Best place in Australia for a palm grower?

[peachy]

4 hours ago, KrisKupsch said:

There isn't one best place in Australia to grow Palms. Two places I would rule out as being the best are NQLD and Tasmania, I say NQ as I want to be a little controversial with them up there! All locations have limiting elements. Many a Palm enthusiast works their lives in the southern states then moves to NQLD to retire. NQLD has its limits too. We all know what they are.  Australia's climate is not anything to boast about. Its extreme.  The best tactic is to try in the middle. Not the center of the continent. The Palm in the middle was put there by people. Try the few places where it's not as extreme. Funnily enough it's also where the population is one of the greatest. Anywhere with some privacy, good dirt and orographic rainfall within an hour from the Gold or Sunshine Coasts is the go. NQLD is too easy. You drop something and it keeps growing. Same for a few other places around the world. The climate makes Palms rage regardless. Whilst I have being forced to adapt to my subtropical climate, I have learnt to see its benefits over the constant heat you get in the north. Everything that doesn't die from cold, grows slower. There is stuff that will never grow here but I can get a Rhopalostylis sapida to grow whilst in Cairns it would last a week. Some tropical genera are difficult here although there are rare examples proving they are doable with the proper care and placement. Up north you can plant several tricky species just about anywhere and you'll have success. There is certainly something I prefer about the wet subtropics over the wet tropics. One local mentioned it's our comfortable cooler nights that give the Palms what they like. Burretiokentia hapala will grow in Cairns but suffers in the end, you might get a good one here and there but down here in the subtropics they are simple, as is the entire Burret. genus. The Cane beetles in the north are also something we don't, or at least I don't, get hammered with, being a little disjunct from the monotony Qld is with its cane cultivation thus the beetles and the toads. Land prices are way up there around the Sunshine and Gold Coasts, in the north you find them cheaper and likely a more reliable water supply - but you'll eventually get a tropical cyclone that will tear your collection to shreds. Whilst up there recently I was told on 2 accounts about trees entirely disappearing in tropical storms, not just blown over but gone !

Many of Australia's ecosystems are trashed. All the accessible land with any kind of dirt be it fertile or otherwise is basically farmland, be it crops, sheep or cows (which collectively there are over 100 million of them), we have the highest extinction rate in the world, primarily mammals. Many ecosystems don't even exist anymore. All this in mind there is a housing crisis with a million houses needing to be built and we have the highest migration rate for this year in living memory. In decades. Where will everyone go and what about the environment. 

A lot of farmland and bushland here is being levelled at an alarming rate and they are building tiny grey houses that virtually touch each other with backyards 1 metre deep. Most of them have black rooves too. A perfect recipe for the albedo effect. There is no room for trees at all. The Govt is ranting about their wonderful environmental projects which I know is propaganda and nothing else or why would these horrors be allowed to be built ?  Immigration is all well and good but most of it is 'humanitarian' immigration.  Okay we have to show some humanity but the way it's going, Australia is becoming as bad as the places they came from. Greed is behind all the worlds problems and our environment is no exception.  I live in Brisbane's west, we get single digit winter nights, sometimes into the minuses but so many palm species thrive here. Just 10 klms closer to the city, palms that you see in Hawaiian gardens  are growing happily but just down the road in my suburb, they wouldn't last the first cold night.  We need to de centralise if this immigration rate continues.  Look at the USA, they have made some lovely cities in horrible places climatically speaking. Okay time to get off my soapbox and take a Bex.

Pontificating Peachy.

[Yunder Wækraus]

38 minutes ago, peachy said:

A lot of farmland and bushland here is being levelled at an alarming rate and they are building tiny grey houses that virtually touch each other with backyards 1 metre deep. Most of them have black rooves too. A perfect recipe for the albedo effect. There is no room for trees at all. The Govt is ranting about their wonderful environmental projects which I know is propaganda and nothing else or why would these horrors be allowed to be built ?  Immigration is all well and good but most of it is 'humanitarian' immigration.  Okay we have to show some humanity but the way it's going, Australia is becoming as bad as the places they came from. Greed is behind all the worlds problems and our environment is no exception.  I live in Brisbane's west, we get single digit winter nights, sometimes into the minuses but so many palm species thrive here. Just 10 klms closer to the city, palms that you see in Hawaiian gardens  are growing happily but just down the road in my suburb, they wouldn't last the first cold night.  We need to de centralise if this immigration rate continues.  Look at the USA, they have made some lovely cities in horrible places climatically speaking. Okay time to get off my soapbox and take a Bex.

Pontificating Peachy.

Yeah, our house is less than 4 years old, and we count ourselves lucky to have just enough property to be able to walk around the entire house: both of our neighbors have at least one zero property line (they'd have to enter my property to see one of their walls!)

[Brandon39.5]

I like where this topic is going to, I'm learning a lot about Australia. Didn't know that houses were that difficult to find, and the costs were that expensive, For me Cairns It has the right population, coming From Palma de Mallorca where having a garden is not something common, Pictures bellow compare Palma with Cairns from a bird view, It's Normal that I don't see Cairns overpopulated, living in such an overpopulated city. The statement that Peachy made, that USA makes cities in horrible climate zones is very true, maybe Australia will become something like that if it keeps going like this. That's why protecting the Environment and the wildlife is important, Is not just over population in Australia is Overpopulation globally.

[happypalms]

4 hours ago, Brandon39.5 said:

I like where this topic is going to, I'm learning a lot about Australia. Didn't know that houses were that difficult to find, and the costs were that expensive, For me Cairns It has the right population, coming From Palma de Mallorca where having a garden is not something common, Pictures bellow compare Palma with Cairns from a bird view, It's Normal that I don't see Cairns overpopulated, living in such an overpopulated city. The statement that Peachy made, that USA makes cities in horrible climate zones is very true, maybe Australia will become something like that if it keeps going like this. That's why protecting the Environment and the wildlife is important, Is not just over population in Australia is Overpopulation globally.

You certainly opened up a can of worms on this topic I work in the farming industry and a lot immigration and migrant workers are based on that we need fruit pickers as they say Australians don’t won’t to work in the industry a lot of migrant workers are exploited and underpaid just like the low wages in my area it’s all so they can make more money and pay more taxes the government turns a blind eye and let’s the developers of farms get away with environmental destruction i have seen it first hand it’s all about money and taxes just so the farmers can plant more to line individual pockets farming and tourism are a huge industry in Australia most other companies moved offshore so depending where you live employment is difficult to find but you can always pick fruit 🍎 

[Brandon39.5]

If I had a nursery in Australia as I said it wouldn't be just palms, I would sell Fruit trees too, so people can get some fruits from their yard. And I have a question for the Cairns people, Is it true that In north QLD you see crocs and snakes in daily bases? And do snakes pop out from your house? Just kidding on that one, I suppose that it isn't that extreme. But the croc question is serious. 

[iko.]

On 11/23/2023 at 9:10 AM, Brandon39.5 said:

Hey, so there's one thing that I hate about Australia, and that is the migration system, looks like Australia might not be my place, Why would Australia have this strict rules if they have underpopulation in most cities, I thought that Australia wanted migration in their country. Australia looks like is not my place, maybe I could take this nursery idea to Europe, For example the Canary Islands, no restrictions there because It's Spain, and I'm Spanish too.

This could go out of topic in a forum about palms so I will try to be brief: Australia is relatively close to some of the most populated countries in the world, India and China to name the top, Indonesia and Bangladesh following close. I guess the Department of Immigration thought it wise to put a cap in the number of arrivals. The Skilled Migration path is a point system and I'd think the most popular, not always the fastest. Another way to get in are humanitarian/refugees, family, retirement, student,... There are no privileges based on nationality anymore although some visas are only offered to certain countries. For example, working holiday are not offered to all and student visas have different requirements depending where you're coming from. The country grows steadily and many of those visas involve the payment of a fee, easily around four or five $ digits. 

Regarding the plant/nursery business issue:

- Many states/territories in Australia have quarantine restrictions for plants between them.

- And both Spanish archipelagos (Canaries and Balearics) do have restrictions too. The Canary Islands are outside the EU customs territory and VAT so any potential client in Germany or Spain will have to pay extra when receiving the plants. And the Balearics Islands are considered in a Xylella fastidiosa area so plants cannot be transport outside the area. Because this, your clients would be limited to Mallorca, Eivissa, Menorca and Formentera. I don't know if this is implemented when shipping by post or courier because I have seen eBay sellers selling plants to mainland Spain from Mallorca. 

 

 

[iko.]

7 minutes ago, Brandon39.5 said:

If I had a nursery in Australia as I said it wouldn't be just palms, I would sell Fruit trees too, so people can get some fruits from their yard. And I have a question for the Cairns people, Is it true that In north QLD you see crocs and snakes in daily bases? And do snakes pop out from your house? Just kidding on that one, I suppose that it isn't that extreme. But the croc question is serious. 

I had frogs popping out the toilet daily in Innisfail. Snakes are more of an occurrence but not strange. Crocodiles, freshies or salties, I'd say rarer in Cairns but people kept telling me to be careful. Maybe one or a couple fatal accidents on average year, specially in the NT. 

Edited November 26, 2023 by iko.

[Brandon39.5]

5 minutes ago, iko. said:

I had frogs popping out the toilet daily in Innisfail. Snakes are more of an occurrence but not strange. Crocodiles I'd say rarer in Cairns but people kept telling me to be careful. Maybe one or a couple fatal accidents on average year, specially in the NT. 

Frogs? Never heard of that one before. I thought that crocodiles were more common in NQLD. When I was in Florida on holidays, I saw a couple gators every day. But never saw a snake. Maybe in FL seeing this kind of wildlife is more common? And yes, this Topic is not talking about palms, So let's talk about palms! What can I grow in Cairns that I can't in Sunshine coast?

[Brandon39.5]

17 minutes ago, iko. said:

This could go out of topic in a forum about palms so I will try to be brief: Australia is relatively close to some of the most populated countries in the world, India and China to name the top, Indonesia and Bangladesh following close. I guess the Department of Immigration thought it wise to put a cap in the number of arrivals. The Skilled Migration path is a point system and I'd think the most popular, not always the fastest. Another way to get in are humanitarian/refugees, family, retirement, student,... There are no privileges based on nationality anymore although some visas are only offered to certain countries. For example, working holiday are not offered to all and student visas have different requirements depending where you're coming from. The country grows steadily and many of those visas involve the payment of a fee, easily around four or five $ digits. 

Regarding the plant/nursery business issue:

- Many states/territories in Australia have quarantine restrictions for plants between them.

- And both Spanish archipelagos (Canaries and Balearics) do have restrictions too. The Canary Islands are outside the EU customs territory and VAT so any potential client in Germany or Spain will have to pay extra when receiving the plants. And the Balearics Islands are considered in a Xylella fastidiosa area so plants cannot be transport outside the area. Because this, your clients would be limited to Mallorca, Eivissa, Menorca and Formentera. I don't know if this is implemented when shipping by post or courier because I have seen eBay sellers selling plants to mainland Spain from Mallorca. 

 

 

Maybe If I study in Australia, it would be easier to get the permanent residency? Didn't know anything of the Canary Islands and Balearic Islands Issue, thanks for the info. 

[KrisKupsch]

22 hours ago, Yunder Wækraus said:

Yeah, our house is less than 4 years old, and we count ourselves lucky to have just enough property to be able to walk around the entire house: both of our neighbors have at least one zero property line (they'd have to enter my property to see one of their walls!)

sounds like opposite Smithfield ?

[KrisKupsch]

3 hours ago, Brandon39.5 said:

Frogs? Never heard of that one before. I thought that crocodiles were more common in NQLD. When I was in Florida on holidays, I saw a couple gators every day. But never saw a snake. Maybe in FL seeing this kind of wildlife is more common? And yes, this Topic is not talking about palms, So let's talk about palms! What can I grow in Cairns that I can't in Sunshine coast?

plant ten lipsticks and tell me how many are alive in cairns versus sunny coast following one winter. 

[Yunder Wækraus]

2 hours ago, KrisKupsch said:

sounds like opposite Smithfield ?

Kewarra

[Foxpalms]

On 11/21/2023 at 11:25 AM, tim_brissy_13 said:

 

By the way, I’m biased but I think the true gap in the market is unusual temperate palms. There’s just no growers growing things like Parajubaea, Jubaeopsis, Hedyscepe, Ceroxylon, Jubaea, Brahea, rare Butia and Syagrus etc on any kind of scale. Some people would be willing to pay for these species but unfortunately there’s probably not a huge market. I’ve got about 200 species in my collection in Melbourne and almost none are regularly available anywhere and I rely on seed from overseas or swaps/gifts from others in the palm community. I’d say there’s probably 500-800 species that really just aren’t grown that could do well in the cooler areas. 

That is also true here, every hardware store sells Chrysalidocarpus lutescens and even coconuts however Parajubaea, Jubaeopsis, Hedyscepe, Ceroxylon are extremely hard to find for sale Jubaea you can find for sale but it is still pretty rare.