soil is high drainage sandy soil with some clay at 3' depth.  Watering interval should be longer if your soil is low drainage or rocky wet limestone based soil.  Overwatering can happen easily when you come from the dry spring and try the same intervals in the wet rainy season.   Everything changes when the rainy season starts and its not just rain as humidity is up and evaporation is down. The most common reason Ive seen for Iron deficiency is waterlogged roots, done that myself but mostly in containers as my soil is sandy and I cut back watering seasonally.  The characteristic Fe deficiency sign, displayed with your palms, is newest leaves come out pale vs older ones.

[Looking Glass]

3 hours ago, D. Morrowii said:

Could it be your water? I’m wondering if the potted B. alfredii is actually showing the same symptoms, than it might not be a soil issue. My non-expert 2 cents just adding to the conversation. 
 

Well that’s not good….   Just checked pH of my city water and it’s off my simple scale… 9+?  So I’ve been overwatering with strongly alkaline water.   

1 hour ago, sonoranfans said:

Yeah overwatering is the culprit.  Water the grass, drown the palms.  ANd alfredii likes deep roots, those will get killed without a dry cycle.  I water interval for palms not grass.  IF the grass lives, it got enough I guess.  Overwatering in florida is complicated by rain and soil dry cycle.  I water 2x a week for 25 minutes in 6 zones with irrigation and add some hand watering if things run dry.  The extra water is in response to how palms look and how dry the soil is around them.  Sometimes I turn irrigation off and just let the rain do it if it rains hard the day before or the day of scheduled irrigation.  Hand watering in the rainy season(now) should be infrequent.  My soil is high drainage sandy soil with some clay at 3' depth.  Watering interval should be longer if your soil is low drainage or rocky wet limestone based soil.  Overwatering can happen easily when you come from the dry spring and try the same intervals in the wet rainy season.   Everything changes when the rainy season starts and its not just rain as humidity is up and evaporation is down. The most common reason Ive seen for Iron deficiency is waterlogged roots, done that myself but mostly in containers as my soil is sandy and I cut back watering seasonally.  The characteristic Fe deficiency sign, displayed with your palms, is newest leaves come out pale vs older ones.

That grass is a pain.  In full sun, it’s toast after a few days without water, with a little shade, it’s happier and can go a bit longer.  But I think I’ve been over watering by hand.  

Hopefully I didn’t compact all the soil into muck in those spots, and that it’s reversible if I let things dry out and I back off.   

 

[Johnny Palmseed]

4 hours ago, Looking Glass said:

Well that’s not good….   Just checked pH of my city water and it’s off my simple scale… 9+?  So I’ve been overwatering with strongly alkaline water.   

That grass is a pain.  In full sun, it’s toast after a few days without water, with a little shade, it’s happier and can go a bit longer.  But I think I’ve been over watering by hand.  

Hopefully I didn’t compact all the soil into muck in those spots, and that it’s reversible if I let things dry out and I back off.   

 

It could be. I did the same thing with a pool tester and then bought a cheap pH tester online. This sample is testing at 9.5 today. I don’t recall it being that high before. Usually around 8.4-8.6 was what I thought it was but I haven’t checked it in a while.

[kinzyjr]

18 minutes ago, Johnny Palmseed said:

It could be. I did the same thing with a pool tester and then bought a cheap pH tester online. This sample is testing at 9.5 today. I don’t recall it being that high before. Usually around 8.4-8.6 was what I thought it was but I haven’t checked it in a while.

To think I was ticked when mine came up 7.8.  Those are some really high numbers.  There are some plants here that I cannot water with my tap water because it will cause problems.  Unfortunately, boiling it for 20 minutes to remove the chlorine and then adding vinegar until the pH comes down to 6 didn't seem to help.

[Looking Glass]

5 hours ago, kinzyjr said:

To think I was ticked when mine came up 7.8.  Those are some really high numbers.  There are some plants here that I cannot water with my tap water because it will cause problems.  Unfortunately, boiling it for 20 minutes to remove the chlorine and then adding vinegar until the pH comes down to 6 didn't seem to help.

Maybe some sulfur is in order.  If only to combate having to water with a pH of 9.5.  No wonder everything is so happy after a good rain.   I never checked until today.  

[sonoranfans]

A pH of 9.5 is awful high not good for most palms.  I can see why you would have Fe, Mn, Cu, deficiencies.  Its going to be tough to grow lots of things as nutrient availability is worst at high pH like that.

 

[Looking Glass]

8 hours ago, sonoranfans said:

A pH of 9.5 is awful high not good for most palms.  I can see why you would have Fe, Mn, Cu, deficiencies.  Its going to be tough to grow lots of things as nutrient availability is worst at high pH like that.

 

Yeah, that might explain some unhappy potted stuff also.  Dypsis orange crush has been miserable from the start here.  

I have had Mn deficiency come up a couple of times with different palms, but it seems to correct quickly with some extra Mn.  I add some if I see small leaves appear.  Other than organics to the soil, do you think using pelletized sulfur would help offset things?  

I’ll test the water periodically now, to see if this is a transient thing, or the norm.  

[sonoranfans]

8 hours ago, Looking Glass said:

Yeah, that might explain some unhappy potted stuff also.  Dypsis orange crush has been miserable from the start here.  

I have had Mn deficiency come up a couple of times with different palms, but it seems to correct quickly with some extra Mn.  I add some if I see small leaves appear.  Other than organics to the soil, do you think using pelletized sulfur would help offset things?  

I’ll test the water periodically now, to see if this is a transient thing, or the norm.  

Not sure if sulfur would help,  The question is what is the soil pH.  Tap water will dominate the pH of the pottiong soil, the ground may be another matter.  The Mn problem might be treated with MnSO4 and some humic acid which will help chelate the nutrients.  Chelated nutrients are more bio available in more of the pH range.  But pH=9.5?  I dont know what will be happy there.  How about a water filter at the source to remove some hardness?  Every place has its strengths and weaknesses even hawaii digging is hard in many places its rock,  Some places in sough forida need to jackhammer holes in the ground to plant palms.   Palms are cheap here but perhaps water isnt at least at the proper pH.  I have plenty of sand, mulching is a vicious cycle.  I have to buy more fertilizer since myu cation exchange capacity is low(in sand).  Maybe delivering Fe, Mn in dilute humic acid can help compensate for pH.  It should be most obvoious it help in pots.  But recovery from Mn deficiency takes a while to notice change.

[Looking Glass]

16 hours ago, sonoranfans said:

Not sure if sulfur would help,  The question is what is the soil pH.  Tap water will dominate the pH of the pottiong soil, the ground may be another matter.  The Mn problem might be treated with MnSO4 and some humic acid which will help chelate the nutrients.  Chelated nutrients are more bio available in more of the pH range.  But pH=9.5?  I dont know what will be happy there.  How about a water filter at the source to remove some hardness?  Every place has its strengths and weaknesses even hawaii digging is hard in many places its rock,  Some places in sough forida need to jackhammer holes in the ground to plant palms.   Palms are cheap here but perhaps water isnt at least at the proper pH.  I have plenty of sand, mulching is a vicious cycle.  I have to buy more fertilizer since myu cation exchange capacity is low(in sand).  Maybe delivering Fe, Mn in dilute humic acid can help compensate for pH.  It should be most obvoious it help in pots.  But recovery from Mn deficiency takes a while to notice change.

I guess I should get the soil tested around the various palm spots.  It’s quite variable in the different yard spots and at different depths.  I’m sure the soil pH is much less than the water, otherwise I’d have all dead plants.  Plus our rains help too.  

In my panic to treat, I did hit both palms with 12% humic acid/2% fulvic acid, around 250mL, diluted in a couple gallons of water distributed by watering can around the root zone. 
Does this dosing sound right?  I know you are a fan of humic acid.  The correct dosing seems hard to verify. 

[sonoranfans]

7 hours ago, Looking Glass said:

I guess I should get the soil tested around the various palm spots.  It’s quite variable in the different yard spots and at different depths.  I’m sure the soil pH is much less than the water, otherwise I’d have all dead plants.  Plus our rains help too.  

In my panic to treat, I did hit both palms with 12% humic acid/2% fulvic acid, around 250mL, diluted in a couple gallons of water distributed by watering can around the root zone. 
Does this dosing sound right?  I know you are a fan of humic acid.  The correct dosing seems hard to verify. 

I typically use about 100ml 17% humic diluted to 5 gallons when I want to hit nematodes,  the way the rains are going it will be diluted quickly.  I have used 500ml per 6 gallons as well.  The excess is just superfluolus, not harmful, but it costs around $15(?) a gallon so I backed off to 100ml.

[Johnny Palmseed]

I was wondering if the 9.5 reading was correct so I calibrated the meter and re did it today. It was slightly lower at 9.1. Still very alkaline and I’m not sure why. I assume it has to do with where they are currently drawing from. I have a call in to the city water quality assurance lab which I hope gets returned. When I got the meter about a year ago, the tap water was reading around 8.0-8.5. I was not thrilled with that especially since my “soil” is calcareous garbage and reads around 8.0-8.5 as well. But to see it above 9 is quite upsetting. It’s no wonder that my Roebeleniis are always showing potassium deficiencies. I have a well which I only use to water the lawn but not the palms due to high salt content. The messed up thing is that I checked the well water pH and it’s at 7.5, which would be great if not for the salt. I have been having problems with seedlings dying off and I now wonder if it’s due to the high pH of my tap water. 

[D. Morrowii]

I ordered a pH tester today. I kept coming back to this thread and thought ugh, I need to check mine. I’m assuming that the water here will probably be similar to yours @Johnny Palmseed I’ve recently started to see some issues on several palms both potted and in the ground. I thought maybe I’ve been overwatering or that the heat broke down the fertilizer quicker than expected. I wasn't sure anything was wrong until this Thursday. I kind of hope its not the water..
 

[Blueman]

I've got 6 B. alfredii in the ground that have grown well for years, good color, no obvious deficiencies.  'Soil' throughout my yard is like beach sand at all depths, although I'm inland a ways in SW FL.  All have good drainage, and haven't gotten much in the way of irrigation since the initial plantings, likewise sparse with mulching & soil amendments.  Once established, they don't seem to need anything else.  

[Looking Glass]

11 hours ago, Johnny Palmseed said:

I was wondering if the 9.5 reading was correct so I calibrated the meter and re did it today. It was slightly lower at 9.1. Still very alkaline and I’m not sure why. I assume it has to do with where they are currently drawing from. I have a call in to the city water quality assurance lab which I hope gets returned. When I got the meter about a year ago, the tap water was reading around 8.0-8.5. I was not thrilled with that especially since my “soil” is calcareous garbage and reads around 8.0-8.5 as well. But to see it above 9 is quite upsetting. It’s no wonder that my Roebeleniis are always showing potassium deficiencies. I have a well which I only use to water the lawn but not the palms due to high salt content. The messed up thing is that I checked the well water pH and it’s at 7.5, which would be great if not for the salt. I have been having problems with seedlings dying off and I now wonder if it’s due to the high pH of my tap water. 

I wonder if this is during one of the “cleanses” for the water system that happens periodically…  where the water goes from it’s usually very dilute pee-yellow, and suddenly is crystal clear for a few weeks.   Right now it’s crystal clear.   It’s never good when the pH testing lights up hot-pink.  

8 hours ago, Blueman said:

I've got 6 B. alfredii in the ground that have grown well for years, good color, no obvious deficiencies.  'Soil' throughout my yard is like beach sand at all depths, although I'm inland a ways in SW FL.  All have good drainage, and haven't gotten much in the way of irrigation since the initial plantings, likewise sparse with mulching & soil amendments.  Once established, they don't seem to need anything else.  

I probably should have been treating these more like the Pseudophoenix, and less like the rainforest stuff.  I’m going to let Alfredii dry out quite a bit now.   

[Looking Glass]

Both palms are responding, mostly to foliar iron, though more the Alfredii than the Carlsmithii.   

 

I’ll give then another hit in the next few days if it’s not rainy.   Hopefully it will be enough to to bridge them to root uptake. 

[Merlyn]

7 hours ago, Looking Glass said:

Both palms are responding, mostly to foliar iron, though more the Alfredii than the Carlsmithii.   I’ll give then another hit in the next few days if it’s not rainy.   Hopefully it will be enough to to bridge them to root uptake. 

Based on old vs new photos, I am guessing the mottled darker green spots are new...i.e. they are turning darker than before.  Is that correct?  And what foliar iron are you using?

[Looking Glass]

16 hours ago, Merlyn said:

Based on old vs new photos, I am guessing the mottled darker green spots are new...i.e. they are turning darker than before.  Is that correct?  And what foliar iron are you using?

I hit them with just plain ferrous sulfate, and then with a glucoheptonate chelated iron.  The green is where the leaves soaked up some iron.   

[Johnny Palmseed]

So I received a call today from the water quality assurance department and was informed that they are targeting a pH of 9.0-9.2 so my calibrated reading of 9.1 was “perfect”. Of course, they do not care about botanical requirements for water. I decided to try using some things I had to change the pH with some interesting results. I mixed liquid iron into a bucket of water and the pH dropped significantly but of course it will stain the concrete if you are watering potted plants. Also, I’m thinking that adding this every time I water will cause additional problems. I also had bottles of liquid seaweed and humid acid. I wasn’t sure about the seaweed but I figured the humid acid would also lower the pH. Wrong! It actually increased. Finally I went to the seaweed and the pH increased as well. Just to try something different I got my muriatic acid that I use for the pool and tried that. I knew it would only take a very small amount to change things but I completely overdid it initially with what was maybe a teaspoon in a 2 gallon bucket. It dropped the pH from 9.1 to 2.4. I poured that bucket in the pool and started over. I used a few drops and got my initial reading of 6.2. Again, quite a large drop but reasonable. I have been able to get the bucket to stabilize around 7.4 and I will check it tomorrow. One weird thing about all this is that I also tested a bucket of rainwater and it was 9.0. I thought rainwater was more neutral. But the thing that threw me was the distilled water. I wrongfully assumed it would be neutral but it was 8.5! 

[Looking Glass]

40 minutes ago, Johnny Palmseed said:

So I received a call today from the water quality assurance department and was informed that they are targeting a pH of 9.0-9.2 so my calibrated reading of 9.1 was “perfect”..

One weird thing about all this is that I also tested a bucket of rainwater and it was 9.0.

I thought rainwater was more neutral. But the thing that threw me was the distilled water. I wrongfully assumed it would be neutral but it was 8.5! 

Distilled water should be a little acidic.  I wonder what’s in there that’s making it basic.  Doesn’t sound pure.  I’d say it’s your pH meter, but if your water is like mine…. it’s accurate. 

How bout just white vinegar if you want to knock down the pH for some potted stuff?

Normally, I’d be upset if a palm has yellow spots, but now I’m happy it’s only spots, and not all yellow.

 

Edited July 11, 2022 by Looking Glass

[Johnny Palmseed]

Yeah it was bothering me since I used the distilled water with buffer packets to calibrate the meter. I was thinking “How could the meter be calibrated if I started out with contaminated water?” Well it turns out that the meter measures the ions in the sample to determine the pH. Distilled and deionized water does not have enough ions to get an accurate reading. I used the pool test kit and it lined up with the 6.8 color so all is good. I will try some white vinegar next and see what happens.

[D. Morrowii]

So whats the solution? (pun intended :-) ) If vinegar does the trick pre mix some near neutral water and water potted palms from a can? Is there anything that can (or needs) to be done for in ground palms? 

[Looking Glass]

1 hour ago, D. Morrowii said:

So whats the solution? (pun intended :-) ) If vinegar does the trick pre mix some near neutral water and water potted palms from a can? Is there anything that can (or needs) to be done for in ground palms? 

I don’t think my main problem in the ground was the pH of the water.  The pH of the ground should dominate.  I think my issue was keeping things too wet.   I was running around like a drunken Poseidon, figuring the heat was going to dry things out.  

I think the solution for the ground is to mulch and amend, let things dry out more in between waterings for palms that don’t like it wet, and supplement Fe EDDHA or other chelated iron that works well in high pH conditions.   Short term I’ll use the foliar feeds to see if I can bridge things.  Hopefully that works.  

Under my normal ground conditions here, 99+% of applied non-chelated iron is unavailable for plant uptake.  

For the pots, maybe neutralize hand watering with an acid (this sounds like a pain) and/or mix up the potting soil on the acidic side with more organics and peat and such, or figure out the limitations of what can reasonably be grown vs effort.   

Iron for Florida Turf grass:
https://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/publication/EP551

For me, maybe focusing a little harder on native palms and Carribean stuff.  While continuing to search for out of the way stuff that can be happy under the conditions here.  

Still have high hopes for Round Island palms like Dictosperma album var conjugatum, and Lantania loddegesii someday.  

These seem happy here despite sandy ground and alkaline water….

[D. Morrowii]

@Looking Glass That sounds like a good approach.
I’ve been doing the same up here. The heat and lack of regular rain had me upping the drip times plus watering by hand like King Neptune on acid  So this thread has me evaluating my watering habits. I think I’m still dealing with an herbicide mistake here though. I’m planning to do some soil pH testing and will eventually take soil samples down to the IFAS extension office. 
 
What product did you use for foliar application? From skimming through the link you posted it seems like if the foliage responds then the chlorosis is iron related. I might be wrong but maybe this could help diagnose deficiencies. 
 

On another note the Normanbya normanbyi I planted was showing signs of multiple deficiencies and I read they like a low pH soil. So I added some fertilome “Soil Acidifier” basically sulphur, and after a month the palm started looking better and the last leaf looks much better than the previous two. I’ve heard it takes months for this to work so I’m not sure if this it what did the trick or not but there it is anyway. 

[Looking Glass]

16 minutes ago, D. Morrowii said:

@Looking Glass That sounds like a good approach.
I’ve been doing the same up here. The heat and lack of regular rain had me upping the drip times plus watering by hand like King Neptune on acid  So this thread has me evaluating my watering habits. I think I’m still dealing with an herbicide mistake here though. I’m planning to do some soil pH testing and will eventually take soil samples down to the IFAS extension office. 
 
What product did you use for foliar application? From skimming through the link you posted it seems like if the foliage responds then the chlorosis is iron related. I might be wrong but maybe this could help diagnose deficiencies. 

On another note the Normanbya normanbyi I planted was showing signs of multiple deficiencies and I read they like a low pH soil. So I added some fertilome “Soil Acidifier” basically sulphur, and after a month the palm started looking better and the last leaf looks much better than the previous two. I’ve heard it takes months for this to work so I’m not sure if this it what did the trick or not but there it is anyway. 

A couple years ago, after some cool, wet winter weather, some shrubs got iron chlorosis, so I got this stuff and it worked for bridging foliar treatments…  Some in potted stuff too.  

The sad part is that the chelating agent will cause blight spotting on some palms (definitely bad Bottle palms in particular), but not others (Majesty Palms were totally fine).  EDTA is known to cause leaf damage sometimes too.   I’m not sure about EDDHA.  

I had a big jug of unchelated ferrous sulfate that I’m trying to get rid of because it’s useless in the ground, so I used that as foliar too.   I just put around 2oz of each in 1-2 gallons of water, and coated the plant foliage after sunset.   

From this point on, I’ll hit a couple more times topically over a few weeks, then just periodically do a soil drench with Fe EDDHA on the guys that are iron thirsty.  My two guys have definitely responded to topical treatments.  
Time will tell if it is successful long term.  
 

 

[Looking Glass]

I do have a bag of sulfur here, but haven’t decided how or if to deploy it yet.   I think I’ll get some soil testing done first.   

My first attempts with crotons in the sandy soil here were subpar, even with amending.  Now I shovel tons of manure and tons of peat in the planting holes and they grow much faster.   In my imagination this acidifies the soil, and the do like lower pHs.   

Edited July 12, 2022 by Looking Glass

[Johnny Palmseed]

I have some of this stuff and have been applying it around my Roebeleniis to try to help offset the potassium deficiency. I can’t say I have seen a significant change. I believe the effect is temporary anyway since my soil in that area was never amended like I do now. It is crushed shells and coquina with an orange colored coarse sand. There is very little of what I would consider soil to hold nutrients. I think the addition of peat and manure is a good idea and is something I have been doing around the yard.

[Looking Glass]

5 hours ago, Johnny Palmseed said:

I have some of this stuff and have been applying it around my Roebeleniis to try to help offset the potassium deficiency. I can’t say I have seen a significant change. I believe the effect is temporary anyway since my soil in that area was never amended like I do now. It is crushed shells and coquina with an orange colored coarse sand. There is very little of what I would consider soil to hold nutrients. I think the addition of peat and manure is a good idea and is something I have been doing around the yard.

All the Roebeleniis around the neighborhood get K/Mg deficiency.   I hit mine with langbeinite or potash several times a year, whenever I see an old leaf lingering yellow or orange for too long.   A cup scattered around the drip line every few months, and a decent mulch layer, keeps them nice and green mostly.  

Many neighbors just keep cutting off yellow leaves, and theirs get anemic and weak looking over the years.  

[Looking Glass]

Still improving…