Giant Bird Of Paradise Question

[Breaktheory]

Hello friends

I’m considering a Giant Bird for a full sun area - it’s a confined space so I can only fit in a 15-20G. Question is if I’ll get multitrunks like the picture below from a single plant or if this represents multiple plantings

thanks everyone!

 

[Jim in Los Altos]

You will get many offsets from one plant and they will all mature tall. Taller than in the photo given time. 

[Merlyn]

Eventually yes, it can be a huge cluster.  But they can be pruned off easily if you want a solo, double, etc.  They are not super fast, so relatively easy to manage.

[Breaktheory]

Great thanks for the info guys

[Billeb]

I wouldn’t plant one in the ground. I have a 15G I got from HD and threw it in a huge pot I had. like 30 to 35G pot size huge. Only reason I even got it is cuz it was marked down tremendously and thought it’d look cool as a patio plant. 

They are cool looking but a PITA if you ask me. Constantly cutting offshoots and any wind just beats up the huge leaves. At least once a month I’m cutting off shoots to keep mine growing 3 trunks  

My outlook on them is they are like Queen Palms. Cheap, cool looking but the inevitable future is…..they will get ripped out. And when that day comes, you’ll be cursing the day you put em in. 
 

Ill snap a pic of mine tomorrow. 
 

-dale

[Patrick]

Believe it or not, a keyhole saw works great on the trunks if you need dexterity to remove trunk slowly in small pieces. Cuts like butter. Otherwise, Sawzall away!

[Jim in Los Altos]

1 hour ago, Billeb said:

I wouldn’t plant one in the ground. I have a 15G I got from HD and threw it in a huge pot I had. like 30 to 35G pot size huge. Only reason I even got it is cuz it was marked down tremendously and thought it’d look cool as a patio plant. 

They are cool looking but a PITA if you ask me. Constantly cutting offshoots and any wind just beats up the huge leaves. At least once a month I’m cutting off shoots to keep mine growing 3 trunks  

My outlook on them is they are like Queen Palms. Cheap, cool looking but the inevitable future is…..they will get ripped out. And when that day comes, you’ll be cursing the day you put em in. 
 

Ill snap a pic of mine tomorrow. 
 

-dale

So true. I needed to call in a tree company to remove the several 30 footers in my front yard. They get so tall, you can’t clean them up even with a 20’ pole saw and look terrible as a result. I still have the three clumps and I will let some grow to about 10 or 12 feet tall before cutting down since they provide privacy from the neighbor next door. They’re in the shade so the leaves get humongous and are DEEP green and shiny. 

[The Gerg]

I don’t have these in the ground. Just recently though I decided to finally break down and get a couple to keep in pots as companion plants to the palms. I think it adds a contrast to the palms while staying with the tropical theme. I do agree with the other comments. Personally I won’t be putting these in the ground.

[Fishinsteeg234]

I am currently using several white birds of paradise clumps in ground as a privacy wall and wind block to help create a backyard microclimate. In this manner I believe they work well. You can keep trimmed to control the preferred density. As for planting in ground in a confined space, I would avoid. 

[palmfriend]

If it's a confined space - why not but not in the open. Bought a handfull and threw them in the garden - never again!

Very aggressive growing and new shots all the time plus looking always crappy due to our typhoons - so I stopped it... 

But I got to admitt that if planted in a row to create a screen and if you don't mind shredded leaves after high winds,

they will do the job pretty well. (Several farmers over here use them to protect their fields and it seem to work...)

 

Lars

 

[Billeb]

My potted bird in all her glory. This will be her home for life. 
 

-dale

[iDesign]

1 hour ago, Billeb said:

Giant Bird? All I can see is the gorgeous Ficus dammaropsis in the corner.  How old is it? (I have a young one and am excited for it to look like yours). 

[iDesign]

Back to the topic on hand... Our house came with many groupings of Bird of Paradise, and it's been a battle over the years to keep them in check. They get bigger than the house, and it seems like my husband Casey is constantly cutting down stalks.  Here's one of the groupings, that is past due for a trim. Please ignore the pathway (it's currently being rerouted).

Close up of the spot near the house where Casey setup a mild barrier ("You shall not pass!"). It wouldn't be enough to hold the rootball back permanently, but if nothing else it's a reminder of how close it's allowed to get. As for the stalks, Casey says that when a stalk gets too close to the house the rats use it as a ladder to the roof. When cutting stalks he can usually just lop it off, but every couple years he has to draw a new line with a chainsaw through the rootball base as well. It's a hassle, and it's quite possible we'll just remove all of the clumps located next to the house at some point.

Pots might be an option for these, though I had a friend whose Giant Bird busted through its huge pot. It would probably need either an incredibly strong pot (concrete?)... or the owner would need to periodically remove all but the smallest shoots. The shape of the pot @Billeb has his in is good since it doesn't taper at the top (so he can remove the plant at some point to slice shoots off & repot). Even in a pot it's not a set & forget plant!

With all that said, it might surprise you to hear we actually planted some new ones in a different area (didn't buy any... just dug out a few of the suckers). We planted these near our border fence to help block out the neighbors. We have other plants we're hoping to use as neighbor-blockers in that corner... but the giant birds grow so fast it's an easy way to get some screening up quickly. Once the other plants are established, we might remove the birds at that point (TBD).

In summary, my personal thoughts on Giant Birds are...

- They need periodic maintenance (definitely not a set & forget plant)

- Don't plant them too close to the house if rats are a concern
... unless you're willing to make sure there's always space between the plant and roof (a pretty big space, since rats can jump).

- Don't plant in too tight of a space, since the rootball gets massive.
You'll need to cut back the rootball periodically.

- Pots might be an option.
Though still needs periodic maintenance (they want to grow into a tall multi-trunk monster with a fat base... not stay small and cute).

- DO consider using Giant Birds as a quick screening solution!
That's their special talent in my opinion 

Hope that helps!

[Billeb]

47 minutes ago, iDesign said:

Giant Bird? All I can see is the gorgeous Ficus dammaropsis in the corner.  How old is it? (I have a young one and am excited for it to look like yours). 

Haha! Yes Stacey, it’s hard to miss. Thrown in the ground last August and it was an ok size plant. It is facing due West and very happy with blasting sun. It’s growth rate has far exceeded my expectations and I’m hoping it will be a showstopper in the yard.
 

-Arch. Alexandrae in the background looking terrible but have since recovered nicely.  Baby Dypsis Onilahensis upright to the left. 
 

Apologize to @Breaktheory for the thread jacking. 

 

-dale

[iDesign]

18 hours ago, Breaktheory said:

Going back to the VERY beginning of the thread, I think your example photo shows an appropriate use of a Giant Bird...

- It's being used for screening (hides the window, and also the house behind).

- Fronds don't appear to be touching the roof (at least at this height... might need to cut off fronds when they get taller than the roofline).

- Rootball space is *barely* adequate, though they'll need to cut the rootball on the wall side periodically so it doesn't push the wall. I definitely wouldn't plant in a space smaller than what's shown here.

Other plants that would fulfil a similar purpose would be banana plants or 'Areca Palm' clusters (Dypsis lutescens).  All three of these plants (birds, bananas & areca) serve a similar screening purpose, grow quickly, and require a similar level of maintenance.

[Breaktheory]

I didn’t know about the rootball issues as I was planning it for a super narrow area between 2 concrete sides! Also - yes very nice and fast growing ficus!

[Breaktheory]

Banana plants would be a good choice though they seem harder to find in a large size - actually @iDesign I think I saw a really nice red one in a picture you posted of your triple king a few weeks back - how would that do in a full sun confined space?

Edited July 12, 2022 by Breaktheory

[Billeb]

Red Bananas grow way fast if you add water. You don’t need to find a large one. They are regularly at HD and Lowes by me. If they aren’t…ask to speak to the person who orders the plants and they can surely bring 1 or 10 in for you. Far, far less invasive than birds. 
 

-dale

[iDesign]

One possibility for a small space would be "Chamaedorea costaricana"... I love mine, and they fit nicely (with room to spare) in a tiny 18" slot with concrete on both sides. They're shown on the right side of the below photo, paired with some purple Ti plant (for midlevel) and Fireball bromeliads (for low level). I also had some canna mixed it, but have since removed those (this is an older photo). I've been pretty impressed with the costaricana's ability to take sun, though you can see some burn on a couple of the leaves in this particular photo (from end of Summer last year).  I probably wouldn't recommend for "full hot sun", though mine do have to endure quite a bit of sun in this location. I initially planted them somewhat sparsely with the idea they'd fill in over time. I see lots of baby chamaedorea coming up at the base, so hopefully these will make a nice (though slower growing) screening barrier at some point in the future). Not super-fast growing, but they're moving along.

In the above photo you can also see my "ice cream banana" cluster. These need a bigger space for the rootball, and my husband trims off stalks periodically, with a full rootball cut every couple years. We really like our ice cream banana clump, and (though it needs maintenance), it doesn't feel like as big of a "monster" as the Giant Birds. Note that the fronds do get shredded during the bad Santa Ana winds, but I don't mind the shredded leaf look too much (and the younger ones below the fence line don't get too beat up.

Lastly (since you asked), here's a photo I just took of the larger of my two red Abyssinian bananas. I don't consider them to be "screening" plants... but they make an attractive solitary showcase plant (and provide nice contrast when paired with pinnate palms). Flamethrower palm is photobombing on the right. I've been admiring the huge unbroken leaves on this one lately. Sadly it will probably get shredded when the Santa Ana winds come, but this one does have a bit of wind protection (it was added here recently, and I'm really hoping it can avoid getting too much wind damage).

And here is a photo of my smaller red banana, currently still in a pot. The larger one was in a pot for YEARS... which I don't necessarily recommend, but it seemed to do ok.  Rootball on red bananas isn't aggressive (unlike Giant Birds & Ice Cream bananas), since it's a solitary not clumping plant.  I wouldn't picture it for a thin strip, but mostly because the fronds need room to spread out (not due to an aggressive rootball). Unfortunately can't vouch on full sun as mine are both in part sun, though I did have the pot in a fairly sunny spot for a few months and didn't notice any damage. I'm guessing sun would be fine as long as you give it lots of water, but you may want to do more research to confirm. The color of red bananas also works well with the common Ti plant FYI.

On the left of the above photo are some areca palms (Dypsis lutescens) that I'm thinking of putting in this area. I usually use these as screening palms, but there's a "hot spot" on that left side that I'm thinking of blocking with some areca. I also like the color contrast of the orange, and am thinking of adding more orange Aechmea blanchetiana bromeliads to help bring out the color. The massive trunks are my King Palm triple (that was the size of yours when I bought it).

More info than you asked for, but hopefully there's something helpful in there.

[DoomsDave]

I concur completely with @iDesign's comments.

Giant birds of paradise are a great "back 40" visual barrier plant. They'll get a bit trashy looking but if you have them in a big "wall" no one notices. I note that because sometimes you have a view that's hideous you want to hide, or you want some privacy from the prying eyes of the dwellers of the Voyeur Towers apartment complex nearby.

I'd hesitate to put one in a small space like @Breaktheory is contemplating, though I'll admit it's tempting.

[WaianaeCrider]

Here in the islands the get BIG.  My opinion is they look UGLY when they get really tall as the winds beat up the leaves.

[Billy]

Be careful with these. If you decide to put them in the ground I'd say plant them in a spot that has tons of room. I like the potted planting idea others have done with these and I think that's gotta be the best call. As you all know...super invasive and roots will take over and conquer. Sap from the birds dripping on your driveway, patio, nearby beautiful palms that mean the world to you, etc. can be a real pain the rear. Also need maintenance to keep them looking good, as these are not self cleaners. I don't have any of these and don' t plan on acquiring any unless someone gifts me one and I showcase them in a pot as others in this thread have. Whatever you decide to do, enjoy the heck out of it! 

[iDesign]

@Billy makes a good point about nearby palms of value being a consideration. My husband has to be really careful when taking stalks down not to “timber!” on anything important. Another reason we might just remove them someday.

As for whether they’re “ugly” - if they’re more attractive than what you’re trying to screen out they’re beautiful in my eyes. In a pot, they can also add a bit of variety to an otherwise pinnate-palm heavy yard. But they’re SUPER common so not a “feature” plant per se. Still useful in certain circumstances though (like blocking @DoomsDave theoretical “voyeur tower apartments”). 

[Merlyn]

I guess I must just be doing something really wrong, because mine are not super-aggressive growers.  These were planted in 2018 and I moved them all back a few feet in late 2020.  Maybe it's just because they get spanked back every winter when I get into the upper 20s, or almost 100% defoliated when this area hit 24.4F in January.  The dead leaves are just remnants from that brutal cold night.  Or maybe it's because they were shaded by tall pines and water oaks for several years, and not in anywhere close to full sun.  They have gotten to about 8-10' overall, but are definitely not yard-eating beasties!  So any suggestions on how I can make these take over my yard?  They are now in full sun until ~5pm and in very loose sandy soil with no supplemental water.  I had problems with root rot on Orange bird of paradise, so I took the water off of all of them.

As another option you could consider the Bordelon banana in the left foreground.  It grows a slender trunk only about 4" diameter (or less) and gets to about 10-15' total height.  They do form impressive clumps but are relatively easy to cut back.  They also have nice burgundy red undersides on the leaves, which is a great contrast against all the various shades of green.  It's not as nice as the false abyssinian banana, but those get crown rot here in FL and die way too easy.

[Billy]

I also agree with you @iDesign that ensete maurelii is a way better alternative to GBOP as long as screening isn't the purpose of the planting. I've had one of these growing in the front yard for a couple years that recently decided to double in size and I love them. Super pretty purple and white color on the backside of the foliage and they're constantly opening up new leafs. Full sun lovers just like GBOP but not invasive at all. 

[Tyrone]

If you’re on acreage and plants get swallowed up by the property, Strelitzia nicolai is a great species to add a tropical flavour and create boundaries to establish garden rooms. A bit of pruning every couple of years with the right tools and they’re good for that purpose. Also of all the large banana leaved style plants they are the most frost resistant too. A couple of degrees of frost doesn’t mess em up, but of course heavy frost does, but it doesn’t kill em that’s for sure. 

[iDesign]

34 minutes ago, Merlyn said:

They have gotten to about 8-10' overall, but are definitely not yard-eating beasties!  So any suggestions on how I can make these take over my yard?

I noticed your comment about them being "easy to manage" and thought that was interesting because they are indeed "monsters" in my yard.  Only guess I have is the fact that yours sometimes die back in the winter? Mine grow all year long regardless of the season. I remember someone on the forums saying "bananas don't understand winter" which I thought was funny. Both my bananas and GBP seem to grow nonstop all year long. 

The GBP do seem to enjoy full hot sun in my location. Wind on the other hand shreds them up.  Sounds like they might also be a little temperature sensitive (my yard has gone down to low 30s on occasion, but never lower).

Hopefully yours can establish themselves soon (and be the aggressive monsters they were destined to be). The placement you chose on your property looks great for these if they'd cooperate. 

[Merlyn]

9 minutes ago, iDesign said:

I noticed your comment about them being "easy to manage" and thought that was interesting because they are indeed "monsters" in my yard.  Only guess I have is the fact that yours sometimes die back in the winter? Mine grow all year long regardless of the season. I remember someone on the forums saying "bananas don't understand winter" which I thought was funny. Both my bananas and GBP seem to grow nonstop all year long. 

The GBP do seem to enjoy full hot sun in my location. Wind on the other hand shreds them up.  Sounds like they might also be temperature sensitive (my yard has gone down to low 30s on occasion, but never lower).

Hopefully yours can establish themselves soon (and be the aggressive monsters they were destined to be). The placement you chose on your property looks great for these if they'd cooperate. 

Yeah, I will have to go look back at photos last fall, before they got torched in late January.  I'd bet that part of my issue is lack of sun in the winter.  The photo is facing South, so they are heavily shaded by the Viburnum hedge all winter.  And it took them 6 months to grow a few decent leaves.  99% of my maintenance of those is cutting off dead leaves after winter... 

[BayAndroid]

Some great photos in this thread guys, thanks! 

I have one in it's HD pot that I've been contemplating over for a while.... hmmmm what to do now that I've read these opinions... 

[PalmCode]

Is there any special tips for successfully transplanting the new off shoots of these? After seeing photos of them in pots i want to try it. I think they look awesome. I've tried digging one out with a spade once but it died scince it had no roots. I'll have another attempt with this one.

[iDesign]

3 hours ago, PalmCode said:

Is there any special tips for successfully transplanting the new off shoots of these?

 Removing the pups was an incredibly delicate surgical procedure 

I can ask my husband for more details if needed, but I remember him using a shovel and whacking at the rootball like a madman. I just did a search online and found a Youtube example of what I recall the process looking like (you can jump to minute 7 for the key moment). What an amazing lady!!!

This video is also a good watch for those considering adding one of these in the ground, as it shows what kind of rootball you'll be dealing with if/when the rootball size starts forming. Not to discourage anyone!!! It's just good to know what kind of plant you're dealing with.  

I probably should give clarification on one thing (for those who are following along, and new to the plant)... Giant Bird of Paradise roots aren't "aggressive" in the sense that they have long wandering roots that are going to get into pipes and foundations. The "aggressive" label comes from the fact that as they make pups, the rootball gets larger & larger (the rootball on my plants is even larger than the one shown in the video). As the rootball expands (and new pups form) the outer edge of the rootball starts to press against whatever is nearby, which can cause damage (or break its pot). The good news is that the size of the plant can be controlled by removing stalks + occasional "whacking" away at the rootball mass.

As for why @PalmCode's pup died, I'm not sure, as I don't recall our pups having much of a "root" base either (and the lady in the video said you don't need roots).. Maybe try digging a little deeper down and/or cutting slightly into the parent plant to give the pup a bit more base? The lady in the video also (surprisingly) says she doesn't water her pups for2-3 weeks after planting (see 14:50 on the video). Maybe you overwatered yours and it rotted?  Just some ideas... our pups weren't given any special treatment and transplanted great.  Hope that helps!

[PalmCode]

Very good - thank you @iDesign . I will try again digging in deeper and not to water after potting . I think i put my last  ones in heavy  top soil and watered frequently .

Edited July 13, 2022 by PalmCode

[Kim]

Oh my!  How do I contact that woman in the video to come chop the heck out of my GBOP?  My house came with one tucked into the 3-sided box between the house, the side and back block walls -- about 6' x 8' -- much too small for such an aggressive plant. It looks nice when groomed but the effort is getting to be too much. I regularly cut down tall stalks, but the process is difficult in such a tight space. Mamma mia! 

[Merlyn]

12 minutes ago, Kim said:

Oh my!  How do I contact that woman in the video to come chop the heck out of my GBOP?  My house came with one tucked into the 3-sided box between the house, the side and back block walls -- about 6' x 8' -- much too small for such an aggressive plant. It looks nice when groomed but the effort is getting to be too much. I regularly cut down tall stalks, but the process is difficult in such a tight space. Mamma mia! 

Hah, yeah she is cray-cray like me hacking and shoveling and prying in the dirt!    A reciprocating saw is perfect for pruning jobs like that, it looked like she was using a serrated kitchen knife.  But the battery-powered ones aren't all that great.  You get through about a half a cut and they bog down and stop.  Get something like a Bosch RS7 or RS325 saw and my favorite Diablo 3TPI carbide pruning blades and I bet you could prune it up pretty easily.  They work well cutting into sand here in FL, and might work okay in CA clay.

[Kim]

2 hours ago, Merlyn said:

Hah, yeah she is cray-cray like me hacking and shoveling and prying in the dirt!    A reciprocating saw is perfect for pruning jobs like that, it looked like she was using a serrated kitchen knife.  But the battery-powered ones aren't all that great.  You get through about a half a cut and they bog down and stop.  Get something like a Bosch RS7 or RS325 saw and my favorite Diablo 3TPI carbide pruning blades and I bet you could prune it up pretty easily.  They work well cutting into sand here in FL, and might work okay in CA clay.

Yes, I absolutely need to invest in the right tools for the job. Or remove the darn thing and replace it with something better suited to the location. Like a palm? 

[Billeb]

59 minutes ago, Kim said:

Yes, I absolutely need to invest in the right tools for the job. Or remove the darn thing and replace it with something better suited to the location. Like a palm? 

The latter would be better. 

 

-dale

[EPaul]

On 7/12/2022 at 7:50 PM, Merlyn said:

Yeah, I will have to go look back at photos last fall, before they got torched in late January.  I'd bet that part of my issue is lack of sun in the winter.  The photo is facing South, so they are heavily shaded by the Viburnum hedge all winter.  And it took them 6 months to grow a few decent leaves.  99% of my maintenance of those is cutting off dead leaves after winter... 

@Merlyn I'm positive it's the freezing temps. In Fort Lauderdale these grew like weeds because they'd grow year round. If it wasn't for that <30 degree low once every couple of winters here in N. Orlando we'd see many more monsters of these in our area.

[Merlyn]

@EPaul I think you are right.  I found a photo from last August and the section along my Viburnum hedge was taller and had pretty full coverage.  Maybe in August this year it'll again have decent coverage of the hedgeline...maybe! 

[Breaktheory]

Sorry to re-jack but wondering if my area isn’t suitable for a banana plant - i get down to the 40s on January nights…will this kill them? I’m already prepared to wrap my royals in Xmas lights for warmth but not sure I want more plants requiring heat.

[iDesign]

4 minutes ago, Breaktheory said:

Sorry to re-jack but wondering if my area isn’t suitable for a banana plant - i get down to the 40s on January nights…will this kill them? I’m already prepared to wrap my royals in Xmas lights for warmth but not sure I want more plants requiring heat.

Should be in fine - my house goes below 40 degrees each winter (sometimes for a week or more). I've never done any sort of protection on them.

Based on @Merlyn 's comments, it sounds like they see damage at "upper 20s", but don't die. That's what I'm reading anyway. Mine grow all year long without any apparent damage.