chamaedorea Can Chamaedorea radicalis be put in a full sun position in Texas?

[Dwarf Fan]

I am considering transplanting a trunking variety that is very established, (purchased at around 4’ tall) now about 6’ tall and has adapted to dappled Texas sun for over a year’s time.

In about a week I am considering moving it to a full sun position with NO shade. I am on the Gulf Coast as my location states. Will my radicals be able to adapt over time and still produce rich green fronds or will yellowing be a consistent problem during the summer months?

[Ben G.]

I don't have an exact answer for you. I have an anecdote though. I have a non-trunking radicalis that sits on the southeast side of my home and gets sun from sunrise until about 2 pm. Here is what it looks like today:

 

[Las Palmas Norte]

Even Palmpedia doesn't mention sun exposure in it's detailed description of this palm. I somehow think this palm may not perform as well in daylong hot searing sun. You maybe in a location with some moderating and added humidity to mitigate extremes.

Chamaedorea radicalis - Palmpedia - Palm Grower's Guide

[Laaz]

They eventually grow in to full sun & do well. This is one of mine, it is now over 8 ft tall & doing great.  

[Fusca]

7 hours ago, Dwarf Fan said:

I am considering transplanting a trunking variety that is very established, (purchased at around 4’ tall) now about 6’ tall and has adapted to dappled Texas sun for over a year’s time.

In about a week I am considering moving it to a full sun position with NO shade. I am on the Gulf Coast as my location states. Will my radicals be able to adapt over time and still produce rich green fronds or will yellowing be a consistent problem during the summer months?

It's a good question as full sun here is different than full sun in Tennessee.  I believe that @amh has some performing well in full sun north of San Antonio.  I believe most if not all of mine here are the non-trunking type and all but one are in half day shade.  I did plant one seedling on the north side of my house that is in mostly full sun during the heat of summer and just recently is getting a few hours less sun due to the change in the angle of the sun.  It rarely gets watered (I tend to forget about it) but it looks pretty decent considering.  I would hesitate moving one into full sun if it was my only one but if you have others it will probably be fine if you slowly acclimate it to the new conditions.

 

[Arecaceus]

Well I can't tell you much about Texas sun but just for an impression. I wasn't sure when I planted one of the trunking form ones either and after all research I decided to put it in partial shade even at my latitude (Idk if it makes a difference). It will eventually get full sun when it's bigger. It seems growing well. My guess is that younger ones are more sensitive to sun burn than older ones.

[RFun]

That palm would need adequate water in full sun.  Also, a lime-rich soil amendment wouldn't hurt things. 

[Chester B]

I planted 4 this year. 2 in part shade and 2 in technically full sun but get shade in the late afternoon and evening. Marked difference between the two groups. The shade ones which are in quite dry soil due to live oak canopy are dark green and grow faster. The ones in more sun are yellow and very slow even with regular/frequent  watering. I even had to move one to a spot that got some shade from larger plants because I knew it was just a matter of time before it kicked the bucket. 
 

Full sun Texas - No Way. 
 

 

[Swolte]

48 minutes ago, Chester B said:

I planted 4 this year. 2 in part shade and 2 in technically full sun but get shade in the late afternoon and evening. Marked difference between the two groups. The shade ones which are in quite dry soil due to live oak canopy are dark green and grow faster. The ones in more sun are yellow and very slow even with regular/frequent  watering. I even had to move one to a spot that got some shade from larger plants because I knew it was just a matter of time before it kicked the bucket. 
 

Full sun Texas - No Way. 

I have one planted that gets full afternoon sun. I figured it would do better in shade so I planted it next to a young live oak. Unfortunately, it takes a while before Live oaks grow a canopy so the first few years I protected it from sun using a shade cloth. I kinda forgot to do that the last 2 years and its doing OK-ish. Not showing much growth at all but not as much yellowing as I would have expected either (perhaps because its more established than at @Chester B). Mine is still barely a foot tall but given it went through the hell that was the past 5 years in Texas, I'd say its quite a miracle palm. 

[Dwarf Fan]

It sounds like it would be better to go with an alternate dappled sun position instead of full sun, if I want it to look it’s best and not have it struggle as much. Thanks Texas Palm Talkers!

[Dwarf Fan]

Here are the action shots of the move. My radicalis was originally shaded in dappled sunlight next to my Seabreeze Bamboo, but the Bamboo grew in quickly and crowded out my radicals and it was fighting for root space and sunlight so it had to move it.

[Robert Cade Ross]

I had one in part sun would love to share it today but the recent freeze completely killed it lol  19° 😐

[MarcusH]

On 8/29/2024 at 10:48 PM, Robert Cade Ross said:

I had one in part sun would love to share it today but the recent freeze completely killed it lol  19° 😐

19° ? I guess I'll pass . I was thinking about planting some but temperatures in the upper teens are very common in SA.  Would have been some nice palms in between the house and fence.  

[MarcusH]

On 8/26/2024 at 11:41 AM, Dwarf Fan said:

Here are the action shots of the move. My radicalis was originally shaded in dappled sunlight next to my Seabreeze Bamboo, but the Bamboo grew in quickly and crowded out my radicals and it was fighting for root space and sunlight so it had to move it.

I'm telling you buddy the sun is definitely no joke in Texas it literally wants to eat everything alive.  Joke aside , I would assume with many other things we plant in the yard is that young plants are sensitive to full sun and HEAT . It takes years for some species to acclimatize .  I can always tell by planting other plants that the first year in the ground is the toughest.  You're growing palms that aren't native to Texas. It takes them a while to adjust , if they adjust! Gardening in Texas is tough if you try something others don't have in the area. 

[Fusca]

 

On 8/29/2024 at 10:48 PM, Robert Cade Ross said:

I had one in part sun would love to share it today but the recent freeze completely killed it lol  19° 😐

Was yours planted in 2023 seeing 19°F in its first winter in the ground?  This is when they're most vulnerable to freezes - especially young palms.  It was probably out in the open also.  I had 9 out of 10 survive 9°F in February 2021 with no protection but they had been in the ground 3 years.

[Fusca]

Here's one of the survivors of 2021 - it's the non-trunking type and only gets about 3 hours of sun.  It was successfully moved from San Antonio in 2022.  It's currently flowering with 2 female inflorescences but no others are flowering yet.

[Robert Cade Ross]

2 hours ago, Fusca said:

 

Was yours planted in 2023 seeing 19°F in its first winter in the ground?  This is when they're most vulnerable to freezes - especially young palms.  It was probably out in the open also.  I had 9 out of 10 survive 9°F in February 2021 with no protection but they had been in the ground 3 years.

Planted in an evergreen microclimate and still fried to death I gave it two months and the entire plant was rotted 😐 . 
 

peep the Microspadix I’m growing instead:) 

[Fusca]

14 hours ago, Robert Cade Ross said:

Planted in an evergreen microclimate and still fried to death I gave it two months and the entire plant was rotted 😐 . 
 

peep the Microspadix I’m growing instead:) 

That looks like Chamaedorea cataractarum which would explain why it carked at 19°F.  C. radicalis is a solitary palm while cataractarum is clustering.  They do look very similar.  Nice work with the microspadix - they're very cold hardy also but not as much as radicalis.

[Robert Cade Ross]

9 minutes ago, Fusca said:

That looks like Chamaedorea cataractarum which would explain why it carked at 19°F.  C. radicalis is a solitary palm while cataractarum is clustering.  They do look very similar.  Nice work with the microspadix - they're very cold hardy also but not as much as radicalis.

I guess the label was incorrect then lol ty . 

[amh]

I have found that plants that are 1 year or older can handle full sun without any damage, but the trunks will be more robust and the leaves will be shorter than a plant grown in shade or partial shade. I do not know the cold tolerance yet, but the 3 plants that I had in the ground over last winter survived 9F without any protection.

Chamaedorea microspadix is sensitive to dissolved minerals in the water and is a strictly shade or part shade plant in south Texas.

[Chester B]

The two radicalis that I have that get afternoon shade are starting to look better and a little more green.  The shrubs and other plants around them have grown considerably so are casting a lot more shade on them.

[amh]

3 hours ago, Chester B said:

The two radicalis that I have that get afternoon shade are starting to look better and a little more green.  The shrubs and other plants around them have grown considerably so are casting a lot more shade on them.

Every plant will enjoy afternoon shade in Texas, an open, south facing planting can even kill cactus.

[Chester B]

3 minutes ago, amh said:

Every plant will enjoy afternoon shade in Texas, an open, south facing planting can even kill cactus.

The few Sabals I planted this year seem to be thriving with no shade.  But I get your point.  I have had a lot of burn on other things that have had to be shifted around.

I keep hearing the phrase  "There is full sun and then there is Texas full sun"

[amh]

12 minutes ago, Chester B said:

The few Sabals I planted this year seem to be thriving with no shade.  But I get your point.  I have had a lot of burn on other things that have had to be shifted around.

The rain and humidity of Houston help, a lot. Most plants will need protection for their first year, but I have found that sabals, braheas, nannorrhops and Jubaeas can handle the sun, but chamaedorea radicalis needs to be acclimated.

On a related note, I have found that Chamaedorea oblongata is surprisingly heat and sun tolerant.

[Chester B]

3 hours ago, amh said:

The rain and humidity of Houston help, a lot. Most plants will need protection for their first year, but I have found that sabals, braheas, nannorrhops and Jubaeas can handle the sun, but chamaedorea radicalis needs to be acclimated.

On a related note, I have found that Chamaedorea oblongata is surprisingly heat and sun tolerant.

I have one of the Butia x Jubaea hybrids and it growing downright fast now.  That is one palm that I do not water.

[amh]

47 minutes ago, Chester B said:

I have one of the Butia x Jubaea hybrids and it growing downright fast now.  That is one palm that I do not water.

Unfortunately, I only have one Butia X Jubaea too. I had ordered some hybrid and standard Jubaea seed last winter and have noticed that the hybrid is a rocket, so far as cold hardy palms are concerned.