Tropical Palms / Plants for Mild Oceanic Climate (zone 11a) - Madeira, Portugal

[IlyaIvanov]

We just bought a house with land (800m2 / 0.2 Acres) that is located on Madeira Island (Portugal) in the Atlantic Ocean. My goal is to create a tropical looking garden, but I don't have knowledge of what kind of tropical plants would grow in this kind of climate.

We are located at 460m (1500ft) in the northern part of the island, in the middle of a valley far from the ocean (3.0km) with very little wind. It's a relatively sunny location (when it's not raining) - about 1500mm yearly rainfall. Very high and stable average humidity of: 80%. Winters are very wet and summers are quite dry, but only for two months. The summer starts very late, probably in the middle of the June, and lasts till November. The soil is very good and of volcanic origin.

The lowest recorded temperature was: 6.0°C (43°F), which put's it at zone 11a. The only problem is that it's a very mild climate. I would really appreciate your help with plant names that are okay / do well in this kind of climate. Overall I would compare this climate to Furnas, Azores (Parque Terra Nostra).

12-year meteorological data:

Winter temperature of the coldest month (usually February or March):

Daily Max: 16.1°C

Daily Avg: 12.5°C

Daily Low: 9.8°C

Summer temperature of the warmest month (usually August or September):

Daily Max: 23.1°C

Daily Avg: 19.5°C

Daily Low: 16.2°C

Thanks in advance!

I attached some of the photos of the Garden & View from there:

[ahosey01]

Juania australis or Ceroxylon quindiense or however the hell that's spelled.

Weirdest palms, both of them.  If I had a mild oceanic climate, that's what I'd grow.

[IlyaIvanov]

16 minutes ago, ahosey01 said:

Juania australis or Ceroxylon quindiense or however the hell that's spelled.

Weirdest palms, both of them.  If I had a mild oceanic climate, that's what I'd grow.

Nice! Both of them look great, especially Quindío wax palm, I image it's quite hard to find them in nurseries but I'll try.

[idontknowhatnametuse]

Allagoptera arenaria

Attalea butyracea

Attalea cohune

Bactris gasipaes

Cocos nucifera

Chamaedorea costaricana

Chamaedorea plumosa

Chamaedorea pochutlensis

Sabal mauritiiformis

Sabal yapa

Syagrus schizophylla

Thrinax radiata

 

[andrebazhen]

С новосельем в новом климате! Удачи) 

[IlyaIvanov]

10 minutes ago, idontknowhatnametuse said:

Allagoptera arenaria

Attalea butyracea

Attalea cohune

Bactris gasipaes

Cocos nucifera

Chamaedorea costaricana

Chamaedorea plumosa

Chamaedorea pochutlensis

Sabal mauritiiformis

Sabal yapa

Syagrus schizophylla

Thrinax radiata

 

Awesome list, I really like: Chamaedorea pochutlensis and Thrinax radiata. I see Chamaedorea pochutlensis a lot on Madeira, highest elevation I've seen it growing was at 300m+ alt. And it looked perfect, hopefully it will do fine at 460m. But I am 99% sure Coconut won't grow there, I will try growing it at lower elevation.

Also, do you think Pandanus and Dypsis Lutescens would survive there?

Thanks!

[IlyaIvanov]

4 minutes ago, andrebazhen said:

С новосельем в новом климате! Удачи) 

большое вам спасибо! 

[idontknowhatnametuse]

4 minutes ago, IlyaIvanov said:

Awesome list, I really like: Chamaedorea pochutlensis and Thrinax radiata. I see Chamaedorea pochutlensis a lot on Madeira, highest elevation I've seen it growing was at 300m+ alt. And it looked perfect, hopefully it will do fine at 460m. But I am 99% sure Coconut won't grow there, I will try growing it at lower elevation.

Also, do you think Pandanus and Dypsis Lutescens would survive there?

Thanks!

Yes, they will.

[Zeeth]

Many of the palms on this page should do work for you:

https://www.palmpedia.net/palmsforcal/Category:Palm_Genera

I think if I were in your situation I'd do a few Howea forsteriana, one or more Hawaiian Pritchardia (beccariana is nice), a Roystonea borinquena, a few Chrysalidocarpus‎/Dypsis (saintlucei, 'Orange Crush', baronii var 'black stem', maybe a few others), Wodyetia x Veitchia‎ (if you can find it), Chambeyronia macrocarpa, Cyphophoenix nucele, and some understory stuff like the Chamaedorea, Lytocarium, etc. 

Your daytime highs in winter are too cool for coconut and other true-tropicals but there's a pretty wide variety of stuff you can grow. 

[awkonradi]

Hi Ilya,

I would be curious to see more pictures of your new property and the surroundings, if you would be willing to post them.

Andrei

[bubba]

I apologize for my wayward post! For some reason, I thought you were discussing the Azores! There are gigantic numbers of coconuts on the Madeira Islands, where you are.

I would still also include Howeas because of their beauty and likelihood in enhancing the tropical look that you are looking for.

Edited May 5 by bubba
Brain melt

[dalmatiansoap]

All New Caledonia sp. would thrive there. Me included

 

[IlyaIvanov]

1 hour ago, dalmatiansoap said:

All New Caledonia sp. would thrive there. Me included

 

I'd love to visit New Caledonia it's like stepping back in time. One of the most unique places on earth. I will 100% try growing a Chambeyronia macrocarpa!

[IlyaIvanov]

3 hours ago, bubba said:

I apologize for my wayward post! For some reason, I thought you were discussing the Azores! There are gigantic numbers of coconuts on the Madeira Islands, where you are.

I would still also include Howeas because of their beauty and likelihood in enhancing the tropical look that you are looking for.

Howea is a must! they also do extremely well here.

[IlyaIvanov]

3 hours ago, Zeeth said:

Many of the palms on this page should do work for you:

https://www.palmpedia.net/palmsforcal/Category:Palm_Genera

I think if I were in your situation I'd do a few Howea forsteriana, one or more Hawaiian Pritchardia (beccariana is nice), a Roystonea borinquena, a few Chrysalidocarpus‎/Dypsis (saintlucei, 'Orange Crush', baronii var 'black stem', maybe a few others), Wodyetia x Veitchia‎ (if you can find it), Chambeyronia macrocarpa, Cyphophoenix nucele, and some understory stuff like the Chamaedorea, Lytocarium, etc. 

Your daytime highs in winter are too cool for coconut and other true-tropicals but there's a pretty wide variety of stuff you can grow. 

Thanks a lot! I would love to have more of a Lush Hawaiian vibe there, especially where our house is located in terms of landscape It's very similar (no wonder because both archipelago are shield volcanoes over about 5 million years old) the view from our house/garden is looking at the oldest part of the island (the photos I included), it's also the only place they found Limestone.

And yes I am aware that I wont be able to grow Coconut here. Fortunately we have a second land at much lower elevation (135m) and closer to the ocean. The coldest month averages +19°C during the day. And in warmest month it's +27°C. That's like borderline for a Coconut, so I must try!

 

I also found an amazing garden, that has similar climate but they have a risk of freeze there. It's in Auckland NZ. So this is kind of what I am going for.

[IlyaIvanov]

4 hours ago, awkonradi said:

Hi Ilya,

I would be curious to see more pictures of your new property and the surroundings, if you would be willing to post them.

Andrei

For sure! working on it

[IlyaIvanov]

5 hours ago, awkonradi said:

Hi Ilya,

I would be curious to see more pictures of your new property and the surroundings, if you would be willing to post them.

Andrei

Nothing extraordinary, but we're happy. (price was 190 000 € / 205 000 $)

No need for major renovation, just lot's of work with the garden, which I am looking forward to, I will probably make a YouTube channel and post our progress there.

Oh and they let us keep furniture as well.

We will need to get rid of the vineyards, which is sad but we're not farmers.

[Cluster]

I will be following your project! Good luck and congratulations, keep us updated on both gardens!

[IlyaIvanov]

28 minutes ago, Cluster said:

I will be following your project! Good luck and congratulations, keep us updated on both gardens!

Thanks a lot! I definitely will. 👍

Here are more photos from all over Madeira:

[Tassie_Troy1971]

All the palms I grow lord Howe Island Howea Hedyscepe, Leppidorachis 

Rhopalostylis species

Parajubaea,  Jubaea 

Dypsis baronii and others 

Ceroxylon 

All chameadorea species

[IlyaIvanov]

19 minutes ago, Tassie_Troy1971 said:

All the palms I grow lord Howe Island Howea Hedyscepe, Leppidorachis 

Rhopalostylis species

Parajubaea,  Jubaea 

Dypsis baronii and others 

Ceroxylon 

All chameadorea species

Thanks for the recommendations, I really like: Hedyscepe canterburyana, LHI Howea, Dypsis species, Ceroxylon, Chameadorea

Very cool that you can grow these in Tasmania, I was always interested about your island. Also a big fan of Dicksonia Antartica.

What is the lowest temp you guys had there? How did the palms handle it?

[PalmCode]

Clinostigma savoryanum would be a great choice. 

[IlyaIvanov]

Update; I came back to Madeira to work on the House & Garden and I already have got new plants.

Plumeria (1.8m with the pot) for 60 euros. In Paraíso Resiliente (they don't have any website or prices, and it has been very hard to get these plants since the owner isn't here and his friend had to send him pictures to get a price estimate... Another one is Areca Catechu - but I am not 100% sure (65cm trunk) for 80 euros.

Both of these were... not in a good state, underwatered, bad soil, leaning to the side, etc... But they were much cheaper than other plant shops in Madeira, with good care they will look great. They also have 2m tall Chambeyronia macrocarpa for 180 euros, I wanted to buy it, but I am still not sure because it's a little expensive for me. Is it a fair price? Let me know.

Strelitzias (Nicolai), Heliconias (Rostrata, Bihai) from Santana - each one for just 3.50 euros (they told me that even Bihai grows really well in Santana, which surprised me), so it shouldn't be a problem at my location, which turned out to be warmer than I expected after asking local gardener what winter is temps are like, he said its around 18°C during the day at night around 12°C)

this August has been quite warm and humid & very strong sun (70-80% humidity during the day), daily max is around 25-28°C and night lows of 18-22°C. With occasional rainfall, great for the plants though.

And right now I am looking for Royal poinciana (Flamboiã), so that it can already grow and get established before the winter. And some palms such as Dypsis Lutescens, Archontophoenix Cunninghamiana, Cocos, etc...

[Pargomad]

On 8/30/2024 at 4:33 PM, IlyaIvanov said:

Update; I came back to Madeira to work on the House & Garden and I already have got new plants.

Plumeria (1.8m with the pot) for 60 euros. In Paraíso Resiliente (they don't have any website or prices, and it has been very hard to get these plants since the owner isn't here and his friend had to send him pictures to get a price estimate... Another one is Areca Catechu - but I am not 100% sure (65cm trunk) for 80 euros.

Both of these were... not in a good state, underwatered, bad soil, leaning to the side, etc... But they were much cheaper than other plant shops in Madeira, with good care they will look great. They also have 2m tall Chambeyronia macrocarpa for 180 euros, I wanted to buy it, but I am still not sure because it's a little expensive for me. Is it a fair price? Let me know.

Strelitzias (Nicolai), Heliconias (Rostrata, Bihai) from Santana - each one for just 3.50 euros (they told me that even Bihai grows really well in Santana, which surprised me), so it shouldn't be a problem at my location, which turned out to be warmer than I expected after asking local gardener what winter is temps are like, he said its around 18°C during the day at night around 12°C)

this August has been quite warm and humid & very strong sun (70-80% humidity during the day), daily max is around 25-28°C and night lows of 18-22°C. With occasional rainfall, great for the plants though.

And right now I am looking for Royal poinciana (Flamboiã), so that it can already grow and get established before the winter. And some palms such as Dypsis Lutescens, Archontophoenix Cunninghamiana, Cocos, etc...

Awesome! I think your palm tree looks more like a Ptychosperma elegans to me. 

[tim_brissy_13]

From the temperature range you’ve listed, you’ve got an awesome palm growing climate to grow many palms included many of the most sought after and unusual species. 
 

Others have already mentioned the Lord Howe Island species,, Juania, Chamaedorea and Ceroxylon species and Hawaiian Pritchardia. I’d add many of the mid to high elevation Geonoma, Pinanga, Lanonia, Euterpe and Prestoea species and basically any New Caledonian palm you can get your hands on. I would think Dictyocaryum would love it there too. Your temperature averages are similar to Northland in New Zealand and that region has some of the most lush palms I’ve seen. Many Chrysalidocarpus sp, all Archontophoenix sp and countless others would be good choice too.