Mexican Fan Palm (Washingtonia robusta) in 6a?

[PashkaTLT]

Hi guys,

I found a 15 gallon Mexican Fan Palm. I like how it looks.

But I'm in 6a. I think there's no way I'll be able to protect in ground? So I will probably have to take it inside for the winter. I know they grow very tall though, can this be a problem?

Also, what do you think about how it looks? It's about $400 with shipment. Expensive, but I guess that's the fate of us folks in northern states? 

[JLM]

I think for a washy you would be better off buying seeds and germinating them yourself. For one, its always a fun thing to do. Second, they will last you much much longer since you will be growing them from seed. A robusta seedling will start producing partially palmate fronds before they reach 2 years old, they grow pretty quickly.

[PashkaTLT]

Thanks JLM. I may be interested in growing palms from seeds later, when I have a small garden already. But first I want to establish a small garden quickly, so I could enjoy it already this summer.

The question is: do I understand correctly that it will be extremely difficult to protect a Washy in ground in 6a? And if I will have to keep it in a pot to be able to take inside for winter, will I get any issues with that? Especially, I'm concerned with how tall it grows and if this will be a problem? Or it's easy to limit its height?

[Las Palmas Norte]

3 hours ago, PashkaTLT said:

...Especially, I'm concerned with how tall it grows and if this will be a problem? Or it's easy to limit its height?

Height can't be constrained. 

[Allen]

They list washyingtonia on Home Depot every now and then for $30-$60 shipped.  Try to snag one of those.  You will need to keep it potted unless you box it in.  

[Little Tex]

14 hours ago, Las Palmas Norte said:

Height can't be constrained. 

There was that lady in Michigan who inherited a 26 year old bonsai Washie, it looked like it had been trunk cut many times to slow its growth

[Las Palmas Norte]

1 hour ago, Little Tex said:

There was that lady in Michigan who inherited a 26 year old bonsai Washie, it looked like it had been trunk cut many times to slow its growth

I stand corrected. Washingtonia can be dwarfed. I never knew that. I wonder if there are instructions or classes on palm bonsai?

 

I just checked and found Palm Tree Bonsai. Looks like using a saw to cut the root ball in half, fluff up the remaining roots and presto, bonsai palm.

 

 

Edited April 11, 2023 by Las Palmas Norte

[PashkaTLT]

17 minutes ago, Las Palmas Norte said:

I stand corrected. Washingtonia can be dwarfed. I never knew that. I wonder if there are instructions or classes on palm bonsai?

I just checked and found Palm Tree Bonsai. Looks like using a saw to cut the root ball in half, fluff up the remaining roots and presto, bonsai palm.

That's great news! So, basically, I will need to cut some leafs, cut the roots in half, and it will limit its growth, right?

[Las Palmas Norte]

4 minutes ago, PashkaTLT said:

That's great news! So, basically, I will need to cut some leafs, cut the roots in half, and it will limit its growth, right?

It looks to be the case, yes. The video shows a pretty ruthless hack job of the root system, but with no apparent harm to the palm.

[PashkaTLT]

I wanted to turn away when he was cutting the roots

[ChicagoPalma]

16 minutes ago, PashkaTLT said:

I wanted to turn away when he was cutting the roots

Palms hate when their roots get damaged.

[ChicagoPalma]

20 hours ago, PashkaTLT said:

Thanks JLM. I may be interested in growing palms from seeds later, when I have a small garden already. But first I want to establish a small garden quickly, so I could enjoy it already this summer.

The question is: do I understand correctly that it will be extremely difficult to protect a Washy in ground in 6a? And if I will have to keep it in a pot to be able to take inside for winter, will I get any issues with that? Especially, I'm concerned with how tall it grows and if this will be a problem? Or it's easy to limit its height?

Canadians in Ontario grow washies in 6a/5b. Check out James palms, he grows 3 washies in the ground, two of the washies he planted were seed grown. Will not be a problem to protect your washy if you box it in for 4 months. Check out James palms method.

[ChicagoPalma]

51 minutes ago, Las Palmas Norte said:

I stand corrected. Washingtonia can be dwarfed. I never knew that. I wonder if there are instructions or classes on palm bonsai?

 

I just checked and found Palm Tree Bonsai. Looks like using a saw to cut the root ball in half, fluff up the remaining roots and presto, bonsai palm.

 

 

I’m confused at what I watched, he just made the palm look even worse and damaged it’s roots. Pretty much bonsai, except for my bonsai I hack at the trees roots and not saw them. 
 

edit

i grew a couple bonsai tree

Edited April 11, 2023 by ChicagoPalma

[PashkaTLT]

31 minutes ago, ChicagoPalma said:

Canadians in Ontario grow washies in 6a/5b. Check out James palms, he grows 3 washies in the ground, two of the washies he planted were seed grown. Will not be a problem to protect your washy if you box it in for 4 months. Check out James palms method.

I didn't understand from his video if I need to close the box completely from 4 sides. I assume—yes. How will the tree be doing without light inside then?

[ChicagoPalma]

12 hours ago, PashkaTLT said:

I didn't understand from his video if I need to close the box completely from 4 sides. I assume—yes. How will the tree be doing without light inside then?

They go dormant.

[Las Palmas Norte]

14 hours ago, PashkaTLT said:

... How will the tree be doing without light inside then?

I've used an opaque roof panels before which allows diffused daylight. Corrugated or Lexan panels are another option. 

[MarcusH]

I get heart palpitations after I've read they charge $400 for a $30 Robusta.  

[PalmatierMeg]

1 hour ago, MarcusH said:

I get heart palpitations after I've read they charge $400 for a $30 Robusta.  

Me too.

Washies grow very fast during warm weather, so start smaller and save money for additional palms.\

[Jack Lord]

In theory, you could grow almost any palm so long as you are willing to protect it. But as someone else said, they grow bigger and bigger requiring more effort at protection.

If you are willing to commit to that each and ever winter, go for it. I would go with a Trachy as it offers more resistance to freezing, although it will require the same countermeasures.

[PashkaTLT]

2 hours ago, MarcusH said:

I get heart palpitations after I've read they charge $400 for a $30 Robusta.  

$400 includes shipping. Just shipping of a 15G probably costs more than $100.

And do you mind sharing a link to where I can buy a 15G Robusta for $30? I'll gladly order there.

[Chris Wilson]

I’m growing Washingtonia Robusta in southern Ohio zone 6b. I wrap Christmas lights around it plugged into a thermocube then cover with a tarp. I actually lost electricity back in December for 14 hours with temperatures around 0 to -3F the entire time. My palm defoliated but survived and is already growing back. Here’s a picture of it last summer and another of it today.

[Chris Wilson]

I would also suggest growing them from seed. Most of mine started germinating in only 2 days and they started getting palmate fronds the first summer. 

[PashkaTLT]

21 minutes ago, Chris Wilson said:

I’m growing Washingtonia Robusta in southern Ohio zone 6b. I wrap Christmas lights around it plugged into a thermocube then cover with a tarp. I actually lost electricity back in December for 14 hours with temperatures around 0 to -3F the entire time. My palm defoliated but survived and is already growing back.

Glad it survived! I wish her a quick recover!

[ChicagoPalma]

9 hours ago, Chris Wilson said:

I would also suggest growing them from seed. Most of mine started germinating in only 2 days and they started getting palmate fronds the first summer. 

Already growing mine from seed!

[PashkaTLT]

Guys, do I understand correctly that it's considered zone 8 cold hardy?

[5am]

9 hours ago, PashkaTLT said:

Guys, do I understand correctly that it's considered zone 8 cold hardy?

You can get years out of it in zone 8a where it can become a sizable tree, but a cold wet winter may do it in. I think the Dallas Arboretum is a good example. They have some now but they used to have more. 

[MarcusH]

10 hours ago, PashkaTLT said:

Guys, do I understand correctly that it's considered zone 8 cold hardy?

A Robusta ? No ! Robustas don't like temperatures below 20F. They also defoliate around 20F . We lost thousands of Robustas in San Antonio 2 years ago.  It's the least hardiest Washingtonia.  Only hybrids survived palmaggedon.  Pure Robustas are considered to be 9b cold hardy . 

[MarcusH]

2 minutes ago, MarcusH said:

A Robusta ? No ! Robustas don't like temperatures below 20F. They also defoliate around 20F . We lost thousands of Robustas in San Antonio 2 years ago.  It's the least hardiest Washingtonia.  Only hybrids survived palmaggedon.  Pure Robustas are considered to be 9b cold hardy . 

Lots of folks on the internet say it's 9a cold hardy.  The data they use to determine a cold hardiness zone is based on average minimum temperatures in other words it can get colder .  You're safe in a high 9a zone that's close to 9b . 

[MarcusH]

On 4/12/2023 at 1:44 PM, PashkaTLT said:

$400 includes shipping. Just shipping of a 15G probably costs more than $100.

And do you mind sharing a link to where I can buy a 15G Robusta for $30? I'll gladly order there.

No all our local stores don't ship that far . 

[MarcusH]

On 4/12/2023 at 1:39 PM, Jack Lord said:

In theory, you could grow almost any palm so long as you are willing to protect it. But as someone else said, they grow bigger and bigger requiring more effort at protection.

If you are willing to commit to that each and ever winter, go for it. I would go with a Trachy as it offers more resistance to freezing, although it will require the same countermeasures.

The best palms for zone pusher are the ones that don't grow as tall and still considered to be cold hardy .  I doubt people climb up a 50ft Robusta to install some Christmas lights around the butt . There comes the time where you have to let go.  One more thing always consider the cost of removing a large palm if you can't do it yourself.  

[ChicagoPalma]

4 minutes ago, MarcusH said:

The best palms for zone pusher are the ones that don't grow as tall and still considered to be cold hardy .  I doubt people climb up a 50ft Robusta to install some Christmas lights around the butt . There comes the time where you have to let go.  One more thing always consider the cost of removing a large palm if you can't do it yourself.  

Saw a post a while ago of a 20ft robusta covered in Christmas lights, can’t find I though.

[ChicagoPalma]

You can grow robustas if they are protected, because that what many Canadians do.

[MarcusH]

To a certain height my friend . There comes the time where your protection methods don't work anymore.  One cold Chicago winter will take out your Robusta within hours that's guaranteed.  I'm a zone pusher myself.  I know I have two Queens planted in a 8b zone . Queen palms can grow as tall as 50ft.  Once climbing on the ladder isn't an option anymore I have to let nature take over . Most winters are 9a/9b in San Antonio but it can get cold and the 2020s are pretty brutal on palms so far. We might be good for years maybe a decade or two we just don't know but hey where's the fun if you give up on your hobby ? You can replant any palm again just mentioned earlier consider the cost of removing palms if you can't do it yourself.  

[Little Tex]

1 hour ago, MarcusH said:

Pure Robustas are considered to be 9b cold hardy . 

9a

[MarcusH]

1 minute ago, Little Tex said:

9a

Well 9a didn't work here in Texas on February 2021. Like I mentioned before if you really want to make sure you're out of the woods 9b it is. 

[ChicagoPalma]

1 hour ago, MarcusH said:

To a certain height my friend . There comes the time where your protection methods don't work anymore.  One cold Chicago winter will take out your Robusta within hours that's guaranteed.  I'm a zone pusher myself.  I know I have two Queens planted in a 8b zone . Queen palms can grow as tall as 50ft.  Once climbing on the ladder isn't an option anymore I have to let nature take over . Most winters are 9a/9b in San Antonio but it can get cold and the 2020s are pretty brutal on palms so far. We might be good for years maybe a decade or two we just don't know but hey where's the fun if you give up on your hobby ? You can replant any palm again just mentioned earlier consider the cost of removing palms if you can't do it yourself.  

You can actually slow the growth rate of a robusta in a colder zone by trying to make it struggle for many period of time and also damage the roots to keep it trying to regrow roots and less growing its trunk, but its not recommended because it can kill your palm and cause many fungus and bacterial problems.

[Jack Lord]

7 hours ago, MarcusH said:

The best palms for zone pusher are the ones that don't grow as tall and still considered to be cold hardy .  I doubt people climb up a 50ft Robusta to install some Christmas lights around the butt . There comes the time where you have to let go.  One more thing always consider the cost of removing a large palm if you can't do it yourself.  

Indeed. I don't doubt it because I was one of those people. I had a pretty good Butia going. Not 50 feet of course, but as its size increased, my energy waned. And then came the inevitable ...

I could have kept it going, but it gets increasingly harder. 

 

[PashkaTLT]

5 hours ago, ChicagoPalma said:

but its not recommended because it can kill your palm and cause many fungus and bacterial problems.

Yeah, but I guess it should be done when the alternative is that it will be too big to protect and the nature may kill it.

[ChicagoPalma]

23 minutes ago, PashkaTLT said:

Yeah, but I guess it should be done when the alternative is that it will be too big to protect and the nature may kill it.

true, but its gonna suffer way more if it gets fungal problems.

[5am]

12 hours ago, MarcusH said:

A Robusta ? No !

Oops, robusta. MarcusH is right (and it’s been too long to edit my post.) I wouldn’t spend that amount for that size but if you’re able to keep a smaller one as a potted plant for a year or two you’ll be amazed at the speed it grows. The juvenile plant is gorgeous with a colored trunk and oversize leaves.