10a Suggestions in Sand

[ahosey01]

Hey everyone, been a while since I have posted.

We are selling the house and moving to San Luis, AZ.  The soil there is mostly sand - not sandy loam, but sand.  It is at least a Zone 10a.  Some areas of town may be a zone 10b - there are some massive Delonix regia that I would have thought would have been fried in the 2007 freeze, but are definitely way bigger than 13 years old.  Also saw what I believe was a big, old Sea Grape.

Obviously I should grow a Delonix regia.  I am also thinking about Roystonia and Dypsis decaryi.  Anyways, can anyone else suggest some 10a/b palms that have low nutrient requirements and can handle the desert sun?  Would like some stuff that grows reasonably fast because I don't want to be 60 (I'm 33) before I have a decent palm garden.

[aztropic]

For fast growers,all the old standbys will work. Phoenix,Bismarckia,med fan,mule,royal, Washingtonia. Slower growers that don't mind sand; Serenoa, Coccothrinax,Livistona, Pseudophoenix,might even be worth trying to establish a few coconuts! 

Across the border,the town of San Luis is actually very quiet and clean - not your average Mexican border town.

 

aztropic

Mesa, Arizona 

Edited June 13, 2023 by aztropic

[PalmatierMeg]

Coccothrinax and Copernicia are my first thoughts. I can't grow them here but Braheas might do well there. Maybe someone in CA can confirm that

[ahosey01]

Anyone have experience with Livistona mariae ?

[ahosey01]

53 minutes ago, aztropic said:

For fast growers,all the old standbys will work. Phoenix,Bismarckia,med fan,mule,royal, Washingtonia. Slower growers that don't mind sand; Serenoa, Coccothrinax,Livistona, Pseudophoenix,might even be worth trying to establish a few coconuts! 

Across the border,the town of San Luis is actually very quiet and clean - not your average Mexican border town.

 

aztropic

Mesa, Arizona 

I was already thinking the coconut thing.  The yard at the house is fairly small and well protected and there's a decent size space in between the wall of the house (stucco) and the block wall that may be well protected.  Might give it a try.

[ahosey01]

11 minutes ago, PalmatierMeg said:

Coccothrinax and Copernicia are my first thoughts. I can't grow them here but Braheas might do well there. Maybe someone in CA can confirm that

What are some smaller Copernicia ?  Yard isn't huge lol...

Was also thinking Medemia argun.

[aztropic]

Smaller Copernicia include berteroana,cowellii,glabrescens,macroglossa,rigida,and yarey. I think most Copernicia species though, won't appreciate sand for substrate without a lot of additional fertilizer. For smaller Caribbean palms,think Coccothrinax.

 

aztropic

Mesa, Arizona 

[NickJames]

4 hours ago, ahosey01 said:

Anyone have experience with Livistona mariae ?

Hey Adam, I have several close relatives in Livistona Rigida. I guess before 2005 they were the same species? They took two hurricanes and a hard freeze in the span of 90 days after having been planted in the same year. 

I have myakka fine sand here in Deltona which resembles beach sand. There’s nothing in it apart from what I’ve amended it with.

The rigida are extremely fast growing, having completely replaced its hurricane ravaged crown over winter and spring. However, the petioles are not wind resistant; they were my most severely damaged palms by far, with much internal growth completely snapping or collapsing. The palms themselves didn’t move an inch, it was just the foliage that was beaten up. 

[NickJames]

Just now, NickJames said:

Hey Adam, I have several close relatives in Livistona Rigida. I guess before 2005 they were the same species? They took two hurricanes and a hard freeze in the span of 90 days after having been planted in the same year. 

I have myakka fine sand here in Deltona which resembles beach sand. There’s nothing in it apart from what I’ve amended it with.

The rigida are extremely fast growing, having completely replaced its hurricane ravaged crown over winter and spring. However, the petioles are not wind resistant; they were my most severely damaged palms by far, with much internal growth completely snapping or collapsing. The palms themselves didn’t move an inch, it was just the foliage that was beaten up. 

Apart from this, I’ve provided moderate fertilizer and they are on irrigation. Our fire ants are unreal here in FL, and a couple had large mounds at the base and crawling around the root zone, so I’ve also treated them with a systemic insecticide to prevent ant damage. 

[kinzyjr]

The Livistona genus suggested above has a lot of palms that are happy in the sand hills on the Lake Wales Ridge.  Most of the time it is Livistona decora or Livistona chinensis, but you get a few Livistona nitida and Livistona mariae.  Livistona saribus tolerates sand pretty well, but it prefers a more moist site and might not care for the desert as much.  The closely related Saribus rotundifolius might make it.

The palms in the Hyphaene genus should handle it well.  My personal favorites are Hyphaene coriacea, Hyphaene thebaica, Hyphaene compressa, Hyphaene compressa.

Not sure how Medemia argun would perform there, but worth a shot.  The closely related Latania genus as well as the aforementioned Bismarckia would probably work well.

All forms of Nannorrhops ritchiana should perform well.

If you want big stuff and cost isn't a major issue: Tahina spectabilis?

Since Coccothrinax was mentioned, a closely related clustering palm with 10a interest is Zombia antillarum.

[idontknowhatnametuse]

Thrinax Radiata and most Sabal species.

[PalmatierMeg]

13 hours ago, ahosey01 said:

Anyone have experience with Livistona mariae ?

Livistona mariae does well here in alkaline, shell rock sand. We thought we would lose ours after Hurricane Ian - the crown was knocked all wonky - but it has come back. We planted another from a 3g last fall and it is also doing well. 

[ahosey01]

8 hours ago, idontknowhatnametuse said:

Thrinax Radiata and most Sabal species.

Thrinax radiata are small, correct?

[sonoranfans]

I grew palms in clay soil in Gilbert arizona for 10 years, temps u[p to 122F adn RH down to 6%.  I can imagine growing them in sand as sand is so hard to keep moist.  10a hot desert is not at all like 10a florida subtropical.  I have to be careful of desiccation here in the spring/dry season in my sandy florida soil.  The approach that will give the healthiest palms or best chance would be to change your soil with clay in a big way and go with desert tolerant palms like brahea armata. bismarckia, phoenix, and hyphaene sp.  Sand in arid regions looks like north africa. a hostile environment for many palms.

[aztropic]

28 minutes ago, ahosey01 said:

Thrinax radiata are small, correct?

Yes. They are a smaller to medium size palm. Here's one I grew from seed here in Arizona,about 15 years old now,so also a fairly fast grower.  

 

aztropic

Mesa, Arizona 

[Darold Petty]

I don't know where you might locate one, but this is a very nice, smaller palm.

https://www.palmpedia.net/palmsforcal/Allagoptera_arenaria

 

[TropicalGardenSpain]

Try Guassia, they all seem to do well for me and our soil is sandy, Princeps and Maya grow quickly and have interesting trunks.

[Merlyn]

On 6/13/2023 at 5:52 PM, ahosey01 said:

Anyone have experience with Livistona mariae ?

I have a pair of Mariae in the ground here, I'd rate them as "similar" in growth speed to regular Chinensis.  The reddish leaves are really nice, but I understand that goes away as they get taller.

Brahea Nitida (Calcarea) and Clara "super silver" are really nice looking even when small.