Can anyone ID what a Washingtonia Fayetteville is?

[gdumea]

And is it an actual zone 7b palm?

[Chester B]

You should do a search on here, you will see pics of the palm and i think a whole topic related to that tree.  

[EJPalm05]

That's my listing!

[jwitt]

It is a seed/plant from a hybrid washingtonia located in Fayetteville NC.  As mentioned, there is a topic in the cold hardy section of Palmtalk. 

I think collecting seeds now at the washie at Taco Bell in Roswell or in Carlsbad would accomplish the same goal.  You will have true leaves before fall if planted in place next  spring.  They are that fast. 

[gdumea]

  On 12/3/2024 at 5:37 PM, jwitt said:

It is a seed/plant from a hybrid washingtonia located in Fayetteville NC.  As mentioned, there is a topic in the cold hardy section of Palmtalk. 

I think collecting seeds now at the washie at Taco Bell in Roswell or in Carlsbad would accomplish the same goal.  You will have true leaves before fall if planted in place next  spring.  They are that fast. 

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I think that Washie at Taco Bell is completely dead.

[EJPalm05]

 

[Las Palmas Norte]

I'm experimenting with several of these on Vancouver Island zone 8a/b.

 

[gdumea]

  On 12/3/2024 at 7:15 PM, Las Palmas Norte said:

I'm experimenting with several of these on Vancouver Island zone 8a/b.

 

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Beautiful palm, I bought 2 saplings, how long to that size?

[ZPalms]

  On 12/3/2024 at 7:15 PM, Las Palmas Norte said:

I'm experimenting with several of these on Vancouver Island zone 8a/b.

 

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Very beautiful, Ive noticed these palms from bragg blvd have such a nice green color and the growing pattern is pretty nice as well. Not sure if thats just coincidence of timing and soil nutrients available. 🤠

[Fusca]

  On 12/3/2024 at 5:30 PM, EJPalm05 said:

That's my listing!

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Why not include "NC" in the title - there's dozens of towns named Fayetteville.  And saying it's zone 7 hardy can be misleading since the parent palm is in zone 8.  Maybe the parent palm survived a freakish zone 7 type low temperature once but it might not survive that temperature multiple times like it would in zone 7.  Maybe it would, but hard to say for sure.  It would be safer to say that the parent palm survived x° temperature. 

[jwitt]

  On 12/3/2024 at 7:15 PM, Las Palmas Norte said:

I'm experimenting with several of these on Vancouver Island zone 8a/b.

 

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I like the look of yours! Maybe a good cross for your climate.  I like the fattening of the leaf bases and trunk. 

[Las Palmas Norte]

  On 12/3/2024 at 8:22 PM, gdumea said:

Beautiful palm, I bought 2 saplings, how long to that size?

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These are 30" tall from seed 3 growing seasons ago.

[Jonathan]

Keep in mind that collecting seed from an F1 cross will not necessarily result in plants with the same characteristics as the parent...the next generation could potentially throw back to either parent species type. Or not. 

[Fusca]

Based on this, 1/2 F2 seedlings resemble the F1 parent.

[tarnado]

  On 12/3/2024 at 5:30 PM, EJPalm05 said:

That's my listing!

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Looks like you mist have sold out!

[tarnado]

  On 12/3/2024 at 7:15 PM, Las Palmas Norte said:

I'm experimenting with several of these on Vancouver Island zone 8a/b.

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Las Palmas Norte - what is the soil situation amd drainage for these beautiful Washies? 

[Las Palmas Norte]

  On 12/5/2024 at 12:19 PM, tarnado said:

Las Palmas Norte - what is the soil situation amd drainage for these beautiful Washies? 

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This one (in above photos) is planted in course gravelly type medium, & top dressed with small aggregate, so reasonably good drainage. I can only assume this was brought in as part of the landscaping prior to our ownership. Once the roots reach deep enough they'll contact the backfill that was used during the site prep for the build. 

Another is in a raised planting area and a third is growing in the muck (as I call it).

[jwitt]

  On 12/4/2024 at 10:10 PM, Fusca said:

Based on this, 1/2 F2 seedlings resemble the F1 parent.

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What if momma f1 is a homophradite? Serious, true question. 

[Fusca]

  On 12/5/2024 at 7:36 PM, jwitt said:

What if momma f1 is a homophradite? Serious, true question. 

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Washingtonia are monecious - I'm not sure if any palms are hermaphrodites.  It does make the chance of creating a natural hybrid less I imagine.  But I don't think it changes the probabilities of the F2 characteristics.

[jwitt]

My understanding was washingtonia are monecious(meaning both sexes)and they can self pollinate.  The definition of monecious can mean hermaphrodite. 

So if a f1 washingtonia self pollinated(momma pollinated itself) without another bloomer within a hundred miles, would the offspring(f2) stay mostly true to the mother plant? 

[Fusca]

  On 12/5/2024 at 11:27 PM, jwitt said:

So if a f1 washingtonia self pollinated (momma pollinated itself) without another bloomer within a hundred miles, would the offspring(f2) stay mostly true to the mother plant? 

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From what I understand in your scenario 50% of the F2 seedlings would resemble the parent F1 (filibusta), 25% would resemble filifera and 25% would resemble robusta.  Because of the ease of hybridization with Washingtonia there aren't many "pure" robusta or filifera around here (or "pure" F1 hybrids).  Maybe it's different in your neck of the woods.

[jwitt]

  On 12/6/2024 at 1:54 AM, Fusca said:

From what I understand in your scenario 50% of the F2 seedlings would resemble the parent F1 (filibusta), 25% would resemble filifera and 25% would resemble robusta.  Because of the ease of hybridization with Washingtonia there aren't many "pure" robusta or filifera around here (or "pure" F1 hybrids).  Maybe it's different in your neck of the woods.

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Yeah I was actually talking about a specific palm. This palm bloomed, set seed(self pollinated) with no other palms for miles upon miles.  Absolutely no cross pollination with another palm.  

Would the offspring still follow the 50/25/25 or more an almost clone of the  f1 parent? Something I have wondered. 

Blooming washingtonia are exceptionally rare in my locale. Blooming robusta do not exist. 

 

[tarnado]

  On 12/6/2024 at 2:06 AM, jwitt said:

Would the offspring still follow the 50/25/25 or more an almost clone of the  f1 parent?

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I don't think it works quite like that - the 25/50/25 ratios work for specific genes in an F2 cross. But then multiply those probabilities across all the genes that are guiding the plants' growth, and it becomes much more interesting! Also, this tree itself might not even be an F1!

[jwitt]

  On 12/6/2024 at 2:15 AM, tarnado said:

I don't think it works quite like that - the 25/50/25 ratios work for specific genes in an F2 cross. But then multiply those probabilities across all the genes that are guiding the plants' growth, and it becomes much more interesting! Also, this tree itself might not even be an F1!

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Thank you and @Fusca..

So a box of chocolates sort of thingy.  I am simple minded, sorry. 

[Fusca]

  On 12/6/2024 at 2:15 AM, tarnado said:

Also, this tree itself might not even be an F1!

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Exactly, I was just about to make that point.  @jwitt, who's to say that the palm you're referring to isn't an F5 or F6?  But I would think that if the hybrid palm is filifera dominant the majority of seedlings should also be filifera dominant.

[jwitt]

  On 12/6/2024 at 2:33 AM, Fusca said:

Exactly, I was just about to make that point.  @jwitt, who's to say that the palm you're referring to isn't an F5 or F6?  But I would think that if the hybrid palm is filifera dominant the majority of seedlings should also be filifera dominant.

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Got ya! That is kind of what I have seen with 2 separate examples.  I truly could be on f15 for all I know.  Thank you!

[Dwarf Fan]

  On 12/6/2024 at 2:38 AM, jwitt said:

Got ya! That is kind of what I have seen with 2 separate examples.  I truly could be on f15 for all I know.  Thank you!

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There is no F15, hybrids stop at F7. If a hybrid is stable at F7 it is considered true beeding.

[tarnado]

  On 12/5/2024 at 7:02 PM, Las Palmas Norte said:

third is growing in the muck (as I call it).

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Cool - and how does the growth of these differ?

[Las Palmas Norte]

  On 12/6/2024 at 9:47 AM, tarnado said:

Cool - and how does the growth of these differ?

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It's too early in the game to know.