Beccariophoenix alfreddi orange???

[sonoranfans]

much ado on this topic, alfredii vs madagascariensis  years ago 

My own experience (and some others here over the years) is that the madagascariensis/fenestrailis is more susceptible to micronutrient deficiency, specifically Iron.  My madagascariensis/fenestrailis was continuously yellow with subtle brown tips after a cold snap to 28F with frost.  It didnt budge an inch for almost 2 years more show signs of recovery, after which I yanked it.  My (3) alfredii are 22-30' tall with 2/3 trunking.  Alfredii were never chloritic or yellow for me, not particularly susceptible.  Cocos are yellow after the winter every year here, not alfredii.  

[Aleitalyyy]

I ordered a fenestralis... I'll update you...

[Mauna Kea Cloudforest]

So much confusing information in this post. Beccariophoenix madagascariensis has yellow petioles without any deficiencies, beccariophoenix alfredii tends to have bluish/glaucous petioles, beccariophoenix fenestralis has mostly light green petioles. 

Beccariophoenix madagascariensis is not the same species as Beccariophoenix fenestralis. 

Beccariophoenix is closely related to the genus Cocos so theoretically it might be possible to cross the two but so far I've yet to hear of any successful hybrid with cocos nucifera and not sure why one would want to bother since the benefit of beccariophoenix is a coconut-like palm without the dangerous nuts dropping down. 

 

[Aleitalyyy]

6 hours ago, Mauna Kea Cloudforest said:

So much confusing information in this post. Beccariophoenix madagascariensis has yellow petioles without any deficiencies, beccariophoenix alfredii tends to have bluish/glaucous petioles, beccariophoenix fenestralis has mostly light green petioles. 

Beccariophoenix madagascariensis is not the same species as Beccariophoenix fenestralis. 

Beccariophoenix is closely related to the genus Cocos so theoretically it might be possible to cross the two but so far I've yet to hear of any successful hybrid with cocos nucifera and not sure why one would want to bother since the benefit of beccariophoenix is a coconut-like palm without the dangerous nuts dropping down. 

 

I ordered fenestralis .... I'll post pictures as soon as it arrives ... it's on its way ...

[psy460]

hello,

 

which kind of beccariophoenix got red petiole ? 

i have 3 there which had green petiole, but color changed suddently, now it's completely red. 

[Aleitalyyy]

it came perfect guys...

beccariophoenix fenestralis ... since with the alfredii it had gone very badly (slow to grow and then turned yellow / white for no apparent reason and then died in the summer) now I try with femestralis hoping to have better luck ... I'll post the photos as soon as I arrive ...

 

[Aleitalyyy]

@psy460let's wait for the experts ... I don't know @gurugu

 

[gurugu]

Ciao.

I have never tried Fenestralis. I tried madagascariensis, but it died. Maybe too close to its limit here, though the place I tried it, was colder than the one I am at now, so maybe I wil give it a try again.

Alffredii is very confortable here, even when it was  planted in pots. I´ve got two planted in the ground doing ok for the last 7/8 years, but growing very slowly. A third one stil in a pot, will be planted out next spring in a sandy place.

Where did you buy yours?

Edited January 5, 2023 by gurugu

[Aleitalyyy]

hello dear... I got it on etsy.com super helpful and serious seller... beautiful plant... it ships on Mondays and takes 4/5 days to arrive... I took fenestralis because with alfredii I she was dead... I want to see if I have more luck with this... then also because the adult fenestralis is very coco... I'll give you an adult gift...

Edited January 5, 2023 by Aleitalyyy

[Aleitalyyy]

@gurugu this is where i bought.

https://www.etsy.com/it/listing/1253962314/beccariophoenix-fenestralis-20-30-cm

[psy460]

my larger alfredii in pot had also white / yellow issue, it's caused by iron defiency. 

i put it in the shade, and added some chelated iron and used special folliar spray (osifol oligo 5%), after 3 weeks it came back to light green with some dark green spot. 

in few weeks it should be completely dark green.

[Aleitalyyy]

@psy460 post some pictures of your alfredi

thanks

[GottmitAlex]

21 hours ago, psy460 said:

hello,

 

which kind of beccariophoenix got red petiole ? 

i have 3 there which had green petiole, but color changed suddently, now it's completely red. 

A purple petiole (in beccariophoenix  sp.)  is indicative of alfredii.  

[psy460]

@GottmitAlex thank you ! 

@Aleitalyyy here is picture of just opened frond on november, very white color 

 

and the same palm just now. dark green spot are because of foliar spray droplets

 

the new spear has  better green color 

[gurugu]

https://www.palmtalk.org/forum/profile/24317-psy460/

Hi psy440

Your Beccariophoenix are very similar to mine, both in erms of colour and size.

This is one in the ground.

The othe one in the ground too.

The third one in a pot. It is against a wall and under an eave in full sun, but it grows better when I leave it in the rain in the open. Next spring it will go into the ground too, but in  sandy soil

20 hours ago, Aleitalyyy said:

@gurugu this is where i bought.

https://www.etsy.com/it/listing/1253962314/beccariophoenix-fenestralis-20-30-cm

Grazie!

Not a bad idea to use those debris bags to plant palmtrees, for those who have no big plots.

[psy460]

yes it looks very similar to mine. 

I'm not sure to put it in the ground, i have cool and rainy winter there, it would be very slow grower if it survive. 

[GottmitAlex]

3 hours ago, psy460 said:

yes it looks very similar to mine. 

I'm not sure to put it in the ground, i have cool and rainy winter there, it would be very slow grower if it survive. 

The sooner, the better. 

They are slow growers. Like CIDP's.

But much better looking. 

Just make sure you make a nice hole for it so it can grow as fast as possible.  They don't like to be transplanted. Plan accordingly.  Their roots are long. 

 

[psy460]

CIDP grow quite fast there, but its a way lore cold hardy then beccariophoenix. 

i will try a smaller one in ground. it will be easier to protect the first years 

[Aleitalyyy]

@GottmitAlexthere's purple in mine too will it be fenestralis?

[gurugu]

16 hours ago, psy460 said:

yes it looks very similar to mine. 

I'm not sure to put it in the ground, i have cool and rainy winter there, it would be very slow grower if it survive. 

Climate here is very similar to yours in winter, maybe a little milder mine. As you see in the pictures, those planted in the ground are very slow after 7 years, so I would give it a try if I were you. 

12 hours ago, GottmitAlex said:

The sooner, the better. 

They are slow growers. Like CIDP's.

But much better looking. 

Just make sure you make a nice hole for it so it can grow as fast as possible.  They don't like to be transplanted. Plan accordingly.  Their roots are long. 

Mine in the ground were both trasplanted last year and they haven't blinked an eye. 

So were Archontophoenix and Bismarckia, just to name but two, supposedly, very sensitive to trasplantings, and all of them are very happy. 

Fan palms, however, have behaved worse. Some are dead. 

[Aleitalyyy]

@gurugudon't buy fenestralis ... I'm already dying ....

 

[Phoenikakias]

3 hours ago, Aleitalyyy said:

@gurugudon't buy fenestralis ... I'm already dying ....

 

I have just read this topic, I am sorry for my late reply,  as I am for your coming loss.  But I honestly wonder, why no one tried to dissuade you from this purchase.  Of course there is always the risk, that someone offering advice and help may be confronted with rude and silly comments about patronizing , nevertheless I reached  the conclusion, that this is also part of the forum's life.  

Now on the issue, fenestralis is the most tropical sp of Beccariophoenix, suitable only for Florida and other really subtropical regions.  The cold hardiest is indeed alfredii with the non windowed southern form somewhere intermediate in terms of cold hardiness.  My personal experience with B alfredii dictates, that it is both sensitive to wet cold in the root zone and to alkaline pH as well.  Also it likes producing a deep root system, another evidence of its rather dry habitat.  I suggest therefore, that you start over again with alfredii using for cultivation a deep pot filled in exclusively with pumice. You will then realise that it is one of the eaiest to cultivate malagasy palms! Regarding the cultivation in the ground, beside the use for backfill of light, free drainig soil, I would apply on root zone every couple of years some sulfur pellets and drench soil with humic acids solution.

[Aleitalyyy]

@Phoenikakiasthank you dear for the advice... I knew about fenestralis that it is highly or almost equatorial... however, since I have a coconut at home that grows well, I thought it could grow too... I was advised not to buy fenestralis. .. but I did my own thing and I was wrong... now I'm paying the consequences.... I'll definitely try again with alfredo... thanks dear for the advice....

[gurugu]

10 hours ago, Aleitalyyy said:

@gurugudon't buy fenestralis ... I'm already dying ....

 

Neither Madagascariensis nor Fenestralis. Too tropical for here.

@Phoenikakias is right. The odd thing is that I have two alfredii in the ground, one in sandy soil and the other in a clayish mixed with sand, loam, etc soil, and both are growing fine.

You shouldn´t have any trouble planting it outdoors, since your climate is quite similar to mine, though, yours, not so rainy.

What doesn´t fit me is that your fenestralis has died being indoors along with your cocos. It doesn´t make sense at all, unless it came in no good conditions.

[Aleitalyyy]

that's what I'm wondering too... maybe it caught cold during the trip... then it arrived to me now compromised... anyway it's a really too tropical plant... the bottle palm grows happily without problems... .

[Phoenikakias]

12 hours ago, Aleitalyyy said:

that's what I'm wondering too... maybe it caught cold during the trip... then it arrived to me now compromised... anyway it's a really too tropical plant... the bottle palm grows happily without problems... .

As an last resort, you may change substrate radically and substitute soil strictly with pumice. Then cover the plant with a transparent bag (to reduce transpiration and cosequencies of root fall out) and place the pot somewhere cosy and warm (not direct sun). If you feelit is dying you have nothing to lose.

[psy460]

a palm can grow only with pumice ? good food it get em the nutrients needed ? 

[Phoenikakias]

4 hours ago, psy460 said:

a palm can grow only with pumice ? good food it get em the nutrients needed ? 

Mr Golecky, many plants can grow in pumice, when still cultivated in a pot. Especially those that need a constant supply of oxygen to the root zone but are very sensitive in cool wet conditions. Perhaps leca, cinder and pine bark chips could do the same job, but pumice has worked for me , so I feel safe to make a special reference.

Edited January 16, 2023 by Phoenikakias

[Aleitalyyy]

4 hours ago, Phoenikakias said:

As an last resort, you may change substrate radically and substitute soil strictly with pumice. Then cover the plant with a transparent bag (to reduce transpiration and cosequencies of root fall out) and place the pot somewhere cosy and warm (not direct sun). If you feelit is dying you have nothing to lose.

dear, I did as you told me... by now it was in a phase of assured decline... unfortunately I didn't find pumice in the area and so I opted for perlite... now I put it near the radiator (heating radiator ) she has all the warmth she wants ... if she wants to live there she can do it otherwise I'll let her go to her fate ...

however I have good news, I ordered a nice alfredo from Sicily which should arrive in days ... in Sicily there are 18 degrees Celsius during the day, in Liguria where I live, we have 15 degrees Celsius during the day and 8 degrees Celsius at night! I assume you won't have cold problems during the trip...

[Aleitalyyy]

this is the bottle palm that grows happily in the house where I also keep the coconut!

I thought thatfenestralis could also grow and instead it is too delicate... never buy a beccariophoenix fenestralis guys, I did it and I wasted my money, I underestimated everyone's advice both here and on the Italian forum... my guilt !

[psy460]

roots are brown, look like it die because too much water or lack of oxygen. 

 

@Phoenikakias interesting to know, i will try next time i will have sensitive palm. 

[Phoenikakias]

3 hours ago, Aleitalyyy said:

dear, I did as you told me... by now it was in a phase of assured decline... unfortunately I didn't find pumice in the area and so I opted for perlite... now I put it near the radiator (heating radiator ) she has all the warmth she wants ... if she wants to live there she can do it otherwise I'll let her go to her fate ...

however I have good news, I ordered a nice alfredo from Sicily which should arrive in days ... in Sicily there are 18 degrees Celsius during the day, in Liguria where I live, we have 15 degrees Celsius during the day and 8 degrees Celsius at night! I assume you won't have cold problems during the trip...

 

 

I fear perlite is not suitable, it withholds to much water according to plant's condition.  There are other readily available substitutes like pine bark chips, leca and cinder. There are several volcanos in Italy, so I presume cinder must be quite common there,

[Aleitalyyy]

I'll see tomorrow if I find better... pine bark and expanded clay is easy to find... I'll check the rest...

[Phoenikakias]

13 hours ago, Aleitalyyy said:

I'll see tomorrow if I find better... pine bark and expanded clay is easy to find... I'll check the rest...

Cinder or lava whatever. You can buy decorative lava chunks and break them in to smaller pieces with a mjœlnir lol! Bear in mind that, however unpredictable, pine bark withholds less water than leca and leca withholds less water than lava.

[Phoenikakias]

16 hours ago, psy460 said:

roots are brown, look like it die because too much water or lack of oxygen. 

 

@Phoenikakias interesting to know, i will try next time i will have sensitive palm. 

look here  Guihaia seedling growing in my cold frame in very porous medium. I water mine once weekly during winter. Other growers growing have lost similar seedlings growing in conventiinal media and exposed to cool temps.

[Aleitalyyy]

great what mixed ground is this? bark?

[Phoenikakias]

1 hour ago, Aleitalyyy said:

great what mixed ground is this? bark?

Bark, pumice, leca and seramis.

[psy460]

i definitely have to try this!

what about watering in full sun in summer ? 

[Phoenikakias]

18 minutes ago, psy460 said:

i definitely have to try this!

what about watering in full sun in summer ? 

In the ground or in the pot?

[Aleitalyyy]

alfredo has arrived ... I bought it small also because it was cheaper and I didn't want to spend much ... but there was alfredi big and 1.5 meters tall, but obviously they cost differently ...

i'm happy now...