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Phoenix Sylvestris

Borosbobo

By Borosbobo
in DISCUSSING PALM TREES WORLDWIDE

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Borosbobo Collaborator

Borosbobo

Posted
Posted

Hey!

In Indonesia I took photos of some Phoenix palms. I might be wrong but Im pretty sure these are Phoenix Sylvestris palms. Few months ago I bought a diamond cut Phoenix Sylvestris from Spain. My question is that why are my palm's leaves not silver like in Indonesia but yellow? Will it turn silver later? Due to the lack of humidity will they stay yellow? Or is mine palm not a Sylvestris?
I know my picture is not that great I will try to take a better picture but the leaves are not silver at all they are light green and yellow

Thank you!
 

448417761_1399504834083333_5556220757482448765_n.jpg

448401736_442129055273220_6451626628660420399_n.jpg

mnorell Veteran

mnorell

Posted
Posted

I think the Indonesian palms are likely P. dactylifera. P. sylvestris does often have an orange cast, but there appears to be some natural variation in this species. I used to grow a form marketed as "v. robusta" that had a more glaucous leaf-color...and which may or may not have been a stable cultivar, possibly a hybrid. Since hybridization is a big problem in Phoenix, unless you're getting seed from native stands in India/South Asia, anything is a bit of a gamble. Appearance on this species can be quite variable between dry vs. humid, cool vs. tropical climates. In humid tropical areas, P. sylvestris is quite a standout because it can develop a highly extended (vertically) crown that I have never seen in any other species in the genus.

Please tell us that you are not attempting to grow this species in Hungary!

  • Like 1

Michael Norell

Rancho Mirage, California | 33°44' N 116°25' W | 287 ft | z10a | avg Jan 43/70F | Jul 78/108F avg | Weather Station KCARANCH310

previously Big Pine Key, Florida | 24°40' N 81°21' W | 4.5 ft. | z12a | Calcareous substrate | avg annual min. approx 52F | avg Jan 65/75F | Jul 83/90 | extreme min approx 41F

previously Natchez, Mississippi | 31°33' N 91°24' W | 220 ft.| z9a | Downtown/river-adjacent | Loess substrate | avg annual min. 23F | Jan 43/61F | Jul 73/93F | extreme min 2.5F (1899); previously Los Angeles, California (multiple locations)

Borosbobo Collaborator

Borosbobo

Posted
  • Author
Posted
18 hours ago, mnorell said:

I think the Indonesian palms are likely P. dactylifera. P. sylvestris does often have an orange cast, but there appears to be some natural variation in this species. I used to grow a form marketed as "v. robusta" that had a more glaucous leaf-color...and which may or may not have been a stable cultivar, possibly a hybrid. Since hybridization is a big problem in Phoenix, unless you're getting seed from native stands in India/South Asia, anything is a bit of a gamble. Appearance on this species can be quite variable between dry vs. humid, cool vs. tropical climates. In humid tropical areas, P. sylvestris is quite a standout because it can develop a highly extended (vertically) crown that I have never seen in any other species in the genus.

Please tell us that you are not attempting to grow this species in Hungary!

Thank you so much for this detailed info!

 

Well I do keep these types of palms in Hungary!

but when it comes to winter protection I do a great job of protecting my palms so far!

Lot of people keep P.Canariensis in Hungary and they all do well with heated protection. I have P.Canariensis, Butia Capitata, Brahea Armata, Washington Robusta, Syagrus Romanzoffiana, Sabal Palmetto and lots of cycas varieties. So far they all survived our winters with different type of winter protections. Hopefully this P.Sylvestris will do well. I will try my best to keep it alive! :) 
 

 

IMG_8047.jpeg

SeanK Grand Master

SeanK

Posted
Posted
19 hours ago, mnorell said:

I think the Indonesian palms are likely P. dactylifera. P. sylvestris does often have an orange cast, but there appears to be some natural variation in this species. I used to grow a form marketed as "v. robusta" that had a more glaucous leaf-color...and which may or may not have been a stable cultivar, possibly a hybrid. Since hybridization is a big problem in Phoenix, unless you're getting seed from native stands in India/South Asia, anything is a bit of a gamble. Appearance on this species can be quite variable between dry vs. humid, cool vs. tropical climates. In humid tropical areas, P. sylvestris is quite a standout because it can develop a highly extended (vertically) crown that I have never seen in any other species in the genus.

Please tell us that you are not attempting to grow this species in Hungary!

Orange petiole bases are an identifying characteristic of P.sylvestris. I am inclined to agree that these look more like dactylifera. They're s bit over-trimmed so I can't be sure from the pics.

  • Like 1
njpalmguy Enthusiast

njpalmguy

Posted
Posted
On 6/19/2024 at 8:50 AM, Borosbobo said:

Hey!

In Indonesia I took photos of some Phoenix palms. I might be wrong but Im pretty sure these are Phoenix Sylvestris palms. Few months ago I bought a diamond cut Phoenix Sylvestris from Spain. My question is that why are my palm's leaves not silver like in Indonesia but yellow? Will it turn silver later? Due to the lack of humidity will they stay yellow? Or is mine palm not a Sylvestris?
I know my picture is not that great I will try to take a better picture but the leaves are not silver at all they are light green and yellow

Thank you!
 

448417761_1399504834083333_5556220757482448765_n.jpg

448401736_442129055273220_6451626628660420399_n.jpg

first of all, WOW, second of all, I can’t grow sylvesters because i live in New Jersey 😭 im more interested in trachys, needles, sabals, sabal minors, but good luck growing that!!!!

  • Like 1
mnorell Veteran

mnorell

Posted
Posted
5 hours ago, Borosbobo said:

Thank you so much for this detailed info!

 

Well I do keep these types of palms in Hungary!

but when it comes to winter protection I do a great job of protecting my palms so far!

Lot of people keep P.Canariensis in Hungary and they all do well with heated protection. I have P.Canariensis, Butia Capitata, Brahea Armata, Washington Robusta, Syagrus Romanzoffiana, Sabal Palmetto and lots of cycas varieties. So far they all survived our winters with different type of winter protections. Hopefully this P.Sylvestris will do well. I will try my best to keep it alive! :) 
 

 

IMG_8047.jpeg

All I can say is congratulations, your garden is very attractive and seems quite healthy. I imagined you must have a vacation home on the coast in Croatia! I have seen first-hand the Trachycarpus growing in Plovdiv, Bulgaria, but this is very impressive to me. When I lived in a frosty area of the U.S. (Mississippi) my experience was that the form of P. sylvestris I was growing was about as hardy as a mule palm, certainly hardier than a queen but a bit more tender than the Butia I had. And not quite as bud-hardy as Washingtonia robusta. And definitely would die in the low teens F whereas P. canariensis can easily re-sprout from lower temperatures. Where are you located in Hungary? I assume a warmer area...but I imagine one would have to use heating cables there since the ground must freeze for the entire winter where you are, am I correct? 

  • Like 1

Michael Norell

Rancho Mirage, California | 33°44' N 116°25' W | 287 ft | z10a | avg Jan 43/70F | Jul 78/108F avg | Weather Station KCARANCH310

previously Big Pine Key, Florida | 24°40' N 81°21' W | 4.5 ft. | z12a | Calcareous substrate | avg annual min. approx 52F | avg Jan 65/75F | Jul 83/90 | extreme min approx 41F

previously Natchez, Mississippi | 31°33' N 91°24' W | 220 ft.| z9a | Downtown/river-adjacent | Loess substrate | avg annual min. 23F | Jan 43/61F | Jul 73/93F | extreme min 2.5F (1899); previously Los Angeles, California (multiple locations)

Borosbobo Collaborator

Borosbobo

Posted
  • Author
Posted
18 hours ago, njpalmguy said:

first of all, WOW, second of all, I can’t grow sylvesters because i live in New Jersey 😭 im more interested in trachys, needles, sabals, sabal minors, but good luck growing that!!!!

Thank you! Those are beautiful palms as well!

 

Borosbobo Collaborator

Borosbobo

Posted
  • Author
Posted
17 hours ago, mnorell said:

All I can say is congratulations, your garden is very attractive and seems quite healthy. I imagined you must have a vacation home on the coast in Croatia! I have seen first-hand the Trachycarpus growing in Plovdiv, Bulgaria, but this is very impressive to me. When I lived in a frosty area of the U.S. (Mississippi) my experience was that the form of P. sylvestris I was growing was about as hardy as a mule palm, certainly hardier than a queen but a bit more tender than the Butia I had. And not quite as bud-hardy as Washingtonia robusta. And definitely would die in the low teens F whereas P. canariensis can easily re-sprout from lower temperatures. Where are you located in Hungary? I assume a warmer area...but I imagine one would have to use heating cables there since the ground must freeze for the entire winter where you are, am I correct? 

Thank you so much!

Trachycarpus here in Hungary is very common. But we have a little palm community on facebook where we share our experiences and lot of people keep different species of palms luckly. 
Many hungarians believe that Sabal Palmetto palms are not cold hardy. But if I know this right they are almost as hardy as Trachycarpus. We just bought a 3 meter high Palmetto and I will let the hungarians know that it is cold hardy! :) 

 

I live in Balatonfüred and yes Balaton area is a bit warmer than other parts of Hungary. And yes for some species we use heating cables (first a veil foil then the heating cables and then a cover sheet) and for some we just put a cover sheet and nothing else. (Sorry I don’t really know if these are the exact names for them in english)

 

In 2 or 3 weeks I plan to post some pictures of our garden :) 

  • Like 1
palmofmyhand Enthusiast

palmofmyhand

Posted
Posted
On 6/20/2024 at 6:27 AM, Borosbobo said:

Thank you so much for this detailed info!

 

Well I do keep these types of palms in Hungary!

but when it comes to winter protection I do a great job of protecting my palms so far!

Lot of people keep P.Canariensis in Hungary and they all do well with heated protection. I have P.Canariensis, Butia Capitata, Brahea Armata, Washington Robusta, Syagrus Romanzoffiana, Sabal Palmetto and lots of cycas varieties. So far they all survived our winters with different type of winter protections. Hopefully this P.Sylvestris will do well. I will try my best to keep it alive! :) 
 

 

IMG_8047.jpeg

 

On 6/20/2024 at 6:27 AM, Borosbobo said:

Thank you so much for this detailed info!

 

Well I do keep these types of palms in Hungary!

but when it comes to winter protection I do a great job of protecting my palms so far!

Lot of people keep P.Canariensis in Hungary and they all do well with heated protection. I have P.Canariensis, Butia Capitata, Brahea Armata, Washington Robusta, Syagrus Romanzoffiana, Sabal Palmetto and lots of cycas varieties. So far they all survived our winters with different type of winter protections. Hopefully this P.Sylvestris will do well. I will try my best to keep it alive! :) 
 

 

IMG_8047.jpeg

If you don’t mind me asking, what kind of winter protection do you provide for these palms? I love to see you growing phoenix in hungary zone 7.

  • Like 1
Borosbobo Collaborator

Borosbobo

Posted
  • Author
Posted
13 hours ago, palmofmyhand said:

 

If you don’t mind me asking, what kind of winter protection do you provide for these palms? I love to see you growing phoenix in hungary zone 7.

First we put a veil foil then the heating cables and then a cover sheet. Winters are not that tough here in Balaton so we just have to cover these palms for 2 or 3 months. 
 

Few streets away there is an unfinished house and he bought 2 phoenix c 2 trachycarpus and 2 washington robustas. He doesn’t care about them and never put winter protection on them. Some died but surprisingly one date palm is thriving there. It’s the 5. year for them and we had time when the temperature went below 0 C°. It’s sad to see those palms but well what can you do

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