How to make a fat trunk, Archontophoenix alexandrae

[Brandon39.5]

I've germinated a couple of A. alexandrae seeds, and I was wondering how to make its trunk fat, should I fertilize it from an early age? What should I do?

[sonoranfans]

clay soil that retains moisure and water, water, water.  Fertilizer will help but water is more important.  My observations here on florida royals is that the fat ones are well watered with lots of room for roots while the skinny ones are amongst concrete paving, generally in public places, with minimal irrigation water.  I expect the same to be true for archies.  CA climate grows the fattest archies I have seen on palmtalk, sandy soil like mine makes it tougher to keep the roots consistently moist.  Here are the trunks of my alexandre triple, 12 years from 1 gallon strap leafers. I estimate 17" at the base comparing 17" of ruler.   Cant see the crowns now, sun has backlit the canopy.  These are nearing 30' overall now. I think they grow bigger/fatter in Southern California than florida.

[quaman58]

I germinated some from the forest near Hilo, 2016 I think. As Tom says, water, water. But also keep solitary, not in multiples. It's starting to get proportions that look almost Roystonea-like. Super growing palms..

[sonoranfans]

1 hour ago, quaman58 said:

I germinated some from the forest near Hilo, 2016 I think. As Tom says, water, water. But also keep solitary, not in multiples. It's starting to get proportions that look almost Roystonea-like. Super growing palms..

It had never occurred to me that archies would get so big and fat as they dont seem to do that here.  I have a maxima that is a few years younger(3), a little smaller but 10' from any other palm and its similar in trunk thickness.  My initial take was that the smaller crowns of these are more amenable to making double and triples as the leaves are no so long as my roystonea, satakentia, or even kentiopsis.  I also wanted them close for cold tolerance, a bit iffy here to space archies out when young.  I prefer the looks of the CA grown archies, when well grown, they just look more robust of trunk and leaves.  Spain 10a will be more like california so water away and plant california style.

[Jim in Los Altos]

Genetics plays a huge part in these. All my Archontophoenix (50+) are well watered and fed and grow in similar lighting. Some have thin trunks while others have massive ones. That’s my hand as a size reference on this one. 

[Brandon39.5]

6 hours ago, sonoranfans said:

clay soil that retains moisure and water, water, water.  Fertilizer will help but water is more important.  My observations here on florida royals is that the fat ones are well watered with lots of room for roots while the skinny ones are amongst concrete paving, generally in public places, with minimal irrigation water.  I expect the same to be true for archies.  CA climate grows the fattest archies I have seen on palmtalk, sandy soil like mine makes it tougher to keep the roots consistently moist.  Here are the trunks of my alexandre triple, 12 years from 1 gallon strap leafers. I estimate 17" at the base comparing 17" of ruler.   Cant see the crowns now, sun has backlit the canopy.  These are nearing 30' overall now. I think they grow bigger/fatter in Southern California than florida.

Those look quite fat, So water, water and more water, I have clay soil but is compacted, so What I will do is having it in a big pot from a seedling with coco coir and perlite. When it gets to a decent size, I will plant it out. Thanks for sharing your knowledge!

[Brandon39.5]

1 hour ago, Jim in Los Altos said:

Genetics plays a huge part in these. All my Archontophoenix (50+) are well watered and fed and grow in similar lighting. Some have thin trunks while others have massive ones. That’s my hand as a size reference on this one. 

Wow! That Archontophoenix almost looks like a Royal! Impressive trunk size. Unfourtuneley my Archies come from RPS, so I don't know how the parent tree looked like. How is your soil in that area?

[Brandon39.5]

2 hours ago, sonoranfans said:

It had never occurred to me that archies would get so big and fat as they dont seem to do that here.  I have a maxima that is a few years younger(3), a little smaller but 10' from any other palm and its similar in trunk thickness.  My initial take was that the smaller crowns of these are more amenable to making double and triples as the leaves are no so long as my roystonea, satakentia, or even kentiopsis.  I also wanted them close for cold tolerance, a bit iffy here to space archies out when young.  I prefer the looks of the CA grown archies, when well grown, they just look more robust of trunk and leaves.  Spain 10a will be more like california so water away and plant california style.

Why they don't look as well in FL? 

[Brandon39.5]

Well, I've read all of your replies. So, What I will do is have them in big pots from seedlings and water them a lot without letting the soil dry up. I will fertilize it too, If I add organic matter to the soil like compost or something like that would it help? Should I do the same with my purpurea? A fat purpurea would look stunning.

Thanks

[Brandon39.5]

3 hours ago, quaman58 said:

I germinated some from the forest near Hilo, 2016 I think. As Tom says, water, water. But also keep solitary, not in multiples. It's starting to get proportions that look almost Roystonea-like. Super growing palms..

Is it better full sun or filtered sun? 

Thanks

[ruskinPalms]

1 hour ago, Brandon39.5 said:

Why they don't look as well in FL? 

Alexandrae look great in Florida. This is the variety I had the best luck with. And no, they do not get any where as thick at the base as Roystonea (or Ravenea rivularis lol) here in Florida. I can’t say for sure how thick they get in California. 

[sonoranfans]

1 hour ago, Brandon39.5 said:

Well, I've read all of your replies. So, What I will do is have them in big pots from seedlings and water them a lot without letting the soil dry up. I will fertilize it too, If I add organic matter to the soil like compost or something like that would it help? Should I do the same with my purpurea? A fat purpurea would look stunning.

Thanks

never saw much in the way of fat trunks in a container for these and for most other palms.  Maybe the bottle palms gets fat in a container.   https://www.south-florida-plant-guide.com/bottle-palm.html

 

[James B]

It’s going to be a couple years before you can put in ground but the sooner the better. Putting in the the ground at 3-5 gallon size will yield the best results for the palm based on its individual genetics. If you germinated several just select the largest and most robust and cull the smaller ones if you like. Once a palms has more than a couple rings of trunk before it gets put into the ground in my observations it does not get as far as one planted while younger.

[PalmCode]

Individual genetics play a role but anyway keep it or them in a pot for a couple years,  until it gets some pinnate leafs. Feeding it with organic fertilizers, like a blood and bone and seaweed mix should  work well.

When youve put in the ground. Applying layers of mulch around will help the palm grow stronger hopefully leading to a fat trunk in time. Do the same with your A.purpurea.

My A. Alexandrae here is about 2 years old from seed and I'd say its still a bit early for the ground in my climate. They are a bit slower or smaller than A.cunninghamiana at the seedling stage from what I've experienced in a cooler climate. 

Edited October 3, 2023 by PalmCode

[Jim in Los Altos]

8 hours ago, Brandon39.5 said:

Wow! That Archontophoenix almost looks like a Royal! Impressive trunk size. Unfourtuneley my Archies come from RPS, so I don't know how the parent tree looked like. How is your soil in that area?

My soil is a combination of rich loam, clay, and small rock. Soil isn’t a huge factor though with Archontophoenix. I even have three robust ones growing in straight gravel and stagnant water up to their trunks. They’re growing in a sunken 700 gallon fiberglass former fish pond with no drain holes. Trunk rings are 12” or more apart. Roots are submerged 365 days a year and they love it. 

[Brandon39.5]

10 hours ago, James B said:

It’s going to be a couple years before you can put in ground but the sooner the better. Putting in the the ground at 3-5 gallon size will yield the best results for the palm based on its individual genetics. If you germinated several just select the largest and most robust and cull the smaller ones if you like. Once a palms has more than a couple rings of trunk before it gets put into the ground in my observations it does not get as far as one planted while younger.

Would they do better if I put them as seedlings directly in the ground?

[Brandon39.5]

4 hours ago, Jim in Los Altos said:

My soil is a combination of rich loam, clay, and small rock. Soil isn’t a huge factor though with Archontophoenix. I even have three robust ones growing in straight gravel and stagnant water up to their trunks. They’re growing in a sunken 700 gallon fiberglass former fish pond with no drain holes. Trunk rings are 12” or more apart. Roots are submerged 365 days a year and they love it. 

I will not be scared on the watering, in summer I will water every day, the high humidity that I got where I live will help.

[Brandon39.5]

4 hours ago, PalmCode said:

Individual genetics play a role but anyway keep it or them in a pot for a couple years,  until it gets some pinnate leafs. Feeding it with organic fertilizers, like a blood and bone and seaweed mix should  work well.

When youve put in the ground. Applying layers of mulch around will help the palm grow stronger hopefully leading to a fat trunk in time. Do the same with your A.purpurea.

My A. Alexandrae here is about 2 years old from seed and I'd say its still a bit early for the ground in my climate. They are a bit slower or smaller than A.cunninghamiana at the seedling stage from what I've experienced in a cooler climate. 

Nice palm! mulch it heavily and I will look up the seaweed thing.

thanks

[Brandon39.5]

Which species of archontophoenix gets fatter?

[TampaBayRay]

2 hours ago, Brandon39.5 said:

Which species of archontophoenix gets fatter?

Maxima

[Brandon39.5]

I want to get all of archontophoenix species, for the moment I've got A. alexandrae and A. purpurea. Next one will be Maxima

[James B]

3 hours ago, Brandon39.5 said:

Would they do better if I put them as seedlings directly in the ground?

Depends on how big they are. Perhaps someone can chime in.

I planted 2 A.Myolensis that were only about 18” at the time this summer. Now they are about 24”. 
Come winter will be the test.