Sick cycad

[96720]

I have a cycad that the fronds are deformed they never open and eventually die 

[GeneAZ]

Your fertilizer has precipitated from our heat.  Remove the fert and water only with rain water or pH-adjusted tap water to 6.0 pH all next year.  Don't fertilize that plant next year.

[96720]

I never fertilize but I do use tap water it is located in the greenhouse 

[Merlyn]

If that were one of mine here in FL I'd suspect a root rot problem.  That's been my issue with a lot of the "dry area" Encephalartos like Horridus and Arenarius.  Some of them are native to spots with something like 2" of rain per year, and they don't like it here with 50+ inches...even in pots with soil that drains extremely fast.  Oddly enough they'll do okay in the summer with all the rain, and then rot and die in March.  Your soil looks like dense clay + small gravel, it's possible that it is staying too wet?  Longifolius and Lehmannii have been a little more tolerant of water, Longifolius has actually done okay (but not awesome) in the ground here.  Is that one a Lehmannii?

[96720]

I bought it as latifrons! I probably should plant it in the ground just not sure how much sun it can take! Or maybe just move it to a larger pot!

Edited January 7, 2023 by 96720
Addition

[Merlyn]

3 minutes ago, 96720 said:

I bought it as latifrons! I probably should plant it in the ground just not sure how much sun it can take! Or maybe just move it to a larger pot!

Hmmmm...Latifrons?  Where's the stabbiness?  Even young Latifrons are pretty thorny.

[96720]

I have wondered the same thing I bought it from kw and he is a pretty knowledgeable guy so I just don’t know 

[Tracy]

18 hours ago, 96720 said:

I never fertilize but I do use tap water it is located in the greenhouse 

How long have you had this plant and is this the first flush in your greenhouse?

I do see little green specs mixed with the soil in the pot which is fertilizer, approximately from before you acquired it.   At that size the leaflets don't look anything like Encephalartos latifrons.  Gene may be correct about the fertilizer even if you haven't fertilized it since you got it.   Soil looks fine to me, as many people opt for decomposed granite for potted Encephalartos around here.   Watering frequency?  I can't tell you how much to water in your climate and in a greenhouse but maybe Gene and others in the Phoenix area can tell if that is a potential issue.   I would be leaning toward less water than you have been doing to minimize risk of rot.

Final comment is patience...its just a flush away from beauty again. 

[96720]

I’ve had it since it was a seedling I don’t water cycads much I checked it yesterday after I posted it and it’s dry as a board probably need to water it! I’m terrible at growing cycads and have killed more than I like to think about would like to save the few I have remaining but definitely will not be buying any more will just stick to palms and other tropical plants!!

[Tracy]

On 1/8/2023 at 7:39 AM, 96720 said:

’m terrible at growing cycads and have killed more than I like to think about would like to save the few I have remaining but definitely will not be buying any more will just stick to palms and other tropical plants!!

Many, particularly Encephalartos, prefer to be somewhat ignored.  Granted you have some unique weather constraints in Phoenix.  I'm sorry to hear that you have had such a negative experience with Cycads given that many can endure periods of drought, which they experience in habitat.  Not a bad feature given our water future in the Southwest.  I've killed a number of tropical Zamia species over the years, but the few Encephalartos I lost were still small seedlings in bands.  If you have purchased small seedlings, perhaps it would be better to start with slightly larger plants.

Regarding the incorrect label on this, if you got it as a band size seedling, its possible that there was a mix up.  Encephalartos latifrons would be hard to confuse with your plant at anything much larger given the shape of the leaves.  Since you mentioned you have had it since it was a seedling, I assume you planted it up from the original container.  Was I correct on the soil being heavily biased with decomposed granite or is it something else?   Since the id of Encephalartos latifrons was incorrect, post photos of the full plant as well as a close up of the caudex in better light.  Its a little hard to tell if it has some fuzz on the caudex or see whether the leaf bases have collars that might help better id it for you.  If it makes you feel better, I have an Encephalartos lehmanii which pushed some fronds like this on occasion over the roughly 18 years I have had it.  It looks pretty normal at this point, so patience.

[Merlyn]

Yeah, I couldn't really tell from the photo what the soil was.  It looks gravely, but it might be holding water while the top is dried out.  This was a problem I ran into when I substituted Turface MVP for crushed limestone gravel in a few pots.  The limestone raises pH and holds essentially no water, but Turface holds a LOT of water.  I had to repot some agaves, cacti, aloes, and cycads that were having root rot problems.  

[96720]

Thanks for all the help but beings it’s not a latifrons I’m done with this cycad another one for the scrap pile!!

[Billeb]

1 hour ago, 96720 said:

Thanks for all the help but beings it’s not a latifrons I’m done with this cycad another one for the scrap pile!!

Wait! What??!? Give it a new home. 
 

So…….How often do you make it down to Huntington Beach??!? 🤣

-dale 

[Tracy]

9 hours ago, 96720 said:

Thanks for all the help but beings it’s not a latifrons I’m done with this cycad another one for the scrap pile!!

 

8 hours ago, Billeb said:

Wait! What??!? Give it a new home. 
 

So…….How often do you make it down to Huntington Beach??!? 🤣

-dale 

I hear the frustration.   Dale's point is that Encephalartos is not toast and with patience would likely turn into a nice plant.  While not latifrons it looks like it is some blue form or species Encephalartos.  Rather than compost it,  I will encourage patience first and re-homing it second.   Dale clearly is an option and there are probably some options closer to you in Phoenix.   

[Merlyn]

@96720I understand the frustration, I've trashed a few things that I was just tired of trying to nurse into health.  It just wasn't worth my mental or physical energy to deal with it, especially if they weren't something I really wanted to begin with.  To me that plant is probably a blue Lehmannii, Princeps, or Longifolius.  While not being a super-rare Latifrons, it's probably a $100 or so Lehmannii...way bigger caudex than the $40-50 ones I bought a while back.

[Tracy]

On 1/7/2023 at 12:32 PM, 96720 said:

a cycad that the fronds are deformed they never open and eventually die

I thought it would be helpful to share a couple of photos showing that Encephalartos can push a "funky flush", and live to become beautiful plants if you are patient.  I have had the one pictured below (Encephalartos princeps) for about 16 or 17 years, so it's still a juvenile in cycad years.  I had it in a pot for many years before putting it in the ground in about 2015.  In 2018, it pushed the flush in the first photo below, which had some deformed funky leaves, that never fully opened and ended up turning brown and just shriveling into nothing.  I can still see where that flush emerged because there are no leaves on that side of the caudex at that level of flush (it holds multiple).  In the second photo of the Encephalartos princeps, you can see the plant now.  It is just a matter of patience.  This plant hasn't coned yet and will not only outlive me, but probably my sons and grandchild, so they live on a different time scale then we do.

The photos of the green cycad are Encephalartos latifrons with close up of the lower leaves.  You can see both the width and shape with twists and spines is completely different than the plant you have, which looks more like Encephalartos lehmannii, or spineless trispinosis, which are both beautiful plants in their own right.

[96720]

They look great but I don’t have time to wait I’m 74 and none of my family is interested in my jungle so I would rather put in a palm that I could enjoy in the time I have left give me another royal!!!!!

[Silas_Sancona]

2 hours ago, 96720 said:

They look great but I don’t have time to wait I’m 74  and none of my family is interested in my jungle so I would rather put in a palm that I could enjoy in the time I have left give me another royal!!!!!

lol!  In 2023, 74 is young..   Got plenty of time.. 

[96720]

Average age of a male is 76.1 years 

[GeneAZ]

Instead of trashing it, why not just plant it on the north or east side of your house in dappled shade?  It's still a worthy experiment.

[Merlyn]

@GeneAZthat's a good point.  Pick a spot, plant it, let it go!  If it lives and turns into a beautiful plant, great!  If it dies...oh well...    Of course, @96720 that's dependent on whether you've got a random clear space to put it.  I don't have random "open spaces" in my yard anymore...