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Could it be? - Butia odorata x Cocos nucifera F1

Jonathan Haycock

By Jonathan Haycock
in DISCUSSING PALM TREES WORLDWIDE

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Jonathan Haycock Proficient

Jonathan Haycock

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Posted (edited)
On 12/25/2023 at 6:42 AM, Tom in Tucson said:

Sorry for the late reply, but I've been busy... When you have the time. I would very much like to see the conditions that your Jubaea grow's in (microclimate) in that somewhat warm Australian province.

Hi 55°, Lo 46° Dec 23 .05"

Hey Tom,

All my palms are in pots at the moment so not sure if there’s any value posting pictures of the Jubaea. Construction is currently underway on our house, so hopefully this time next year I’ll start a thread to document the garden as it evolves. 

Edited by Jonathan Haycock
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For those of you that frequent Facebook, I’ve set up a group called “Pommy palms”, where many of the palms I’ve seen since emigrating to Australia have been documented. If you wish to be a member, copy and paste “Pommy palms” into Facebook to view the page and click “Join group”.

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Leelanau Palms Mentor

Leelanau Palms

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43 minutes ago, Jonathan Haycock said:

Hey Tom,

All my palms are in pots at the moment so not sure if there’s any value posting pictures of the Jubaea. Construction is currently underway on our house, so hopefully this time next year I’ll start a thread to document the garden as it evolves. 

Can you share an updated picture of this special cross?

Zone 6b maritime climate

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Jonathan Haycock Proficient

Jonathan Haycock

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26 minutes ago, Leelanau Palms said:

Can you share an updated picture of this special cross?

Not much value in posting a picture at this stage as it hasn’t changed much. It’s currently pushing a second leaf so I’ll update when that’s out. 

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For those of you that frequent Facebook, I’ve set up a group called “Pommy palms”, where many of the palms I’ve seen since emigrating to Australia have been documented. If you wish to be a member, copy and paste “Pommy palms” into Facebook to view the page and click “Join group”.

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Banana Belt Proficient

Banana Belt

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On 11/2/2023 at 6:29 PM, Jonathan Haycock said:

There are a few reports/threads online that claim to have a cross with Cocos nucifera, but they tend to be quite vague and inconclusive. The objective of this thread is to document the process and provide ongoing updates until the hybrid is either confirmed or dismissed. 

What has been done with Jubaea X Cocos nucifera crosses?  The two are so similar in so many ways undoubtedly related to common ancestor during the last 55 million years of the Cenozoic that it seems a natural cross. 

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Jonathan Haycock Proficient

Jonathan Haycock

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On 12/4/2023 at 5:20 AM, Jonathan Haycock said:

I recall someone mentioned Patrick Schafer tried Cocos nucifera on the late Dick Douglas’s Jubaea, but I don’t think it was successful. That doesn’t mean it’s not possible though as each parent and pollen donor are different when it comes to compatibility, plus the climate in Walnut Creek, CA may not be conducive to such a pairing. 

I agree, Jubaea x Cocos would be the holy grail of cold/cool hardy hybrids. Problem is gaining access to a mature Jubaea to work on. I’m at least 30 years from my own maturing. 

@Banana Belt

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For those of you that frequent Facebook, I’ve set up a group called “Pommy palms”, where many of the palms I’ve seen since emigrating to Australia have been documented. If you wish to be a member, copy and paste “Pommy palms” into Facebook to view the page and click “Join group”.

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ChicagoPalma Mentor

ChicagoPalma

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On 12/26/2023 at 9:37 PM, Jonathan Haycock said:

@Banana Belt

Very interesting cross, this really might be the holy grail of cocoid palms.

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Jonathan Haycock Proficient

Jonathan Haycock

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14 hours ago, ChicagoPalma said:

Any updates @Jonathan Haycock?

It’s almost pushed out a second leaf. Not much to report at this stage, but I’ll post a picture this weekend.

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For those of you that frequent Facebook, I’ve set up a group called “Pommy palms”, where many of the palms I’ve seen since emigrating to Australia have been documented. If you wish to be a member, copy and paste “Pommy palms” into Facebook to view the page and click “Join group”.

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Jonathan Haycock Proficient

Jonathan Haycock

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2nd leaf doesn’t appear to offer confirmation one way or the other. I’ll update when the 3rd leaf is on its way.

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For those of you that frequent Facebook, I’ve set up a group called “Pommy palms”, where many of the palms I’ve seen since emigrating to Australia have been documented. If you wish to be a member, copy and paste “Pommy palms” into Facebook to view the page and click “Join group”.

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awkonradi Mentor

awkonradi

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Thank you very much for the update!  I am curious about your thoughts about if/when/where to plant that palm in the ground.

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Andrei W. Konradi, Burlingame, California.  Vicarious appreciator of palms in other people's gardens and in habitat

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Jonathan Haycock Proficient

Jonathan Haycock

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5 hours ago, awkonradi said:

Thank you very much for the update!  I am curious about your thoughts about if/when/where to plant that palm in the ground.

No immediate plans as our house is currently under construction and won’t be handed over until August at the earliest. Personally, I don’t like planting palms too early anyway, so normally wait until they at least get past that awkward and vulnerable seedling stage and are robust (normally fully pinnate/palmate). In terms of where, if it turns out to be the intended hybrid, it’ll have a prominent position in full sun. If it’s pure Butia, I’ll plant it in the green waste bin 😂.

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For those of you that frequent Facebook, I’ve set up a group called “Pommy palms”, where many of the palms I’ve seen since emigrating to Australia have been documented. If you wish to be a member, copy and paste “Pommy palms” into Facebook to view the page and click “Join group”.

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DoomsDave Grand Master

DoomsDave

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@Jonathan Haycock wow! Keep us apprised, and keep trying!!

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ChicagoPalma Mentor

ChicagoPalma

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22 hours ago, Jonathan Haycock said:

No immediate plans as our house is currently under construction and won’t be handed over until August at the earliest. Personally, I don’t like planting palms too early anyway, so normally wait until they at least get past that awkward and vulnerable seedling stage and are robust (normally fully pinnate/palmate). In terms of where, if it turns out to be the intended hybrid, it’ll have a prominent position in full sun. If it’s pure Butia, I’ll plant it in the green waste bin 😂.

If it is a butia might as well send it to me 😆

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KrisKupsch Proficient

KrisKupsch

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On 11/3/2023 at 12:29 PM, Jonathan Haycock said:

One of the main reasons I emigrated to Australia (from UK) was to indulge a passion for growing palms and to have a crack at creating cocoid hybrids. We landed in Adelaide June 2019 and I immediately got to work producing Butia odorata x Jubaea chilensis F1, Butia odorata x Parajubaea torallyi var torallyi F1, and Butia odorata x Syagrus schizophylla F1. We moved to the Gold Coast, Queensland January 2022, where I've since made Butia odorata x Syagrus coronata F1 and what I hope is Butia odorata x Cocos nucifera F1. 

There are a few reports/threads online that claim to have a cross with Cocos nucifera, but they tend to be quite vague and inconclusive. The objective of this thread is to document the process and provide ongoing updates until the hybrid is either confirmed or dismissed. 

I should state at this stage that I believe the Butia odorata x Cocos nucifera F1 hybrid attempt has been a success, therefore from this point forward I will call it Buticocos nathanii.

 

Thought you were going to call it Buticocos austenii 

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Jonathan Haycock Proficient

Jonathan Haycock

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On its 3rd leaf. I still reckon it’s the real deal. 

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For those of you that frequent Facebook, I’ve set up a group called “Pommy palms”, where many of the palms I’ve seen since emigrating to Australia have been documented. If you wish to be a member, copy and paste “Pommy palms” into Facebook to view the page and click “Join group”.

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awkonradi Mentor

awkonradi

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Thanks for the update!  Do you possibly have a similar age Butia seedling for a side-by-side photo comparison?  Pardon me for suggesting more work for you.

Andrei W. Konradi, Burlingame, California.  Vicarious appreciator of palms in other people's gardens and in habitat

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Leelanau Palms Mentor

Leelanau Palms

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....and a ruler or measure for size? You and your baby palm are celebrities!

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Zone 6b maritime climate

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Jonathan Haycock Proficient

Jonathan Haycock

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13 hours ago, Leelanau Palms said:

....and a ruler or measure for size? You and your baby palm are celebrities!

 

IMG_0657.jpeg

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For those of you that frequent Facebook, I’ve set up a group called “Pommy palms”, where many of the palms I’ve seen since emigrating to Australia have been documented. If you wish to be a member, copy and paste “Pommy palms” into Facebook to view the page and click “Join group”.

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Jonathan Haycock Proficient

Jonathan Haycock

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15 hours ago, awkonradi said:

Thanks for the update!  Do you possibly have a similar age Butia seedling for a side-by-side photo comparison?  Pardon me for suggesting more work for you.

I don’t have any Butia at a similar age unfortunately. 

For those of you that frequent Facebook, I’ve set up a group called “Pommy palms”, where many of the palms I’ve seen since emigrating to Australia have been documented. If you wish to be a member, copy and paste “Pommy palms” into Facebook to view the page and click “Join group”.

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Alberto Grand Master

Alberto

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I was also curious to see it after one year growth.... 😀 I would expect some thick kind off Cocos leaves at this stage. I hope it' s the real deal....

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Carambeí, 2nd tableland of the State Paraná , south Brazil.

Alt:1030m. Native palms: Queen, B. eriospatha, B. microspadix, Allagoptera leucocalyx , A.campestris, Geonoma schottiana, Trithrinax acanthocoma. Subtr. climate, some frosty nights. No dry season. August: driest month. Rain:1700mm

 

I am seeking for cold hardy palms!

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Jonathan Haycock Proficient

Jonathan Haycock

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Well that sucks!!! Leaf and spear pulled this evening. I’ll keep it just in case, but it’s not looking good. 

IMG_0680.jpeg

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For those of you that frequent Facebook, I’ve set up a group called “Pommy palms”, where many of the palms I’ve seen since emigrating to Australia have been documented. If you wish to be a member, copy and paste “Pommy palms” into Facebook to view the page and click “Join group”.

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ChicagoPalma Mentor

ChicagoPalma

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18 hours ago, Jonathan Haycock said:

Well that sucks!!! Leaf and spear pulled this evening. I’ll keep it just in case, but it’s not looking good. 

IMG_0680.jpeg

if it recovers and its just a butia, remember, ill take it, no need to throw it out! Also i have had seedlings spear pull at that stage, cut back or use hydrogen peroxide.

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Jonathan Haycock Proficient

Jonathan Haycock

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16 hours ago, ChicagoPalma said:

if it recovers and its just a butia, remember, ill take it, no need to throw it out! Also i have had seedlings spear pull at that stage, cut back or use hydrogen peroxide.

Yeah I won’t give up until it’s mush.

For those of you that frequent Facebook, I’ve set up a group called “Pommy palms”, where many of the palms I’ve seen since emigrating to Australia have been documented. If you wish to be a member, copy and paste “Pommy palms” into Facebook to view the page and click “Join group”.

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  • 4 months later...
DTS Mentor

DTS

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On 4/3/2024 at 2:16 PM, Jonathan Haycock said:

Yeah I won’t give up until it’s mush.

How are they now?

My Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@dts_3
Palms in Ground Currently: Rhapidophyllum Hystrix (x1), Butia Odorata (x1), Sabal Causiarum (x2), Sabal Louisiana (x1).

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Jonathan Haycock Proficient

Jonathan Haycock

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6 hours ago, DTS said:

How are they now?

100% dead.

For those of you that frequent Facebook, I’ve set up a group called “Pommy palms”, where many of the palms I’ve seen since emigrating to Australia have been documented. If you wish to be a member, copy and paste “Pommy palms” into Facebook to view the page and click “Join group”.

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tarnado Enthusiast

tarnado

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Man, I'm so sorry to hear that. You put in so much work and it was absolutely amazing.

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palmfriend Grand Master

palmfriend

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Oh,

that is bad! But it was an absolute thrilling documentation - thank you for that!

I guess it won't be the last try - please keep it going!

 

Lars

 

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Jonathan Haycock Proficient

Jonathan Haycock

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I’ll definitely try again at some point, once my own palms mature.

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For those of you that frequent Facebook, I’ve set up a group called “Pommy palms”, where many of the palms I’ve seen since emigrating to Australia have been documented. If you wish to be a member, copy and paste “Pommy palms” into Facebook to view the page and click “Join group”.

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