Liquid fertiliser for palms optimal TDS EC level

[happypalms]

I was wondering does anyone know the optimal EC level for palms obviously some palms require different levels iam after a lower level EC that is suitable for Venturi foliage feeding or just watering with a Venturi just to push the my palms along and help them a bit mainly using organic fertiliser fish emulsion kelp and nitrosol so iam just trying to figure out a good EC level to work with any advice is greatly appreciated thank you 

[Tyrone]

I wish I knew, but I’ve never delved that deep into the actual science of it. I just splash the seasol and power feed into a watering can fill her up with water and water away. If you’re going to fertigate I’d be using the less is more approach, document everything, and up the dosage slowly until you get good results, keeping an eye on sensitive species which might show up damage first. 

[peachy]

I foliar feed with the el cheapo version of seasol mixed with Powerfeed (a fish based thing), potash and a couple of times per year add some trace elements into the mix. They get Rooster Booster (pelletised chookie poos) around the base, even around the edges of the potted ones.  I use a lot of compost and under the mulch I have a layer of old straw from a friends chook run, with their left over products in it. For a couple of days the whole block smells like Werribee on a hot day but it goes away and my palms thrive on it. (mostly)  The extended winter this year knocked around  few of the delicate things but the rest have grown at a rate that I had never seen until I came up with my little brew.  I think EC is mainly needed with hydroponics. For ground planted things just test the PH of the soil as some palms like it more acidic than others.

Professor Peachy 

[happypalms]

3 hours ago, peachy said:

I foliar feed with the el cheapo version of seasol mixed with Powerfeed (a fish based thing), potash and a couple of times per year add some trace elements into the mix. They get Rooster Booster (pelletised chookie poos) around the base, even around the edges of the potted ones.  I use a lot of compost and under the mulch I have a layer of old straw from a friends chook run, with their left over products in it. For a couple of days the whole block smells like Werribee on a hot day but it goes away and my palms thrive on it. (mostly)  The extended winter this year knocked around  few of the delicate things but the rest have grown at a rate that I had never seen until I came up with my little brew.  I think EC is mainly needed with hydroponics. For ground planted things just test the PH of the soil as some palms like it more acidic than others.

Professor Peachy 

Thanks peachy it was for my container palms as I have some in a soilless mix but you can’t beat seasol or kelp extract and the good old dynamic lifter if I was to fertilise my whole garden I would nearly need half a pallet of rooster booster 

[sonoranfans]

read this if you havent already.  https://hydroponic.co.za/hydroponics-quickstart/plant-phecppm/#:~:text=TDS %3D EC reading (in milliSiemens,1000 and divide by 2.&text=This is the measure of,prefer slightly more acid conditions.

[sonoranfans]

Note the part where   "The measurement of EC is in milliSiemens per cm (mS/cm). It is a measurement of the strength of the nutrient solution as a whole and will not tell you if one or more of the nutrient salts is out of balance. Plants take up different nutrient salts at different stages of growth and in different climatic conditions, as well as different pH levels.. The speed that different nutrient salts are taken up also varies. For instance, nitrogen is taken up quite quickly, but calcium is a slow mover! For the home grower it is advisable to change the nutrient solutions at regular intervals, say every week in summer and every two weeks in winter."   It seems that the plant uptake rate over time isnt perfect so nutrients can be out of balance in time.  EC is a crude method for fertilizer concentration in effluent and cannot tell you about whether the fertilizer is well mixed or what the soil conditions are as some nutrients may accumulate(not hydroponic, but soil in pots) while others rinse out depending on the conductivity of the fertilizer.  Well advised to do some long drenches every 3 months int he growing season if you dont have much rain.  

[happypalms]

3 hours ago, sonoranfans said:

Note the part where   "The measurement of EC is in milliSiemens per cm (mS/cm). It is a measurement of the strength of the nutrient solution as a whole and will not tell you if one or more of the nutrient salts is out of balance. Plants take up different nutrient salts at different stages of growth and in different climatic conditions, as well as different pH levels.. The speed that different nutrient salts are taken up also varies. For instance, nitrogen is taken up quite quickly, but calcium is a slow mover! For the home grower it is advisable to change the nutrient solutions at regular intervals, say every week in summer and every two weeks in winter."   It seems that the plant uptake rate over time isnt perfect so nutrients can be out of balance in time.  EC is a crude method for fertilizer concentration in effluent and cannot tell you about whether the fertilizer is well mixed or what the soil conditions are as some nutrients may accumulate(not hydroponic, but soil in pots) while others rinse out depending on the conductivity of the fertilizer.  Well advised to do some long drenches every 3 months int he growing season if you dont have much rain.  

Thanks sonaranfans iam aware of all the conditions and climatic influences it is a tricky balancing act get it right and no problems get it wrong and let’s just say that’s the start of more problems I work on farm with 50 thousand hydroponic container grown blueberries ec and ph play a big role with many variables you have to be aware of I was asking the question more so as I have a soilless mix with Joey palms and Kerriodoxa and after more of a liquid fertiliser there are various liquids available but wanting to mix up my own with trace elements and a NPK balance the agronomists I work with really aren’t sure of what Iam after as every palm is different along with soil soilless mix thanks for your help Richard 

[flplantguy]

I tried to do my own for orchids and tropicals and used a minimal dose each watering with agri-fos brand if I remember right.  It was a precise dosatron injector so the amount was stable.  I did have tap water issues and root tip burn on occasion even then.  And once I mixed two liquid fertilizers that you shouldn't and got silicon as a precipitate. Oops lol

[Tyrone]

3 hours ago, happypalms said:

Thanks sonaranfans iam aware of all the conditions and climatic influences it is a tricky balancing act get it right and no problems get it wrong and let’s just say that’s the start of more problems I work on farm with 50 thousand hydroponic container grown blueberries ec and ph play a big role with many variables you have to be aware of I was asking the question more so as I have a soilless mix with Joey palms and Kerriodoxa and after more of a liquid fertiliser there are various liquids available but wanting to mix up my own with trace elements and a NPK balance the agronomists I work with really aren’t sure of what Iam after as every palm is different along with soil soilless mix thanks for your help Richard 

You’re probably in uncharted territory for palms and hydroponics with Kerrodoxa and Joeys. I once tried a flood and drain system for golden canes in a hothouse up in Perth but it was particularly crude and I didn’t even check the EC once and it worked well. 

[Billeb]

I’m with @Tyroneon this one. Less is more. I use a Dosatron liquid fertilization and initially upon setting up, I noticed my recipe / delivery ratios were too potent causing pretty severe leaf burn and discoloration of leaves. It only effected a few types of trees tho. Turns out some trees are more sensitive than others! Who’da thunk it eh??!? What level of EC am I at? I can likely figure it out but haven’t tried, nor do I care. 
 

I adjusted the settings and where I’ve left it is a very conservative amount. I use GrowMore 20-20-20 and have the Dosatron set to deliver 1:120 ratio. So 1 gal of concentrate mixture to 120 gallons of water thru the siphon valves. My concentrate mixture is at approx 100ppm so that’s only about 7oz of fertilizer per gal. I drip irrigate every 3 days for 30min a station and manually turn the valves to fertilize once every 3 weeks. 
 

-dale 
 

[Darold Petty]

I have good quality municipal water, I use a Dosatron injector with soluble fertilizer at 15-5-15 plus minors, running at 1:100 mix producing 300 ppm of fertilizer for the delivered water. 

 For very small seedlings I use fish emulsion and kelp extract, one or sometimes two tablespoons per gallon of water.  The image is Howea forsteriana.

[Billeb]

1 hour ago, Darold Petty said:

I have good quality municipal water, I use a Dosatron injector with soluble fertilizer at 15-5-15 plus minors, running at 1:100 mix producing 300 ppm of fertilizer for the delivered water. 

 For very small seedlings I use fish emulsion and kelp extract, one or sometimes two tablespoons per gallon of water.  The image is Howea forsteriana.

looks good Darold. 
 

I talked to quite a few growers about this and they all stated a more potent concentrate like 300ppm can be used if it fertilizing potted plants because the water flows thru the bottom and the roots do not sit in fertilizer for a length of time. I think that was my problem so I backed it off to 100ppm and haven’t had any problems in my gardens since. 
 

-dale 

[happypalms]

On 12/1/2023 at 11:07 AM, Tyrone said:

I wish I knew, but I’ve never delved that deep into the actual science of it. I just splash the seasol and power feed into a watering can fill her up with water and water away. If you’re going to fertigate I’d be using the less is more approach, document everything, and up the dosage slowly until you get good results, keeping an eye on sensitive species which might show up damage first. 

Yes I knew it would be a bit tricky the science of it all iam about 150ppm so in between sort of for you and billeb but I do know from my experience a lot of palms are different and can be difficult if you get it wrong chamaedorea palms can be fussy with th3 wrong fertiliser 

[happypalms]

10 hours ago, flplantguy said:

I tried to do my own for orchids and tropicals and used a minimal dose each watering with agri-fos brand if I remember right.  It was a precise dosatron injector so the amount was stable.  I did have tap water issues and root tip burn on occasion even then.  And once I mixed two liquid fertilizers that you shouldn't and got silicon as a precipitate. Oops lol

Iam going to stick with the weaker strength solutions for now and yes certain fertiliser can’t be mixed with others 

[happypalms]

5 hours ago, Darold Petty said:

I have good quality municipal water, I use a Dosatron injector with soluble fertilizer at 15-5-15 plus minors, running at 1:100 mix producing 300 ppm of fertilizer for the delivered water. 

 For very small seedlings I use fish emulsion and kelp extract, one or sometimes two tablespoons per gallon of water.  The image is Howea forsteriana.

Nice kentia darold I fin$ the fish emulsion is best kelp is another good one I also use nitrosol